Faith... and Trust: The Same Things?

by AGuest 452 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  AGuest

  representing ones self as sent from god on a board full of former cult members is wrong and dangerous.

  Okay, I HAVE to ask this: by WHAT means do the folks in the congregation where you serve THINK that you were appointed as an elder? Be careful, now. Think about this before you respond... because there's really only one answer. Which leads me to the next question:

  What have YOU done to disspell that perception? Have you been HONEST with those poor folks and said, "Hey, look, Brother/Sister, I know you THINK I was appointed by (and we won't state the term, here - no need), but not only was I NOT... but I don't even BELIEVE in it/him. Heck, I don't even believe in..."

  And you know where I'm going.

  At least I am HONEST with folks about what I believe... and who I believe IN... and not lying to folks... and/or letting THEM believe otherwise... to their own detriment... to save my own hiney.

  I'm telling you... I don't judge you, not one wit - to your own master you must stand or fall. But if you think I'm going to let you make the kinds of statements you make, while you're utterly deceiving people for YOUR own end... you really haven't learned a thing about me. Let me help you, then: you are absolutely mistaken. I will point to YOUR leaven... each and every time you try to tie that "yoke" around MY neck.

  So, again, I really think you should remain silent on this particular matter. Because I don't think YOU can handle the TRUTH that will come out... if you don't.

  A slave of Christ,

  SA
• 

  Lozhasleft

  I do however find it interesting that after quoting your beloved teachers words you calmed down. Hard when presented with her arguments strait back to you isnt it.... More telling that you still cant own her agression and call her for it.

  I quoted what? Who? My beloved teacher? Who do you suggest that is EE? I quoted you and NC. I suspect you're attempting to insult me because I don't agree with the bullying on here?

  Loz x
• 

  Benjie

  Are you still an elder, elderelite.

  Don't answer if you don't want to. I just don't understand this.
• 

  NewChapter

  Michelle thinks that Aguest follows a demon, that I follow a demon, that I and any who agree with Aguest (though she might be putting me in the same category now, who knows?) are sycophantic. Though in truth, any who agree with Aguest are just listening to the same One. (who, according to Michelle, is a demon) I had to look that word up (sycophantic) because i just skipped over it the first time, then Cofty used it too, and I figured I'd best check it out. One of the most insulting words I have read.

  First, LOL, let's just agree to not use metaphor with each other! It's always a trainwreck.

  Well, I don't think it is a nice thing to say, that a person is following a demon. Of course, it means more to some than to others, because if it was said to me, I would find it exceedingly silly and giggle. I don't believe in demons. But if you do, then it does feel insulting to have that thrown out there.

  And yet, that is what she truly believes. I can say I understand that, because when I used to believe in those things, I did believe that some followed the teachings of demons. I said so, too. Because that was being true to my god to point it out.

  But maybe SHE thinks it is merciful to point out if she believes it. Maybe she thinks she is putting out a warning, and hoping that some will listen. Maybe she thinks it is true. Now think about it. If you REALLY believe it is true, and that there is danger, wouldn't you say so? I don't believe it's true, so let's put that aside. I'm speaking from a different POV. Would it not actually be an expression of love to put out a warning, IF YOU REALLY BELIEVED?

  See, I know it feels insulting, but I think Myelaine really believes that. Because I used to. Aguest really believes that she has a tiny mind and heart---and says it was not meant as an insult, but as mercy. What if Myelaine said such out of mercy and not out of the desire to insult?

  Or does that go against your understanding of Christ, and therefore, is wrong?

  You know, Penn Jillette does this video blog thing sometimes, and he talked about a man who had given him a bible with a note in the front. Penn is a pretty vocal atheist, but he was deeply touched by this gift. He said it touched him because this man really believed this, and really had concern for Penn's soul. He didn't take it as an insult, but he saw through that. He actually got a bit choked up about it. He said that if he believed such things, he too would feel the need to proclaim it loudly. That it would be the loving thing to do. I'll look for the video if you are interested. He didn't react like this though, and he's an atheist.
• 

  elderelite

  Lol sorry loz, i meant after i quoted her you didnt further the discussion on my perceived insult..

  And yes benjie i am still an elder, although as loz has pointed out it means very little anywhere :P
• 

  AGuest

  Looks like a lot of angry people and some not angry.

