Conti update article: "Watchtower Loses Conti Appeal - But Fights On"

by cedars 147 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

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  Band on the Run

  I appreciate your reporting. Are you reporting, though, or serving as Simons/Conti mouthpiece? There is a difference. I totally agree that sanction is correct usage but most people hear/see the terms as UN sanctions against X, or US/Isaraeli sanctions against Iran. I love English b/c we have so many words, incorporated from France, Denmark, various areas of the UK. There are so many shades of meaning. The Oxford English Dictionary is the final word for me. It is misleading to most people. Perhaps you could add a footnote that you are using it in the sense you mean.

  If Simons/Conti want infor released, I believe they are capable of posting it here. Their views are slanted. I can guarantee that both the WT and Simons have an abundance of legal issues to address but will not publicly admit so. Their main function now, apart from the actual court proceedings, is the public relations angle of their case.

  In my field, hiring an appellate lawyer to argue the appellate part is routine. People would be shocked if the trial lawyer did the appeal. There is a different skill set needed for a trial and an appeal. Appellate lawyers get to know the appellate judges very well. They study every case before the court for sgnals as to how a judge will rule in their cases.

  I have never been involved with collecting fees. Contingency fees are limited. I must admit I don't know for certain how the fee is split. I do know that courts must approve the fees. Courts routinely belief that a 1/3 fee or perhaps 40% if the work is very difficult is appropriate. A lawyer charge me more in a personal case and the court simply reduced his fee. Simons may be altering his fee on the theory that a win is more money in his pocket than nothing if the verdict is not upheld. My main point is I don't know. Lawyers getting countless millions of dollars and the plaintiff's award being reduced is very bad marketing for the entire profession. CA law needs to be check to make your assertion and also Simons needs to be quoted.

  Simons' primary duty is to his client. I don't like that he reveals partial info to nonlawyers members of this board. A fellow lawyer could better cut through p.r. and ask hard questions without being nasty. If I were Simons, I would love the repartee and discussion-the challenge. Perhaps other lawyers who do contingecy fees in CA may be able to clarify the matter.
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  Band on the Run

  Simons may have an ethical duty to not publicize his strategy. It may be prudent for him to remain silent. B/c the world that matters now is the CA appellate courts not JW.net.
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  144001

  Scott,

  You still haven't explained what "substance" you claim there is to the false headline that was the issue of this thread. Keep on putting your foot further and further down your throat. It's rather amusing watching your exhibition of intellectual bankruptcy.
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  Scott77

  	I appreciate your reporting. Are you reporting, though, or serving as Simons/Conti mouthpiece?
  	Band on the Run

  Hi BOTR,

  Please, whom are you refering above as 'your'?

  Scott77
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  Scott77

  	Scott, You still haven't explained what "substance" you claim there is to the false headline that was the issue of this thread.
  	144001

  From a layman's perspective, Mr. Cedar's headline ' 'Conti update article: "Watchtower Loses Conti Appeal - But Fights On" was accurate in its presentation. The substance of its content in this instance is that, the Watchtower appealed [pleaded, implored, petitioned a trial judge for a reduction of the excessive monetary award], a request that was partially accepted.

  However, such appeal which included a wholesale request for a review of the whole judgment was lost. The Watchtower lost but went on to fill an appeal as in legal to a higher court. This kind of appeal is what you have in mind. Yes,something was filled in the court, something was lost, and a fight is still on. Like what BOTR stated, in English we have different meaning of words. Mr. John, cool down. Stop attaching poster's character for expressing an honest opinion.

  Mr. Cedar's headlines although it has been corrected to reflect your unsual complaint, has some susbtance. Shooting it down by outright dismissal as being entirely misleading without acknowledging that substance or the intent of its display was very troubling and uncalled for. I stand by what I stated. No apology

  Mr. John, its high time to lay down to 'groves'. Its doesn’t benefit everyone if we continue to 'fight' this way. With the death of our beloved and very charming Ooompa still fresh in our mind,I think, its kinda of us to tread very gently on those like mind blown that have joined the JWN forum hoping to receive love, solace, embrace, support and encouragement on their long road to recovery from Watchtower bondage and enslavement.

  Scott77
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  144001

  Lay people might not be professionals, but they are capable of using lay people dictionaries. The word "appeal" is defined in the Merriam Webster on-line dictionary, as follows:

  1 ap·peal

  noun \?- ' pel\

  Definition of APPEAL

  1 : a legal proceeding by which a case is brought before a higher court for review of the decision of a lower court. In the Conti case, no decision of the trial court has been reviewed by a higher court, because no appeal has been heard yet. The trial court ruled on a motion for judgment notwithstanding the verdict and a motion for a new trial. The TRIAL COURT heard these motions, not a "higher court" aka "appellate court." Motions for a new trial or judgment NOV are not appeals because they are not heard by a higher court; rather, they are heard by the trial court, as the trial court did in the Conti case. <<<<Mr. John, cool down.>>>> Instead of addressing the issue that was being discussed in this thread, you scoured the threads I've posted to in order to find something you believed you could attack. You then posted an entirely irrelevant post of mine to this thread, in a cheap personal attack. It's not surprising to me that you would do that, given your support for the publication of false statements to others. You are certainly a "win at all costs" sort of person, and in this case, the "cost" was your credibility.

  *edited to add: I'm not seeking an apology from you. It would be meaningless to me anyway, since you've already demonstrated that truth and honesty are unimportant to you.
  
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  Scott77

  Mr. John,

  From the same dictiionary you quote, there are more than one meaning although you focused on one that supports your version of appeal. That kind of appeal is what you have in mind. .

  1 ap·peal

  Definition of APPEAL 1 : a legal proceeding by which a case is brought before a higher court for review of the decision of a lower court 2 : a criminal accusation 3 a: an application (as to a recognized authority) for corroboration, vindication, or decision b: an earnest plea :entreaty <an appeal for help> c: an organized request for donations <the annual appeal>
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  Band on the Run

  My perspective is that legal language must be precise. A ballpark estimate can get you disbarred. Several lawyers or people with good legal backgrounds posted concerning the inaccuracy, which I do not believe was intentional. My posts were ignored. I understand your point but when people with the appropriate background say that the post was inaccurate, they are correct.

  We could all use better language. I would not expect a medical analsys from a lay person so why do nonlawyers believe they can ascertain legal words that have very precise application. After the correct terms are used, there remains room to debate their fairness or justness.

  I was utterly shocked when someone quite gratutitously wanted to diss me in Oompa's thread. It was personal animus and had nothing to do with anything remotely related to Oompa. I assume his family members and friends will view that thread. On occasion, I am also guilty of perhaps using strong words.

  The best course of action, now, is not to respond in kind to every taunt or insult. Oomp's death, while not related to this content, should make us all aware of each other's feelings. What we need now is what happend in NY after 9/11- manners and caring for each other. It was so freaky and scary but it helped us cope.

  The issues and correct designation is more important than who insulted whom and in what order.