Top 10 reasons why JWs don't have the truth - please contribute

by oldlightnewshite 172 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • oldlightnewshite
    oldlightnewshite

    I thought it would be an interesting exercise to ask everybody on here what their 'top 10 reasons why JWs don't have the truth' actually were. Maybe we can see some correlating views/patterns/ideas that may help us de-programme the newbies that come on this site. If eventually most people have an outstanding gripe/concern it'll help everybody understand the Ex-JW mindset a little better. If you could list, in order of importance, the things that convinced you most strongly....from 1 to 10. (1 being the most important) Everybody must be able to compile their own list... it should be revealing...

    Here's mine:

    • 1, Lack of love in the congregations
    • 2, failed predictions such as 1914, 1925, 1975 etc
    • 3, Paedophilia in the organization
    • 4, The UN NGO affiliation
    • 5, The 'Generation' interpretational changes
    • 6, The disgraceful and unscriptural way DF'd people are treated
    • 7, Mistakes made by appointed men going undiscovered for years
    • 8, Knowing deep down inside my prayers weren't being answered
    • 9, The way JWs are discouraged to help charities for 'worldly' people
    • 10, Meeting more disturbed people on the inside rather than the outside

    Thanks!

  • John Locke
    John Locke

    I think I could still live with the first five reasons you mensioned in your list.

    For me the bigget reason is proud self-appointment of the organization as a sole channel of communication with god.

    And this pride, I believe, lead to other things such as lack of love (since we are already chosen and only our obidience to God and his repressentatives is what determins our salvation), manipulation with prophecies, dates and doctrines (God reveals light only through his appointed channal - FDS), problems with peadophilia is a result of constant effort to make organisation clean (to prove that it is chosen by god) in the eyes of outsiders and so on.

    As Ray Franz mansioned in his book, JW 'are the captives of concept' ant the concept is the organization.

  • lionpaw
    lionpaw

    newshite,

    i congratulate you on a most invaluable discovery...

    you too have joined the minions of enlightened individuals who have embraced the facts layed before you...

    you will not let yourself be enduced to a coma-like life of meetings, preaching, false prophecies, pedophiles...

    now...listen carefully (and let no one tell u otherwise)

    it is human nature to want to hold hands with a buddy before leaping across into the real freedom you seek.

    the j.w. is but one entity...you must percieve the whole and clear picture now.

    remember the pesky words of advice...'what consortium does darkness have with light?'

    you my friend have seen an inkling of that light...do not stop now...

  • jookbeard
    jookbeard

    I'll add another 10;

    1) The whole Malawi scandal

    2) The Military exemption certificates that the brethren in Mexico were allowed to buy

    3) 2 members of the GB who were covered up after their homosexuality yet who were never DF'ed

    4) The ban on organ transplants

    5) The Blood ban that has seen thousands worldwide die

    6) A second president who not only was an alcoholic,imported Whiskey into the USA during prohibition, and a few failed prophecies

    7) The Occult teachings of founder and Freemason CT Russell

    8) The constant unscriptural obsession with banging on doors

    9) The unbroken link since their founding of failed and false prophecy

    10) Holding investment stock of companies producing military defence .

  • debator
    debator

    Ten reasons they have the truth according to Jehovah.

    1, Zechariah 13:9
    This third I will bring into the fire; I will refine them like silver and test them like gold. They will call on my name and I will answer them; I will say, 'They are my people,' and they will say, 'Jehovah is our God.' "

    2/ They are not perfect and suffer from all the frailties of mankind but still condemning them under Gods instruction unlike other religions/groups that do not.

    Mark 7:21
    For from within, out of men's hearts, come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery,

    Romans 13:13
    Let us behave decently, as in the daytime, not in orgies and drunkenness, not in sexual immorality and debauchery, not in dissension and jealousy.

    Acts 15:20
    Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood.

    3/ they use Bible prophecy as per instruction even if they need constant refinement on it. They do not ignore it.

    NWT Matthew 24: 15 “Therefore, when YOU catch sight of the disgusting thing that causes desolation, as spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in a holy place, (let the reader use discernment,)

    4/ They deal with but do not support authorities around them. Paul himself was a Roman citizen the UN/Disgusting thing of his day but did that mean he supported Rome?

    Acts 22:27
    The commander went to Paul and asked, "Tell me, are you a Roman citizen?" "Yes, I am," he answered.

    5/ They have been given pure Bible truths and through prayer and spirit guidance, all easily checkable against what the Bible actually teaches.

    Acts 17:11
    Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.

    6/ They do not worship idols.

    Exodus 20:4
    "You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below.

    7/ They do not worship false gods.

    NWT Mark 12:28 Now one of the scribes that had come up and heard them disputing, knowing that he had answered them in a fine way, asked him: “Which commandment is first of all?” 29 Jesus answered: “The first is, ‘Hear, O Israel, Jehovah our God is one Jehovah, 30 and you must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind and with your whole strength.’

    John 4:23
    Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.

    6/ they allow themselves to be refinable.

    Daniel 11:35
    Some of the wise will stumble, so that they may be refined, purified and made spotless until the time of the end, for it will still come at the appointed time.

    a process that doesn't end until the appointed time. Mistakes being a natural human condition under sin and hense why we have the Bible in the first place.

    7/ they do not expect signs/miracles from God.

    Matthew 12:39
    He answered, "A wicked and adulterous generation asks for a miraculous sign!

    8/ They put God's work through his son before men's, working to please Jehovah rather than men. That see only the physical not the spiritual goals we have been given first.

