Amazing's Triumph - Mixed Feelings

by Perry 65 Replies latest jw friends

  • Perry
    Perry

    Amazing wrote:

    "I was able to get my wife and children out, and this led to my son-in-law and a close friend leaving at the same time. So, I am among the more fortunate in that my immediate family, and non-JW friends and relatives were all there with me as I exited. Were it not for this close and needed support, I may not have done as well emotionally".

    That has to be the understatement of the century.

    "Thanks for your comments - and I hope that in time your JW friends and family will open up to you, or even leave the religion and seek close association with you once again....Be prepared, for one day you may see at least one person call you out of the blue - and it will be fun to talk to them again". - Amazing

    I have truly enjoyed your posts and I'm surprised and embarrassed to admit that I have found myself struggling to like you. I am not quite sure why. Could it be jealousy? If I apply ruthless honesty to myself, I must admit that I have succomed to this most base of human emotions. I have always been one of the most unjealous people I know, so it's quite disconcerting..

    It appears from your posts, that you managed to ride high and mighty as an annointed Elder, a most prestigous position in the JW version of reality. It seems like you got to squeeze almost every ounce of psychological accolade from your experience of riding the charging white steed along with your peer group of generals and theological tacticians. The delusional feelings you must have felt while in the JW mindset must have been phenomenal even if humility was a core value. You certainly seem to be a nice enough guy.

    Then, when you learned the truth about the Truth, you once again managed to achieve the unachievable by getting your entire family and a son-in-law out... a most favorable outcome comparable to a paradise earth utopia when compared to the rest of us. Surely your previous position commanded attention and demanded your loved ones to seriously consider your new found position. No doubt the political posturing you evidently mastered to a fine degree together with patience, intelligence, and a stategic theological line of questioning in your family studies, comparable to; "Is it really so that God has said that you must not eat of every tree of the garden"?, has produced the outcome you now enjoy and that has become the catalyst for a realization of my not-so-perfect personality.

    But, Mr. Amazing most of us here in the trenches did not get the strategical grooming and political posture training you received. We fell hook, line and sinker for the illusion of Truth and were not privy to the underpinnings of much of the freedom you enjoyed as an elder. Many of us were raised in this religion, sometimes our families go back several generations.

    Because our commitment to "truth" was so intense, when we learned the truth about the truth we immediately (or almost) took a stand and now find ourselves totally ripped from the fabric of normal family life, as if we ever had one in the first place. No one in my family going back 4 generations and as wide as 3rd and 4th cousins has ever left this religion.

    We relate more to the "Man from Bogota" parable:

    Sometime around the turn of the previous century an anthropoligist journyed to Columbia and discovered a tribe of people who were all genetically blind from birth. He fell in love with these people because despite being blind they were able to care for their needs and do all the normal things to sustain life. He marveled at their work ethic and ingenuity which, to them it was just normal. They took him in and shared their way of life with him. He decided to make it his life's work to help these people.

    He started by telling them that the meat they were cooking was burnt black from the fire and suggested they cook it a little differently. He was ignored with a smile. Undaunted, he was determined to give these nice people an idea of what they were missing. He informed them about a herd of deer that he could see down wind a bit from their village, thinking this would surely summon a hunting party. He was visibly ignored when he made this comment.

    He continued for some time with his "help" and finally gathered them all together and tried to explain the concept of color. He spoke in glowing illustrious terms about natures' canopy in the rain forest and how it was alive with infinite shades of green. He related how the sunlight would make the leaves twinkle as the leaves fell softly to the ground as if dancing to some unknown accompaniment.

    The group of normally friendly natives stopped up their ears and cried out to seize him. Four of the strongest men held him down and one of the elders took a half burned stick from the fire and procedded to burn out his eyes, thus ending his view of the world.

    So, while I appreciate all the posts you have made, and certainly hope you never stop posting here; please excuse the occasional jabs you encounter from time to time. My little bout with jealousy will pass and I'm sure I will grow from the experience. While I thought Amnesia's hidden agenda didn't really compliment her formidable intellectual skills, and she took it a little too far, I can relate to some of her frustrations.

    However, I admire your courage and commitment to practicalness while exiting, even if the ivy league position gave you more clout. It seems to have been a blessing both to your family and to us as you relate the various events during that time in your life. Please keep them coming....even if some of us secretly love to hate you :-)

    For many of us, though we build multi-million dollar companies, achieve academic recognition, or build a friend network that rivals an MLM scam, we would give all our vast resources and accomplishments in life to gain our families back.

