The New Diary of Winston Smith

by WinstonSmith 336 Replies latest jw experiences

• 

  WinstonSmith

  Hello, I hope you are having a nice weekend wherever you are!

  If you are going to a meeting today, keep these thoughts in mind as you go through the WT study: Jehovah Congregates His Joyful People

  • Paragraph 2 says that in this study we will review scriptural precedents for modern day conventions. The next paragraph then give us Exodus 20:18 and Deutoronomy 4:9, 10 and calls this the first large gathering of God's people for the purpose of instruction. How does what is described set a precedent for modern day conventions? There was a million people in the desert, under a volcano, that was so scary to the people that they asked one guy to act as an intercede. Does any of this sound like a modern convention? The only similarity is that a group of people got together.

  • From the end of paragraph 5 to the start of paragraph 6 we make a giant leap from the border of the promised land all the way to Ohio, 1919. The focus of the festivals in Israelite times was to celebrate and reflect on the relationship that an individual, a family, and the nation had with their God. The focus of the 1919 convention was getting people pumped to sell books.

  • Funny, in the list of conventions mentioned, nothing is said about the 1966 "God's Sons of Liberty" convention where the book Life Everlasting in Freedom of the Sons of God was released. A book in which it was heavily implied that the end of this system would come in the 1970s, and which was followed by numerous WT and AW articles on the same subject, and Circuit Assembly public talk titles such as "Who Will Conquer the World in the 1970s?"

  • Paragraph 13 says that people travelled from many different nations to come to Jerusalem for the Pentecost festival. Acts 2:5-11 is placed at the end of the paragraph to back this thought up. But read verse 5. This indicates to me that these people lived there, not that they travelled there. Only verse 10 talk about people traveling - the sojourners forms Rome.

  • What was the purpose of the ancient festivals? Was it to listen to talks, or was it to offer animal sacrifices? How do these in any way compare to modern day conventions? The only similarity is that a bunch of people get together. And maybe some singing?

  • Paragraph 17. The real reason things have changed is that there is no way they would ever get people along to an eight day morning, noon, and evening nowadays. They market this change as being loving, but reality is quite different. For example, the was a lot of private uproar among my elder friends when they found out they had to take a week off work for the recent elders school.

  • Did you notice the subtle dig in paragraph 18? The releases help 'sincere' people appreciate scriptural truths. Does that mean that if you read these books and are not moved by them, that you are not sincerely seeking scriptural truths?

  Stay strong, keep fighting.
• 

  Honeybucket

  Hi Winston-

  I posted to this thread over a month ago, expressing frustration and needing help with my spouse. Today, we had a lovely chat where he expressed that MAYBE there might be some merrit to my claims. Oh joyous day when the walls start crumbling. When he mentioned and acknowledged the false predictions, he says I am looking at it negetively. The U.N NGO- Im being negetive and not looking at both sides of the story. He thinks I am "willing" the society to be wrong. I am ok with this because I know him starting this conversation is HUGE. I even asked him his thoughts on the new light. I think it helped that I told him about this new light and doctrine changes before anyone else around us talked about it. When I first mentioned it he did not believe, says Im making things up. Oh! how he was quiet when others started discussing these new revelations. Something that we did want to chat about is how the bible and jesus set the example for the society and their pyramid of power. I told him that the word governing body is never even mention in the bible, only the nwt. His reply was that the orginal wording was elders. Well my dear, do you think that the JW are the only religion with order and organization. No response. Maybe you have some thoughts on this topic

  Bringing them down one-by-one

  Honeybucket
• 

  Honeybucket

  btw- he didnt have a reply for the new light question. I do wonder if this is because the WT hasnt told him what to think, or maybe he is still mulling it over. Tim Will Tell

  HB
• 

  WinstonSmith

  Hello Honeybucket,

  This is great news! The fact that he is even talking about it says a lot. Be careful not to jump in and avalanche him with info. Now is a key time to maybe focus on just one or two things. I think the UN NGO thing is a biggie as the UN letter clearly states that members have to follow the ideals of the UN charter as a key part of their membership. The new light is a fresh one that might be worth pursuing. Instead of going after the new light itself, may be take another tack. Someone said to us it was not a big deal. We replied with "Remember the DVD we watched just a few weeks ago, that we discussed in the Service Meeting? The one about the history of the organisation? This is out of date now. There will be heaps of books out of date now. We'll all have to be careful not to offer old light or say the wrong thing!" Pick a couple of subjects an become an expert on them.

  So happy to hear about this progress. Stay in touch and let us know how things go.

  Bringing them down one by one - EXCELLENT
• 

  WinstonSmith

  You might remember a little while ago I mentioned that there might be some hope with helping my sister wake up. Things have just got real interesting.

