You need to protect yourselve's from charlatans and quack's.....
Than go out and do it! all you atheists DO JUST THAT!! not putdowns on a website, constantly bagging people's opinion's, because thats all they are opinion's, go out and make a stand in the real world, the world you keep telling everyone of faith to be a part of, not so easy is it, I cannot understand how people that were once involved and believing can so readily turn on those that are still believing. It make's no sense. Is not reasonableness _ the whole point I feel Charliko was initially trying to make- is that not a better way to get through to someone, if your own children/grandchildren had beliefs in well let's say a talking bear, would you make that child feel stupid just to ensure it never made that mistake again - belief in something without hard facts.
I gotta admit I was kinda stunned reading that NC only just DA herself , nice pic by the way NC and please it's not having a go, but it's hard to get round how someone can be so vocal, and condeming- sorry thats how I read your views at time's- and still be worried about the friggin neighbour cos he's and elder, or the fact that people will see whats in your loungeroom, why do those people's thought's on you even matter, I would of thought you would of let people like that know EXACTLY where you stand, you have no problem here going for the jugular, but once again in real life people are'nt so tough. By the way you are an incredibly intelligent woman, your message's if you are truly wanting to show other's another line or reasoning could be a bit kinder. I know some may scoff at that, but even NC has said she has been attacked so I am sure you inderstand where I am coming from. Also Cofty one of the main member's here who initially got me wanting to join this sight through what he had written, until that is I read some of the scathing sarcastic retort's, but even Cofty was a JW pretty high up?, than found out it was BS to go evangelical for ANOTHER 9 years!( ya get 10 for murder mate) now really after that experience would you not want to show people through your own life experience that you have come to a conclusion of no God, but could show other's in a reasonable manner, to constantly have your intellect trashed only builds walls.
It's been said why do more believer's not jump in and speak up, I think after reading all the threads about this extremely touchy subject, most believers don't want the trouble and aggravation, it truly is like sharks circling when you read some threads and I know I think firstly Do I want to lower myself to an all in web brawl, and secondly whats the point. I know many of you declare you are here to help, than HELP! PLEASE PLEASE HELP! be REASONABLE share your knowledge and past/present conclusion's in a way that's palatable with all. I have had to go and read most of the atheists threads and try to understand them more, because initially up until aguest left, I thought you lot were mean spirited/nasty just for the fun of it, now I see there are many side's to consider.
I'm sorry, I don't see that many believer's jumping in and putting down atheists, I don't see believers all ganging together to shut a thread down or ridicule, I really try to be reasonable nowadays because I have not always lived a life in regard to that quality, and it is a quality that people with a high enough IQ to discern there is no God, should so readily and easily display.
Because of this site..... I no longer can pick up a bible, It initially broke my heart, coming from someone who used to kiss the bloody thing at night and say "goodnight father J, I love you" and found so much comfort in it's words, now I can't even touch it, I keep thinking of the Ist Corinthians verse bloody 15/19- If in this life we have hoped in christ, we are of all men most to be pitied. Do you all know how much stock I put in that -wow Jah thats your seal/gaurentee to me or soooo I thought, coming to terms with Jw's, WTBTS all being a load of bull is hard enough, specially when you have no family, and that was your family, coming to this website has opened my eye's, and yes eased my pain, because no matter how much I may want to believe in the bible it is full of contradiction's, and yes picture's like a starving child, with a friggin vulture in the background does make me question where ARE you? why does this shit have to go on so long father, have we not paid enough for someone hogging on a bit of fruit, I just don't know anymore, the ball of string is starting to unwind, and there are many fears dissloving, and guilt is becoming a rare emotion, not a constant cloak that weighed more than my mind could handle, but please take my hand and show me your reasonings and conclusion in a civil way, so I can absorb it and not the just sense the anger, and the low level of respect that I feel from so many non believers when they are asserting themselves, or trying to get your point across.
I have to say as well, not everyone who has never read atheists books, or perused science conclusions, or questioned God BEFORE coming to this site is stupid/mental/having a breakdown etc, some well I will speak for me, I never did because I thought I was being LOYAL TO JEHOVAH, really, as hard as that may be for some to understand, that is why I never read certain thing's, hung out with certain people, took certain job's and yes in retrospect I should of questioned more because I had doubt's, but when you have had very few be loyal to you in life, only than can you understand the weight one would put on being loyal to God.
As I said before I don't know what to believe anymore so I must digest information slowly and with a constant questioning going on within me, I can understand how atheists could be very pissed off about being duped, but take it out on the right people, the authorities, the governments, and the religions/cults that f... people up and over, not some poor individuals thats head and heart is reeling from what is potentially the hardest thing to accept in life, even death we are aware of from an early age and can accept, its crushing yes when we experience it closely, but we KNOW it's going to happen to us all, but this God stuff well if you have been there and than it all gets taken away that can leave one almost paralysed, with fear, shame , anger...... until one can resolve within themselves a conclusion that they can mentally and I believe physically/spiritually accept. Than there maybe peace, thats what I'm hoping for just some peace.
Nearly all here have been there and done that in regard to Jw life, please don't forget, don't look down on other's if they have maintained faith, yes people speaking in regard to message's from God have to expect to be questioned and hopefully will try to deliver there message with a level of facts and integrity that cannot be mocked, there's just too much out there that is unexplainable for me to put a lid on a higher being, but for now I have to try to discern my own code to life, in real life I am looked at as an atheist by JW's, I had a meeting with some and spilled my gut's expecting them to get all angry and in my face, defending ther bible and God, they did not, they listened, some agreed and some cried, one lady cried 3 time's and I felt terrible to bring on her pain and doubt, but as pissed off as I feel that that freakin religion can cause so much angst, I had to pull myself in and remind myself they are victims too, they fully believe in it all, and for them to see someone who could be so emotional and obliging most of the time, become very adament and factual, and slowly tear down the whole structure/past and present, for all of them there I know it was confronting, I felt terrible when they left, and tried to comfort myself with well, it is bullshit and they need to know, but the fact remains you will catch more flies with honey. That was a good lesson for ME, I do not want to live my life by hurting other's, it give's me no joy, sarcasm is easy,venomous attacks almost instinctual for some these days, I know I am going to screw up with people because I am still hurting and feel angry not as much, but it rises up, Oompa's death has fueled it again and I must constantly remind myself that when I run into Jw's and they say they miss me blah blah, they are conditioned, they are not the one's that so openly make and break rule's-GB, I also have to remind myself that in staying calm and composed, and showing kindness/reasonableness that will be much better evidence to them that life is ok without the constant heavy handed monitering, some have even said to me you do seem more calm, and happy, and yes I do, who would'nt.
This place is addictive and I have grown to look forward to reading so many people's thought's and feel like I am starting to get a handle on some personalities, its just that, well reading the attacks/scorn/mocking is the only thing that make's this site one you gotta switch off from, everything else is great, and very supportive in many areas, and I have learned alot, and know I have alot more to learn, it's exciting to me to think we all here are on some kind of journey back to our true selve's.
When we remember who we once were, and what we once believed and how long it took to get wherever YOU are today, surely a little reasonableness displayed to other human beings is not too much to ask for.