    So as you go fishing with your son and talk with your daughter and sit for a family meal at Thanksgiving, I hope that you pray a little prayer of personal thanks. Because for most of us the reality of the situation leaves only two choices. Continue to love the unlovable, reason with the unreasonable, and ignore the unignorable and pay the consequences; or, simply allow the fading memories of a family once cherished to live on in a heavy heart while attempting to build a new family outside relatives and JWdom.

  • ozziepost
    ozziepost

    G'day Perry,

    May I thank you for your well-thought out and well-expressed post. From the length of it, you show that you wanted to place a meaningful point of view here.

    I was taken by an expression you used, namely: "However, I admire your courage and commitment to practicalness while exiting, even if the ivy league position gave you more clout." You also see the 'position' of most as this: "But, Mr. Amazing most of us here in the trenches did not get the strategical grooming and political posture training you received."

    May I point out something to you that may help you alleviate your feeling of "jealousy", as you put it?

    It may be said of many posters on the board that they have previously enjoyed an "ivy league" position (as you put it) in the borg, but may you be assured that not all enjoy a position outside the borg of having all their families with them. From the comments made by some here, it's clear that they've experienced much heartache and trauma because of having raised children "in the truth" and now having to face the reality of them being faithful to the very organisation that the parents have come to see in a different 'light'.

    I would not presume to name names here but let me say that Mrs Ozzie and I do not enjoy a "bed of roses" as far as our family is concerned, yet it may be said in your terminology that we formerly enjoyed an "ivy league position".

    Let us instead be happy that we know of at least one family (Amazing's) for whom the path to freedom has achieved a united family out of the borg.

    Cheers,
    Ozzie

    "It's better to light a candle than to curse the darkness."
    Anonymous

  • Amazing
    Amazing

    Hi Perry: I greatly enjoyed your post. I think there are some misperceptions. I take it that you were raised a JW, and so your experiences and views will be different than mine. Then again, there culd be other experiences that suggest we may understand one another more. I don't know. But, here are some thoughts:

    I was raised Roman Catholic. I strongly believed I had the ONLY True religion. UNlike my Protestant counter-parts, Catholics arre/were more organizatonal oriented. The JW man who studied with me, was himself raised a JW. Yet, he expected me to leave my religion, my family, and my friends to jon the JWs, and have the Truth. He did not understand what it was like to leave everything for the Truth.

    My Catholic family at first rejected the hell out of me. My sister told me that my name would never be mentioned in her home. My friends all faded into other direction in life. I gave up many things to be a JW.

    Fast Forward 25 Years Now my entire life has been built around the Truth. All my friends, dearest closet friends as JWs. I rarely have contact with my family and never from former friends. My children are raised JWs, in the ages 19 Reg Pioneer, 17 Reaching out for Bethel in a year or two, 15 Still in High School and 13, just gettting into high school ...

    This time, I wake up and realize that tis not about which Organization, but simply about who I will believe in and look to. All by himself, Jesus Christ looks like a pretty good guy, you know, take away the organizational packaging, and Jesus stands out as a person who captures my respect.

    Now, here is the problem: Not only do I want my family out, I want my friends out, and I want my old friends from 25 years earlier, and I want my Catholic Family back. I want people people that I rejected for the Truth called JWs. People that hurt me and I hurt them. What does a person do? The risk in all this is as follows:

    1. My entire JW family will reject me.
    2. All my JW friends will reject me.
    3. My former non-JW friends will have no interest after 25 years
    4. My non-JW family will be too pissed to accept me back.
    5. I will be *S ... out of luck.

    So, yes, I can thanks my lucky stars that things worked out as well as they have. Other than a couple of JW friends who have come out, all the other 25 years worth of friends, some of the closest of friends, are still JWs and shun me. I am Disassociated, and treated as a DF person.

    After I came out of the JWs, I only enjoyed two years of close association with my natural brother ... then he died in 1994. My oldest sister and I get along, but she has not real interest in me. My youngest sister and I resumed a good relationship. But we now live 2300 miles apart. some of my non-JW friends did resume our relationships, but we all live far apart. After the initial support, some of the frequency of friendships has died down.