  Here is some background:

  My sister and my brother in law have been married for just over ten years and from around two years after they got married have had issues. They have had on and off issues for a while, and recently things came to a head. After years of putting up with what equates to emotional abuse from my brother in law, she spoke up and said that she was not happy and that things had to change. My brother in law flipped things around and said she was the one emotionally abusing him. As a result of this, they asked the elders for help. The brothers spoke with them at length and offered them the usual “well if you read the bible and apply what you learn, things like this don’t happen”. Things were again left unresolved and were minimised by the elders. My brother in law continued to serve as a MS and both of them as regular pioneers. I have heard many similar stories like theirs over the years.

  The problems have of course continued. My sister freely admits to being far from blameless in the situation, but I also know that she is not a drama queen and not prone to making stuff up.

  She emailed me a few weeks back and said she wanted to talk to me about some ‘elder stuff’. We got on Chat and off we went. She explained that they had been back to the elders. My brother in law was allowed to speak to them alone, but he had to be in the room when my sister spoke to them (!!!???). They told her that there must be something else going on because they have been given all the advice available, and if they had been applying it there would be no issue (!!!). They were now questioning whether my brother in law should stay as a MS and if both of them could stay on as pioneers. They were going to speak with the CO as he was due for a visit.

  I said to her that she needs to remember that she is dealing with an old boys club, and to not expect anything favourable from any of them with regards to her. I explained a few things about how it works on ‘the inside’ as an elder and she was most grateful as what I said connected a few dots that she had been wondering about. She said it all seems so unfair and that no-one seems to be listening to her.

  She went out with the CO during his visit and he was asking her all sorts of questions. She said she didn’t feel comfortable talking about it because they were going door to door. The elders obviously talked about things with the CO as the following week they got called to another meeting with two elders. The brothers advised them that they were sending a recommendation to the WTS that they should keep their privileges. It was up to the WTS to make the call. If nothing comes back, they stay as they are. If a letter came back it would have a negative decision in it.

  My sisters reaction was “I just don’t get it. I don’t know how he can stay as a MS. But what would I know?” She then said “There is other stuff going on that I just can’t understand. Its making me feel raped in a whole new way. I just want to tell everyone to get stuffed!”

  This of course got raised my interest as this is the first time I have ever heard her talk like this. In my reply I reiterated the unfairness of it all. How there is a lot of things that go on that aren’t based on scriptures – like qualifications for pioneers. I asked when they said that they were going to review their qualifications to see if they could remain as pioneers, on what scripture containing qualifications for pioneering were they basing the review? I said having seen the organisation from the inside as an elder, it made me see a whole new side of things, a side that most are unaware of. I gave some examples of the unscriptural things that have been set up as rules – no sisters involved in binding the elders book, no beards, and no electronic devices on stage.

  I emphasised that things just didn’t make sense to me. Surely there are more important things to worry about than whether or not a brother has beard? I didn’t lay it on heavy, just posed things as questions as though they don’t make sense (because they don’t).

  She has replied and said that they have still not heard anything back and that she is finding it hard to cope. She is just trying to focus on her ministry and her bible students. She understands first hand the hurt, confusion and frustration. She then says:

  “Can I ask if you don’t mind, and don’t feel you have to answer me, do you think that Jehovahs Witnesses have the truth?”

  Dun dun dunnnnnn.

  I don’t believe that she is asking from an accusatory angle, but is motivated by some doubts she may be harbouring as a result of being shat on for years. She followed this question up with “Right now I am just trying to remind myself that it is not possible to have a perfect organisation. There are going to be wrong decisions, and surely Jehovah must look down and say “That’s not what I want!” His servants are in pain, and when this comes from the congregation, he must cringe.

  So. What do you think? I have formulated what I think is a careful reply which I will post later for your review and suggestions. The reply does not say anything directly and I have designed to be more of a rant / vent than a direct takedown of the organisation.

  I don’t think she is all the way there yet, but I think she is at a key crossroads.

  I would love to hear your thoughts on the story so far, and any ideas you think I should provide in my reply…….
• 

  Listener

  Sorry to hear that your sister is going through a very difficult time, she certainly needs all your help and support. Please be very careful with your reply to her as it is very much a time where she needs personal advice and not to be thrown more confusion into the situation by your own position. It may just throw her into the deep end if she knows exactly how far you have moved away from the organization. Having said that, do make it very clear to her that she has your complete support no matter what she does and that she always will have. You could even explain why you take that stand as opposed to a conditional love.

  What you have said already is great. By getting her to examine just how biblical the actions and advice of the Elders are. Explain to her that the Elders are limited in their actions, not just by their own imperfections but by the instructions that are clearly set out to them by the Governing Body. That even if there was a different set of elders trying to deal with her circumstances that the responses would most like be identical.