  May I offer to you, dear Benjie (again, peace to you!) that looks can be (and very often are) deceiving? I don't know if you're a current/former JW, but if so you might be able to understand what I mean when I use "repentance" as an example. In the WTBTS, many elders sit in judgment of other members and base their... ummmmm... final decision... on whether THEY think the person is "repentant" or not. Now, let's say one is TRULY sorry... but just isn't the "oh my gawd you lofty elders please have mercy on my poor sinning behind and I'll be good from here on" kind of person. Well, from some elders' perspective, such one is "not repentant." Why? Because they don't "LOOK" repentant. And so, the "judgment" comes down: DF'd... because he didn't APPEAR to be "repentant."

  On the other hand, another member is absolutely unrepentant, in fact, he doesn't even believe in God... but knows all he has to do is ACT like he's "repentant"... and he can avoid a world of "trouble." So, he goes into a meeting and whines, cries, perhaps even begs. Hangs his head down, wrings his hands... "promises" to "never do it again." And, voila! By the looks of it, HE is "repentant"... and so he's given a pass. And he does this... several, if not many times... gaining a pass, each time.

  My point is that, as with such scenarios, looks here on this board can be deceiving, too. In that light, I would ask you to not read too much into much of what is posted here too hastily, but give yourself a little time. Read other posts from those who are posting here and try and see if you can get a little more "insight." WHY is this one responding that way... or that one saying such and so? What may have transpired before, even on another thread? In short, give yourself some time. If you can.

  In other words... don't always let the "smooth taste"... uh, "talk"... fool 'ya!

  Again, peace to you!

  A slave of Christ,

  SA

  P.S. Just so YOU know... I am not angry. Not in the least. Please... do not misinterpret my using caps as an indication of anger - it isn't. It's just that I type REALLY fast... and so it's just easier to use caps than, say, italics, etc. Really, that's all it is. But I'm not even an angry person. Actually, here's a thread that might help you see that (I TRY to post like things from time to time, but... well, ah well... some just can't receive the joy. Their problem, though... Peace!):

  http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/242393/1/YOWWW
• 

  OUTLAW

  I just found the tiny mind/heart comment mean.....NC

  People lose thier tempers when they are constantly picked at..

  Why is Shelby being held to a higher standard than the rest of the people on the planet?..

  Like I say..

  It`s not the first time Myelaine has done something like that..

  This time it wasn`t directed at just Shelby..

  It was directed at everyone on the other forum..

  The ones after Shelby on this thread..

  Could have just let Shelby blow off some steam..And..Let it go

  No..There has to be a war..

  People not involved in the dispute are going to keep adding fuel to the fire..

  I`m Done..

  Administration will handle this from here..

  .......................... ...OUTLAW
• 

  NewChapter

  You didn't call her on them here though NC, you said you disagreed with her beliefs, then called AGuest on what you perceived to be hers. Why? Couldn't you have let the two of them sort their own disagreement and not take a side? Then in comes Cofty and EP, and all within minutes.

  I can see why you view it this way, Loz. But think about it. Myelaine had just been corrected by Ang. That was pretty much the final word, and I certainly did not post any disagreement to it. Should I have piled on to a point that had been clearly made, actually dramatically made? It should have been the last word. But then Aguest came and posted some very mean things about Myelaine after Ang had spoken. Personally I would have let it sit, since the final authority had already handled it, but that is not everybody.

  So here is how I looked at it. Try to see it from my eyes for a moment. I felt that Myelaine had already been pretty firmly put in place over some remarks. It was done. I thought it was wrong to use it as an excuse to come and batter her personally. I didn't feel it was inappropriate to point that out. In a sense, the judge had spoken, but does that give us an excuse to come in and kick the accused? I don't think so. And please remember, I did not lob insults in stating what I stated. I just made it clear that I was uncomfortable with coming after someone that had been reprimanded, and hadn't posted since. I don't think this is wrong.

  Can you see my viewpoint a little? Just a little? I just ask that you stop assigning motives to me, and look at this as a whole. As far as Cofty and EP, I think they did the same, but we didn't discuss it at all. So they acted independently, and I think they can speak for themselves.
• 

  Lozhasleft

  Lol sorry loz, i meant after i quoted her you didnt further the discussion on my perceived insult.. EE

  You were being facetious EE, I didn't consider it worth response. But you still haven't answered who you believe my 'teacher' to be, and why? Oh and by the way, I've been calm all evening.

  Loz x
• 

  AGuest

  Floors are dry, washer's stopped. So, gotta go. Thank gawd... and praise JAH.

  HAPPY THANKSGIVING... and PEACE... to everyone!

  A slave of Christ,

  SA