    Then there are the new non-JW friends made, and the new ex-JW friends made. And that has come along concurrent with the other support that was there. So, life goes on. I admit that there are many who have had it much tougher ... then again, I have had my own problems. Life is not where I want it right now ... but it could be a lot worse.

    What I feared more than anything on earth was the possibility that my wife and children would reject me, shun me, and I would lose them forever to the JW system. I was willing to do whatever it took to prevent that possibility from happening.

    Well, that kinds of sums things up from my end. I want to respond more to your post. So, after a while, I will make a folow-up and come back to address some specific things you bring up. Your points are well taken and to me represent the situation of so many. Thanks again.

  • proplog2
    proplog2

    Excellent Post Perry:

    Remember Amazing is an "engineer". They engineer things. They search for control. Sooner or later they find out that the ultimate illusion is "control" itself.

    I feel anybody who still believes in a supreme being and engages in the imaginary act of talking to god - after leaving JW's - haven't become really free.

  • ozziepost
    ozziepost

    Have you no-one to talk to, proplog?

    Cheers,
    Ozzie

    "It's better to light a candle than to curse the darkness."
    Anonymous

  • ladonna
    ladonna

    Perry,

    I have to concur with Ozzie. You made a post with a great deal of thought and honesty, and for that you should be proud.
    You have no need to feel "jealous" of Amazing.

    X Elders carry crosses (excuse the pun) entirely different to those of us that were not elders. They carry the burden of knowing what they carried out in their duties as elders; what they knew at the time and still stayed...many, many things.

    I could never envy or be jealous of an X Elder, but if just one whole family can get out together; be it Amazing's, Ozzies's, yours, or anyone's, I will rejoice in that factor alone.

    Perry, all my family are JW's and I am shunned by them all. That only serves to make me more happy for those that can come out with everything as intact as possible.

    To the Ozzies, and the Amazings, I wish you nothing but the best.
    Perry, I wish you the ame on your journey. Thankyou for such a well thought out post.

    Ana

  • Frenchy
    Frenchy

    Thank you Perry for your well thought out post. I wish to thank also, Ozzie and of course, Amazing.

    I would like to say that it's very difficult to be in our position whether you were an elder or not.

  • proplog2
    proplog2

    Ozzie:

    We all mostly talk to ourselves. At best we may overhear their conversation.

  • Englishman
    Englishman

    Amazing,

    Your post re your exit intrigues me, if only for the fact that I recognise a kindred spirit in that you obviously believe that life is what you make it. You didn’t sit back and wait and see what hand life would deal to you, instead you chose the game that you would play and then played it for all it was worth.

    Maybe more people should do that instead of always saying but, but, but……!

    I’m curious at the lack of respect accorded you by your fellow elders. As I recall, anointed one’s, remnant, were always deferred to in our congregation. Without exception, they were listened to and honoured as especially blessed one’s, is that not the case normally?

    Englishman.

    Truth exists;only falsehood has to be invented. -Georges Braque

  • Perry
    Perry

    Thanks for all the comments. Usually I disagree with some expresions, but I found myself in virtual agreement with everyone here. I don't feel guilty about my "problem" either (it certainly is no one else's).

    My source of frustration that has prompted such a totally useles and destrucive emotion is this:

    Because of his position and I am also presumptiously asuming some skills learned while an elder, Amazing found a tool, a weapon if you will that had a chance in doing battle with the Borg for his families' affections. The weapon worked. The very nature of the weapon allowed planning, the element of surprise, and the presentation of an alternate lifestyle with himself at the center(of the family).

    I am not used to losing. I built a company of over 100 employees while in my 20's with a 9th grade/GED education. I learned to love problem solving, and to do things because they were hard and not because they were easy... to quote a famous president. I didn't go to college until after I found material success. So, I know that I am at least reasonably intelligent and a definite fighter. But for the life of me, I can't seem to secure an effective weapon, like Amazing did, that has a reasonable chance of success of helping even one family member out.

    I've learned in business to not fight battles based on emotion or pipe dreams and to only fight where there is a reasonable chance of success. Even with the best of planning and weaponry, its best to "plant" a variety of crops because you never know which one will grow. Not every battle will be won, but you live to fight another day.

    However, with this situation I feel an almost total ineptness at even conceiving how to get started. The enemy appears too strong and my personal arsenal pitiful. However, how can I in good conscience ignore the fight? The odds tell me I'll only end up like the anthropologist in the parable. I would very much like to somehow change those odds.

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