Greetings all, peace to you... and thank you for the "lovely" discussion (thus far)!
Dearest bohm, peace to you!
rational thought begin with doubt.
Not always. Sometimes rational thought is simply the response to irrational thought, including thought that includes fear, doubt, and disbelief.
you cant let doubt *go*,
Sure, you can. You may be considered "foolish" for doing so, true... and if that concerns you then perhaps you shouldn't try to do it.
you can only try to learn more about the world and slowly change your beliefs ever so slightly.
Now, see, here is where the limitation comes in. There is more than just the world that you can try to learn about. It is doubt/disbelief... and perhaps even fear... that prevents one from even considering that there IS more. I promise, however, that your beliefs won't change slowly, but rather rapidly, actually. Sort of a "this changes everything" kind of thing.
equating doubt and fear is the cornerstone of totaliarism and irrationality.
I don't get that the line equated the two and I certainly don't. Hence, the commas and word "and". Fear, comma, doubt, comma, "and" disbelief. They are three separate and distinct things, ALL of which must be overcome.
Don't get me wrong: it is good to retain some doubt... as to some things. For instance, my doubt that the WTBTS really was the FDS was a good thing. My doubt that my son had abdominal cancer was a good thing. Or my fear of crossing the ocean in a tiny sailboat (although, I think I could overcome that one, at least at launch. Out on the open sea during a storm, not so much).
My reference to the line, however, was with regard to the things that fear, doubt, and disbelief can keep one from experiencing and knowing things that are beneficial... including God, Christ, and as importantly... themselves: who and what THEY truly are... by what means... and as per whom... fully. In the movie, Neo doubted that he was The One. Not to go on about that, but that doubt caused him to fear his "enemies," the sentinel programs. That fear kept him in a state of disbelief, which caused them to [appear to be] stronger than he was. Which, again, caused him fear. ALL of these... fear, doubt, and disbelief... kept him from realizing his FULL potential... which potential allowed HIM to see things (the Matrix) that others could NOT see (without somekind of tool - for example, the computer). Others knew it was there (because they saw evidence of it), but they couldn't literally see it. Once he removed his fear, doubt, and disbelief... he could see it, literally, without the computer.
I posted the line because it is the same with us. We are restricted by our fear, doubt, and disbelief... as to what may be beyond us, beyond what is/can be perceived by our physical capabilities. While it may be doubt that causes a scientist to question or ask why... it is putting away their doubt that there IS a true answer that propels them forward. They BELIEVE there is an answer... some even spending their entire lives to find/prove it.
Do you want a judge to "let go of his doubt" in a court case?
As to my innocence, if I am innocent? Absolutely! I don't want him OR a jury to deem me innocent because they don't have enough evidence to convict me. That means that if the evidence appeared to show that I wasn't innocent (even though I AM!)... they would indeed convict me! I WANT them to have NO doubt as to my innocence. Omigosh, I don't want people wandering around the earth wondering if I am or not... or thinking that I am but just "got off"!
Do you let a doctor to "let go of his doubt" when he is making a medical examination?
While we're not talking about a situation of this type, I would have to say, again, absolutely, if that is the TRUTH. I mean, if he KNOWS I have, say, chicken pox (based on my symptoms, even though the labs aren't back), I would want him to tell me that, yes. I would want him to say, "I am sure you have chicken pox and that the tests will show you have chicken pox." What I would NOT want him to say is, "Well, it looks like you have chicken pox, but I actually doubt it." Well, dear doctor, if you doubt that I have chicken pox, why not just say "I don't know what you have so we'll have to wait for the tests"... and then wait until the tests say what I have?
Do you want a scientist to "let go of his doubt" when trying to figure out a theory?
I do. I want that scientist to say, "I know the current understanding/belief/theory is wrong/inaccurate, and I'm going to prove it, and I have NO doubt that I can prove it and will prove it... or at least that it can and will be proven by someone."
But then, that's just me. I totally agree that there is place for fear, doubt, and disbelief. However, as dear tec (the greatest of love and peace to you, my dear, dear one!) pointed out... not with God and Christ. While those things may be beneficial in and as to the PHYSICAL world, it is just the opposite as to the SPIRIT world. Since the physical world is the antitype... or "negative"... of the spirit world, which is the type... or "positive"... then much of what works HERE doesn't work with regard to there... and vice versa. One has to let go of one's fear, doubt, and disbelief, however, not only to fully understand that... but to fully realize (as in, experience the reality) it.
Do you want me to "let go of my doubt" when considering if God exist or not?
It is not about what I want, dear one. I would LOVE if you could be able to do that, but that love also says that if YOU don't WANT to, well, then, so be it. May YOUR will be done in this thing.
Becoming a slave belonging to anyone, including Christ, seems to me about as close to freedom as being chained to a wall.
I am a willing slave of a couple/few things, dear Trevor (peace to you!). My husband, children... dear puppies. I serve them all, willingly, and without expecting anything in return (well, as to the children and puppies). I LIKE serving them... because they love ME so. And it is the same with Christ. He is a person that I have come to know personally... and as a result have great love, respect, and regard for. I consider my service to him (i.e., being his slave)... a honorable as it USED to be when a man gave his life for... and/or saved the life of... someone and that someone made themselves either his slave... or his family's slave... until he (the someone) felt the "debt" was paid. Not that the one who saved him or sacrificed his own life asked for it, but the someone WANTED to GIVE himself in return.
I watch the drama series "Southland" and the current episodes are sort of about that. One cop's partner was brutally killed. He felt obligated to the deceased cop's family to care for them. Because he LOVED his partner, and thus, those his partner loved.
It's like, say, your town/home came under attack by an enemy/intruder... and a cop/soldier gave his life to protect you and your children. That intruder/enemy was holding you (or your child) hostage... and cop/soldier said "No, take me, instead." When the intruder/enemy realizes he is going to die, he shoots the cop/soldier. That one took the bullet MEANT for you... or your child. But he has children of his own.
Whether he lives or dies... wouldn't you know believe you owed your life (and perhaps your child's) to that cop/soldier? If he lived, wouldn't you do virtually ANYTHING for him? Anything he ASKED you to do (legal, of course)? If he dies, wouldn't you take his family in... or at least do whatever you could to see to their well-being? What if you considered what he did SO loving, and yourself SO unworthy... that you wanted to make yourself his servant, per se? Would you REALLY care what folks though about what you called yourself in doing so? Would you REALLY be so concerned that some might take issue with your calling yourself his slave?
Let's say HE says, "You don't have to call me that. I don't call you my slave; I call you my friend." HE calls YOU... HIS friend! Yet, HE saved YOUR life! Isn't it the other way around, that HE showed himself to be YOUR friend? How can you beat that? How can you show... to HIM... that you consider him MORE than just your friend... and you MORE than just a grateful recipient of his kindness?
I think that folks position on this is... so... false. Sorry, but that is what I believe. I believe all kinds of folks SAY they would serve one who gave their lives for them, but only to a certain extent. Or SAY they owe their lives to such and so... but only to a certain extent.
Christ is not asking me to die for HIM... or to be his slave. He has asked me to be his friend. In MY gratitute to him for HIS friendship toward ME... I am his willing servant and, yes, slave. Any who can't "receive" that, well, what can I say? Such ones might need to ask themselves why what I choose to call myself... bothers them. I could call myself a "bitch" (which still means "female dog" to ME)... and that would be entirely okay. But a slave of Christ... and that's a problem? I think some should take a minute.
Again, peace to you all!
A [very willing, very grateful, and totally unashamed] slave of Christ,
SA