  It is amazing that they will tell others to follow the advice set out in the bible without being helpful in personcal circumstances and yet they will deal with a situation according to what their superiors advise rather than according to their own bible trained conscience and heartfelt understanding. To start discussing and reviewing their 'privelages' is beyond inconsiderate and wise.
• 

  Black Sheep

  You might be able to draw parallels that let here think that maybe this is just another church of no greater importance than any other. E.g. I'm sure there are a lot of Catholics who don't think their church is perfect.

  Encouraging her to do the talking, the researching and the thinking is the way to go. Just make sure she knows that she can talk freely about doubts and make it easy for her to tell you she doesn't believe it.

  For direct questions, like is it the Truth? try being evasive in a way that lets her suspect that you have the same doubts without you spelling it out.

  Don't put anything in Txt, email etc. until she tells you she wants out.

  Bloody tightrope walk innit?
• 

  Honeybucket

  JW's think what sets them apart is that they have love a mong their people. Sounds like your starting point with her is to bring out why JW's arent all that loving and they really arent all that happy of a people. I think this is what my husband noticed right off the bat. There are no actions to back up the claims the society has made. People are phony and now he sees that. And I think she does too.

  Someone close to me told me that its up to me whether or not I think its the truth, But in order to make the correct decision, I needed to do some homework. Months later my mind was blown and here I am now
• 

  WinstonSmith

  Listener, Black Sheep, and Honeybucket, thanks very much for your feedback and suggestions. I am working on the reply at the moment and am sliding in a couple of the points you have made.

  Once I'm done, I will post it up and see what you think....

  CHEERS :-)
• 

  WinstonSmith

  Okay here goes...

  There is of course a preamble and some personal stuff at the end, but I haven't pasted that, just the main body:

  I think it sucks that you have just been left hanging like that. You should be given a clear answer so you can go on with your life. With things left up in the air, you will never truly have a settled feeling. You'll always feel like you are on tenterhooks. Please know that whatever happens, whatever eventuates, you will always have our love and support. It's funny you ask the question "Do you think Jehovah’s Witnesses have the truth?" Here is some more inside info for you: It's funny because this is one of the 'loyalty' questions that get asked by elders in a judicial committee when someone is up for apostasy. The other question that is asked is "Do you believe that the faithful and discreet slave is God's way of directing things on earth?" Both are loaded questions and the implications of answering them honestly can have devastating effects on anyone who has to answer them in front of a panel of elders. They are phrased in such a way that they require a yes or no answer. But sometimes life is not so black and white. If someone had some small questions, or even some big questions, they would have to answer honestly 'no'. To answer no to either of those questions means the end of them as a JW. The end of their relationship with their family. The end of being able to spend time with their friends. When the elders hear "no", then the case is closed in their minds. In fact even saying "Yes, but.." is taken as a no. I'm not saying this based on hearsay. I am basing this on experience.
  
  I think it is perfectly fine to ask questions. The truth should stand up to examination. Scrutiny should be welcomed. The Bereans were praised and recorded for all time at Acts 17:11 for being studious enough to check up on what Paul was teaching to make sure it was true. Sadly I can't see that this is the case today. As I have said before, what I see time and again is not the bible being pulled out, but the Shepherd the Flock book. Do you know what the nickname for that book is? Among certain ones I spent time with at a KM school, it was called "the disfellowshipping book" because about 80% of it focuses on the various situations that might come up, and how to deal with them.
  
  And how does one define "truth"? There is a dictionary definition of truth, but then we as JWs use this word from a slightly different angle. We use it as a catch-all for our beliefs. The reality is that this version of "truth" changes. What we believed a few years ago is quite different now. I'll give you an example:
  
  Recently the make up of the faithful and discreet slave has changed. It used to be that the FDS was all of the anointed as a group. Now this has changed to be "From 1919 on, there has always been a small group of anointed Christians at the world headquarters of Jehovah’s Witnesses. They have supervised our worldwide preaching work and have been directly involved in preparing and dispensing spiritual food. In recent years, that group has been closely identified with the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses." That is a quote from jw.org . Notice that it has only been from 1919. That means that Charles Taze Russell, is no longer considered to be part of the FDS. If, at some time in the last ten years you had said to people "CTR is not part of the FDS" you would have had your mental health questioned and had the crap kicked out of you by the elders. If you stuck to that idea, despite it being based on your honest belief as a result of your research, you would have been disfellowshipped.
  
