The "Flood" in Noah's day--why wasn't that Armageddon enough?

by Terry 63 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • ablebodiedman
    ablebodiedman
    If he is going to give "free will" at the point of a gun and STILL NOT ACHIEVE His aims---then allowing the clock to run on yet another Armageddon-style holacaust just seems pointless and redundant.

    Is that a question or a statement?

    If it is a question:

    Then I think that there is only one very extraordinary thing that "free will" affords that might make all the suffering worthwhile.

    ........................ Love

    Without "free will", love is not possible!

    You cannot command someone to "Love".

    It HAS to be voluntary.

    I think that all of the armageddons both past and future are worth it even if there is only just one small handful of volunteers left.

    What is the alternative?

    God is Love.

    abe

  • Finkelstein
    Finkelstein

    If god was a truly loving and just god he could have just whacked the Nephilim and left everyone else alone.

  • blondie
    blondie

    Remember that the WTS teaches that the earth was a lifeless rock until 48,000 years ago. The WTS says that the earth could be over 4 billion years old and still agree with the bible view of creation. But if science shows that life was on earth years before that, the WTS is SOL.

    First creative day 7,000 years But

    Second creative day 7,000 years

    Third

    Fourth

    Fifth

    Sixth Total 42,000 years

    Seventh (began after the creation of Eve which the WTS teaches we are into over 6,000 years)

  • Cold Steel
    Cold Steel

    What are you missing?

    Quite a bit, actually. First, you have no idea how wicked and degenerate people had become in the days of Noah. According to one extrabiblical account, Enoch beheld the Lord weeping and asked, "How can you, the great God of Heaven weep?" The he was shown the flood in vision prior to its happening. Like Abraham, he reasoned with the Lord and sought the Lord that he should turn away his anger. But then the Lord showed Enoch the people themselves, what was in their hearts and what went on in secret. After that, Enoch was wroth with the wickedness he saw and in essence said, "You should wipe them from the earth!"

    Things aren't always as they appear in polite society. It's difficult to imagine intelligent beings burning and sacrificing their own infants to idols and giving way to gluttony, bebauched sexual practices and practicing the basest villiany possible to the point that they're beyond any hope of repentance. The legend of the flood is one that is had among all the nations of the earth, and it represented the baptism of the earth by water. Armageddon is the battle that will take place just before Jesus returns to the earth with fire, representing the baptism of the earth by fire and the Holy Spirit. Even so, the Lord will spare one-sixth of the enemy troops because they lacked complicity in the attack of Jerusalem.

    One professor of theology I know was one time the Number 3 man in the FBI. While in that post he was struggling with how the Lord could destroy an entire people. He told me that one night he was having dinner with some friends when there was a knock at the front door. It was several FBI agents with a critical matter that required his attention. He joined them in an adjoining room and was subjected to details, photos and testimony that made him so physically sick that he went into the bathroom and threw up. That night, on returning home, he wrote the segment covering the flood and man's ability to resort to the most disgusting and sickening behavior in the books he was writing on the Old Testament. Over the years, he's never forgotten that night and the effect that paperwork had on him.

    It's easy to second guess God, but it's not generally a good idea in my book. This doesn't mean God didn't love the people He destroyed; they are His children, just as we are. But they didn't cease from being. Instead, when their bodies died, they were put in sort of a penalty box, where they stayed until the crucifixion of Jesus. Peter writes:

    For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit: By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison, which sometime were disobedient when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water. (1 Peter 3:18-20)

    He later explained: " For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. (1 Peter 4:6) In other words, they will be judged as men in the flesh even though they live as spirits. The prison corresponded also to "Paradise" (a place of rest, or more precisely, a place of "the king's rest"). Thus the thief on the cross also became one of those who was preached to.

    Not all were equally as wicked in Noah's day, but my point is the God "wipes out" no one. He just...ummm...changes their scenery. Even those destroyed at Jesus' coming will be very much alive in spirit. And though they may be punished, it will not be forever. Some believe that Hell is both temporary and remedial. And ultimately men will be their own tormentors.

    (P.S. -- The "nephilum" is a fanciful story and did not refer to angels at all. This issue of "giants" is an interesting topic and one for another topic.)

  • *lost*
    *lost*

    CS yep. . peeps are so busy bashing God, they let the devil off scott free. ( of course not saying definitely there is/was the existence of either )

    theoretically and hypothetically. ( got to learn to talk like a lawyer round here on this subject )

    Even though all of the information and knowledge is there and it explains perfectly the why's and what fors. I guess people can't understand those parts of the theoretical hypothetical story.

  • Cold Steel
    Cold Steel

    Yep, even if one dismisses everything in the Old and New Testaments, the stories should be told in their proper context. Whenever people begin accusing God of genicide, I know they're only reading what they've read elsewhere. Some parts of religion are horrible, but those parts invariably take place when God is no longer speaking and men have fallen into apostasy. Take the Inquisition for example. Once the Christian church became the vassal of Rome, and after the seven eccemunical councils, there was little of the original church left. "They teach for doctrines the commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power thereof."

    In the apocryphal Gospel of Thomas, which purportedly contains a number of genuine sayings of Jesus, Jesus taught:

    "The kingdom of the father is like a certain woman who was carrying a jar full of meal. While she was walking on the road, still some distance from home, the handle of the jar broke and the meal emptied out behind her on the road. She did not realize it; she had noticed no accident. When she reached her house, she set the jar down and found it empty."

    The idea is that as the church progresses, it would gradually lose the spiritual gifts that made it so unique. So gradual the process, no one would notice until only the shell, or empty form, was left. So the early church fully expected the apostasy, and as it later was fulfilled, church leadership kept pushing these prophecies into the future until they no longer understood they had come to pass. Some Catholics thought they were fighting the predicted apostasy by holding the Inquisition. Instead, they were actually fulfilling it!

  • cyberjesus
    cyberjesus

    This god its an idiot. And also his angels he created. God needs to prove to his angels that his creAtion cant rule by itself.... The same angels that were looking at woman... Duh dude god. You should ve created an Eden strip club and problem solved.....

  • jam
    jam

    Blondie: I can,t recall but what explanation is given(by WT)

    in Genesis 1, after each creative day "evening and the morning

    another day? Verses 5,8,13,19,23 and 31. (1 day =7000 years)

    In other words, are they saying evening and morning appeared

    after 7000 years, there was only days for 7000 years each creative

    day?

  • cyberjesus
    cyberjesus

    Thank god for math

  • notsurewheretogo
    notsurewheretogo

    Have I missed something here? The society does not teach (now) that each day in Genesis is 1,000 or 7,000 days old...they say a creative "day" is a peroid of time of indeterminite length thus according to them the earth could be billions of years old with life appearing well before 7,000 years ago...

    What they cannot get away from is humans being only 6,000 years old as a family since the believe in the bible which is vastly contrary to archealogical evidence...

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