    Mark 16:15
    He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the good news to all creation.

    9/ They Pray to Jehovah our father.

    Colossians 1:3
    We always thank God, the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, when we pray for you,

    10/ what is love?

    Proverbs 3:12
    because Jehovah disciplines those he loves, as a father the son he delights in.

    2 Timothy 1:7
    For God did not give us a spirit of timidity, but a spirit of power, of love and of self-discipline.

    Love is a word that doesn't mean excepting wrongdoing, unprincipled actions and hurt to others without correction rather it has strength to do right even when it seems hard and difficult. Like a parent needing to rebuke his child so he can recognise danger. Or Captain giving precise safety instructions to be followed in life-threatoning situations. We are accountable for our actions and those who are our shepherds are accountable not just for what they do/teach but for what they allow.

    1 Corinthians 5:12-13 (New International Version)

    12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? 13 God will judge those outside. "Expel the wicked man from among you." [a]

  • leavingwt
    leavingwt

    The burden of proof is on WT.

    If they can prove they are right, I'll happily return.

    In the meantime, I've yet to find a Bible with the following dates: 607, 1914, 1919.

  • isaacaustin
    isaacaustin

    Reniaa said:

    Ten reasons they have the truth according to Jehovah.

    1, Zechariah 13:9
    This third I will bring into the fire; I will refine them like silver and test them like gold. They will call on my name and I will answer them; I will say, 'They are my people,' and they will say, 'Jehovah is our God.' "

    2/ They are not perfect and suffer from all the frailties of mankind but still condemning them under Gods instruction unlike other religions/groups that do not.

    My reply: Damage control after flase prophecies is hardly refinement.

    Reniaa said:

    Acts 15:20
    Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood.

    My reply: A verse they misunderstand and mis-apply.

    Reniaa said:

    3/ they use Bible prophecy as per instruction even if they need constant refinement on it. They do not ignore it.

    My reply: You mean they falsely prophecy and demand their followers do not ignore their interpreations thereof.

    Reniaa said:

    NWT Matthew 24: 15 “Therefore, when YOU catch sight of the disgusting thing that causes desolation, as spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in a holy place, (let the reader use discernment,)

    4/ They deal with but do not support authorities around them. Paul himself was a Roman citizen the UN/Disgusting thing of his day but did that mean he supported Rome?

    Acts 22:27
    The commander went to Paul and asked, "Tell me, are you a Roman citizen?" "Yes, I am," he answered.

    5/ They have been given pure Bible truths and through prayer and spirit guidance, all easily checkable against what the Bible actually teaches.

    My reply: You mean they support the Charter of what they call the disgusting thing.

    Reniaa said:

    Acts 17:11
    Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.

    My reply: They have said this is only applicable to those beofre they are baptized. once baptized as a JW, this stops.

    Reniaa said:

    6/ They do not worship idols.

    Exodus 20:4
    "You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below.

    7/ They do not worship false gods.

    My reply: Exzcept for the governing body.

    Reniaa said:

    NWT Mark 12:28 Now one of the scribes that had come up and heard them disputing, knowing that he had answered them in a fine way, asked him: “Which commandment is first of all?” 29 Jesus answered: “The first is, ‘Hear, O Israel, Jehovah our God is one Jehovah, 30 and you must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind and with your whole strength.’

    John 4:23
    Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.

    My reply: As prescribed by tehir God- the governing body.

    Reniaa said:

    6/ they allow themselves to be refinable.

    My reply: You mean accept the ever-changing teachings of the gb.

    Reniaa said:

    Daniel 11:35
    Some of the wise will stumble, so that they may be refined, purified and made spotless until the time of the end, for it will still come at the appointed time.

    a process that doesn't end until the appointed time. Mistakes being a natural human condition under sin and hense why we have the Bible in the first place.

    My reply: Your simply repeating yourself here...already refuted.

    Reniaa said:

    7/ they do not expect signs/miracles from God.

    My reply: And they sure get none.

    Reniaa said:

    Love is a word that doesn't mean excepting wrongdoing, unprincipled actions and hurt to others without correction rather it has strength to do right even when it seems hard and difficult. Like a parent needing to rebuke his child so he can recognise danger. Or Captain giving precise safety instructions to be followed in life-threatoning situations. We are accountable for our actions and those who are our shepherds are accountable not just for what they do/teach but for what they allow.

    1 Corinthians 5:12-13 (New International Version)

    12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? 13 God will judge those outside. "Expel the wicked man from among you." [a]

    My reply: You mean their control tactic of enforced shunning?

  • isaacaustin
    isaacaustin

    I would say all of the above reasons given (excluding Reniaa's nonsense) is pretty comsummate a list of why the JWs do not have the truth. They follow a group of men in a self-proclaimed poistion of authority who have a very tainted track record of lies, false prophecies and false teachings. The members who are caught up in this follow these men and their ever changing teachings aimed these days at damage control.

  • gubberningbody
    gubberningbody

    * No one can declare that they have the truth with a capital T.

    The WTBS propounds the equation:

    We're God's mouthpiece, so we're God's mouthpiece.

  • oldlightnewshite
    oldlightnewshite

    Reniaa, you make some salient points....I might be persuaded to agree with you IF I were wearing one of these....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdZP1LYIXZs

    Seriously, I think the thread is going like a shopping trolley with a busted wheel. All I wanted everyone to do was list their reasons, in order of importance, so as to see what was important to everybody in general...(Ex-JWs that is)

    Thanks for the comments, even the crazy ones

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit