Other Sheep & New Covenant WT Scams (page 6)

I wonder if the God of Israel Himself is an anti-semite. He told Israel He had abandoned His house (Jer. 12:7), and to submit to the Babylonian yoke (Jer. 27:12). Unless it wasn't 'God' but Jeremiah who was anti-semitic. Unless it wasn't Jeremiah but a later anti-semitic Jewish writer/redactor ...

(Seriously, designs, I can't follow your line of thought on this one either. This is not like you.)

designs

My suggestion is to study what Jewish sages wrote in the post Jesus era as they had to deal with the fallout from the NT. It was quite an eye opener. Professor Ausubel's work is excellent if you can find it. Rabbi's for centuries tried to reason with the Christian Church, sometimes with success other times waves of violence swept through Jewish communites as Christians went after those falsely painted with 'his blood be upon us'.

designs

Ann-

Researching this subject gave me an Aha moment similar to what I think you may have experienced when you first discovered the 607BC issues.

Enjoy

AnnOMaly

I thought we were talking about Jesus being 'anti-semitic' by encouraging the paying of taxes to a foreign power, driving out the extortioners in the temple and saying that the Judean 'house' was abandoned to them for their unfaithfulness. That I cannot see. We see the same kinds of pronouncements/behaviors by Jews/Israelites to Jews/Israelites in the Jewish OT.

Now, I acknowledge that bad blood started to develop between Jews and Christians later (even in the 1st c.), and Scripture can be picked out and (mis)used to sanction all sorts of atrocities depending on one's particular 'bag,' but Jesus' fault? Really?

Anyway, I'll take notice of your recommendation.

designs

Yes that is the premise actual Jews take. Leolaia argued it was a Meme but quotes from the Jewish sages shows a different view. I think moshe earlier addressed the 'abrogation' issues here.

tec

He told Israel He had abandoned His house (Jer. 12:7), and to submit to the Babylonian yoke (Jer. 27:12). Unless it wasn't 'God' but Jeremiah who was anti-semitic. Unless it wasn't Jeremiah but a later anti-semitic Jewish writer/redactor ...

Not just Jeremiah. All the prophets said similar things. I am curious how you and others Jewish scholars consider this, Designs? Were all the prophets anti-semitic as well?

Peace,

tammy

designs

This is covered in several Jewish Scholary works. A new mind set has to be adopted with regard to any history a switch from the conqueror to the conquered. Once you begin to phathom the viewpoint of the oppressed then you can identify key things that are not accurate or correct in the conquerors telling of the story and that is the case with the NT.

Now many early Jewish sages critiqued the NT as though it was factual and accurate and dismantled it from that position whereas now more scholars see the NT as a more Mark Twain type of telling a story where facts and fiction get blended.

tec

It would be nice if you could just spell out the specifics, Designs. Because its like pulling teeth with you. I have to read the book just to have any idea what you're talking about. I looked around on the internet as well, but it doesn't seem like more than a later anti-semitism according to twisting words in the gospels. Like I said. Because you have to ignore Christ and his obvious love for his brothers (Jews) to have a hatred for the Jewish people. The NT also specifically says that all Israel will be saved; that God is faithful because of his promise to the patriarchs and his promise.

'His blood be upon us' - even if it was stated and not added as you state - obviously did not apply to all Jews. Even in a worse case scenario, it could only have applied to those who wanted Christ crucified. Even then, no one else had the right to do anything about it, when Christ Himself loved them and asked forgiveness for them. Saying your house is abandoned to you is not anti-semitic, unless you claim that Jeremiah was also anti-semitic. Nor was it a rejection of the Jewish people... or a house abandoned forever.

In any case, I will see if the book says anything more. But if it does not have something more, then I cannot agree with your reasoning.

Peace,

tammy

yadda yadda 2

While I agree with you on this point Perry, you lose a lot of credibility referring us to that website, which contains a lot of error. It preaches that people are suffering in various states of torment in an after-life spirit hell, a repulsive and unscriptural dogma; and that 1 John 5:7 is a genuine bible passage. Even trinitarian scholars reject 1 John 5:7 as spurious or very doubtful as to authenticity. Perhaps people in glass-houses shouldn't throw stones?

Other Sheep & New Covenant WT Scams

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