  I'll give you an even better example:
  
  For many years organ transplants were considered to be fine. Then, in the 1960s they were equated with cannibalism. I kid you not. Look it up. Anyone who had a transplant after that was disfellowshipped for disobedience and, can you believe it, cannibalism. Then, a few years later, it was changed again so that organ transplants were again a choice for each individual to make. I wonder how many people got disfellowshipped in that period for having transplants? Do you think they all got a call once it again became ok to have a transplant to say "sorry we disfellowshipped you because you got a transplant. It's now okay to have one. Your disfellowshipping has been rescinded"? I wonder how many people died?
  
  I think people can be forgiven for struggling to keep up and being a human and asking questions as they try to find stable ground on which to build their faith. Jesus' disciples weren't afraid to ask questions. Thankfully Jehovah is the final judge and we render our account to him, and not to anyone else.
  
  It totally agree with you when you say that Jehovah must look down and facepalm at some decisions. What really bothers me is the pain and anguish that comes to many people as a result of these decisions. We have pressure put on people to get X amount of field service time. We have people like our friend who sought help and got smashed as a result. We have a policy (in the secret elders book) that can directly lead to a pedophile being unknown in a congregation and free to go from door to door and associate with families and kids. In a recent WT the brothers said that they don't have divine inspiration. Yet in other articles they call themselves God's channel or spirit led. I'm not exactly sure what the difference is to be honest. It's quite confusing. They say they don't have divine inspiration, but to question anything they say is taken as disobedience to God. We spend a lot of time pointing out the inconsistencies of other religions, when in actual fact, in some areas, we are not so different from them.
  
  The world is most definitely in a mess. Something needs to be done about it. The bible says that something will be done about it. MRS SMITH and I take great solace in just reading the scriptures. The "truth" is very simple. Love God, love your neighbour, treat others like you want to be treated. These are the three most important things that make us Christian. It is not about a thousand laws, and straining out of the gnat. It should be about love. Helping the flaxen wick. Feeling pity for those skinned and thrown about. Jesus did away with the Law and its myriad rules and replaced with a law written on our hearts. He replaced it with the simplicity of love and understanding.
  
  I've written and re-written all of this about 20 times because I want it to come out in the right way. I have seen a lot of things with my own eyes, and heard a lot of things with my own ears, that if they were known by the general congregation populace, would cause massive upheaval. It is a heavy burden to bear. It leaves a bad taste in your mouth. What has been seen cannot be unseen. One finds it hard to look at a brother on stage giving a talk about the kindness and compassion of Jesus knowing that this same guy has mentally smashed and punched the joy out of one of his own sheep (on more than one occasion and to more than one sheep).

  As a Christian, I try and look past these things. As you say, it is not possible to have a perfect organisation made up of imperfect people. But the things I am talking about are sadly not one off examples. Just in my own experience, I have seen ourselves get treated appallingly (EXAMPLE GIVEN THAT SHE IS VERY FAMILIAR WITH). I have seen you get treated terribly when you were unable to attend meetings a few years ago. I think about poor CLOSE FRIEND and what she had to go through. I think about how ANOTHER CLOSE FRIEND was treated on the way out. I think about the things I saw while serving as an elder. I think about our friend who got screwed by the Body after crying for help. I think about that sister in Mum’s congregation who was being beat up by her husband, but nothing was done about it. I think about your recent experience with the elders and the CO (the old boys club). The same things have been happening over many years to many people in many countries. We spend so much time and effort trying to make new recruits, but fail dismally on tending to the existing flock. Love is supposed to be our identifying mark, yet time and again I see people crushed and beaten down.

  There is just a lot that I don't 'get'. If I'm honest, there have always been things that I have never been able to reconcile in my mind. It's weird, and I can't put my finger on it. MRS SMITH is on exactly the same page in all this. This is the most honest I have ever been about this (apart from to MRS SMITH). I can count on less than one hand the number of people I would ever feel safe enough to talk about this to - and that is not how it should be right? Like you, we feel a bit like we just have to hunker down and focus on ourselves and making ourselves better people.

  Anyway, I have crapped on long enough. Hopefully none of this is too shocking for you. I don't think there is anything crazy crazy in there. Just a guy trying to figure out this thing called life. I really want to know what you mean when you say there is other stuff that you can't understand and makes you feel raped in a whole new way. I would honestly love to know how you honestly feel - with total confidentiality of course. As I said before, no matter what you say, it will always be in the strictest confidence and you will always have our complete support.

  My turn: Do you think Jehovah's Witnesses have the truth?

  The best thing any of us can do is read the bible, be regular in prayer and try our best to show love to all that cross our path. This I think is the essence of being a Christian. Like I said earlier, love God, love our neighbours, and treat other people like we want to be treated. Jehovah gave his Word to us for a reason. It alone should be enough to lead us and guide us, not a cold sticking to rules and procedures.

  So there it is...

  I would love to hear any feedback and suggestion please.

  WS