by jerome 132 Replies latest watchtower bible
actually, moxy, "had been" is the pluperfect passive indicative.
Perfect passive indicative would be "have been"
think of imperfect as past tense, but occuring over a long period of time..."was" and "were" or "used to" are used for imperfect...like "the war was waged...over a long period of time" This makes sense because we weren't talking about a specific point in time where there was "the word" but a long period of time.
bellum gerebat
err...moxy was right...i didn't see the "past" after his "perfect"...past perfect is indeed the same as pluperfect.
I guess my mistake was to retort with the same level of maturity of AlanF-uck. He started with the name-calling and instead of rising above it, I responded to him in the same manner.
I've been hard on other people I know. If I was the instigator or initiator of this kind of low-life behavior, I'm sorry. It's not typical of me.
But seeing AlanF-ucks numerous posts, insults are his standard trade and MO, and they are not directed solely at me. As I will show with the following quote, this kind of behavior from a "lifer" is/was predictable.
So AlanF, I'm sorry. I should have picked up on it earlier. It's something you can't help. And yes, I am being condescending, but ONLY for your benefit. Hey, I had to get one last one in.
It's from a book I first read around 1988 and I am in the process of reading it again. I am surprised at all the revisions and updates to this edition. I do find it rather duplicitous (using his words) at times but he does make some valid points.
I do think many should enjoy the following:
"... in the [6/]22[/00 iss.] of [A!] [The WTB&TS] warn that "generalizations tend to obscure important facts about the real issues in question, and they are frequently used to demean entire groups of people." A [para] on [p.] 6 reads: Name calling
Some people insult those who disagree with them by questioning character or motives instead of focusing on the facts. Name-calling slaps a negative (italics, mine), easy-to-remember label on a person, a group, or idea. The name-caller hopes that the label will stick. If people reject the person or idea on the basis of the negative label instead of weighing the evidence for themselves, the name-caller's strategy has worked.
Franz, Raymond, Crisis of Conscience -The struggle between loyalty to God and loyalty to one's religion : Commentary Press:2000: 3rd ed. pp 33-34.
I originally came to this site seeking camaraderie. A sharing of experiences of people who had the same background I have had. But then I reached a level of awareness that many people here are not here to seek "truth" as I am.
Many are here trading one lie for another. As long as it is not a lie that the WTB&TS teaches, it's OK. Now, my emphasis has changed somewhat; it is to let many know that they are no better than the people they point the finger at in condemnation. For all-intents-and-purposes, I suppose I am no better. -He said with a false sense of humility.
I come away many times with the following ringing in my ears: "It's ONLY the WTB&TS lies we are here to expose, and truth be damned."
And I feel that I have proved this point many times. So many can go on ignoring the fact that much as they did when they were part of the WTB&TS, they continue to do now.
I see threats, scare tactics, incessant insults, discrediting someone for something as small as spelling; which even AlanF has demonstrated even he has not perfected.
I've noticed that when the "favored" crowd makes these little mistakes, it's overlooked, as it should be. But God forbid when an "outsider" does the same thing.
So go ahead, put a label on me, it ONLY proves the point even further.
Maybe if there are no spelling mistakes or grammar errors this post will make it to the likes of Nature and Scientific American, unless of course they can't get past that fragmented sentence.
Is 9:5,6 reads in the Jewish Publication Society translation:And his name is called Pele-joez-el-gibbor-abi-ad-sar-shalom; that the government may be increased,and of peace there be no end...
The metaphoric embodiment of Israelite renal power (or a specific personage acting as this power) is given a name/title which is properly translated as:" Wonderful in counsel is God the Mighty,the Everlasting Father,the Ruler of peace."
This is completely consistent with other Bibical and non-Bibical Jewish names, in the attributing greatness and ultimate authority to YHWH the God of Israel.This is not a prophecy about Jesus at all.Slipshod translating by Christians has incited countless fruitless debates.
UnclePenn, I could accept that. Its the closest I have seen, on this board, to my own beliefs. At least you're not saying that Jesus is an Angle, or a lesser god. Or that he wasn't the messiah until the age of 29. PEACE!
Break the chains that bind you,
unless, of course, you're into that sort of thing.
Dearest Alan,
It never ceases to amaze me how well you can repeatedly demonstrate your total lack of social skills. Poor Alan, he got burned by the WT cult, boo hoo, first you get mad then you get even, yah we can all see that. Well, you'll get your revenge Alan but remember who it is you have a problem with, you cracker, peace of shit, wannabe power broker, gutless boytoy $2 whore, name calling bitch, cry baby, asshole.......if I know a thousand words that mean lack of humanity, I would paint your picture with them, humm well maybe punk will do. How do you like it bitch? now go away the grownups are talking. lol Just kidding.....you can sit in the corner.
your superior and overlord.
Willy
Maybe this will clear up the John 1:1 mystery. As you can see, the NWT has it wrong! I am sure there are many sites that say the same thing. I did a simple search and this came up.
http://www.studybibleforum.com/htm_php.php3?do=show_marg_and_gh&b=43&c=1&v=1
NASB John 1:1 (A)In the beginning746 was (B)the Word3056, and the Word3056 was (C)with God2316, and (D)the Word3056 was God2316.
AMPLIFIED John 1:1 IN THE beginning [before all time] was the Word (Christ), and the Word was with God, and the Word was God Himself. [Isa. 9:6.]
Cross References:
Related verses.
A Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
B John 1:14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth.
C John 17:5 "Now, Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was.
D Phil 2:6 who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,
Hebrew-Aramaic & Greek Dictionary:
(#) is number of times this NASB word was translated from the original language. Show verses containing
this Strong's number:
Greek Heb.
746 archê; from 757; beginning, origin:--beginning(38), corners(2), domain(1), elementary(1), elementary*(1), first(1), first preaching(1), principalities(1), rule(4), rulers(6).
2316 theos; of unc. or.; God, a god:--divinely(1), God(1267), god(6), God's(27), God-fearing(1), godly(2), godly*(1), gods(8), Lord(1).
3056 logos; from 3004; a word (as embodying an idea), a statement, a speech:--account(7), account*(1), accounting(2), accounts(2), answer(1), appearance(1), complaint(1), exhortation*(1), have to do(1), instruction(1), length*(1), matter(4), matters(1), message(10), news(3), preaching(1), question(2), reason(2), reasonable(1), remark(1), report(1), said(1), say(1), saying(4), sayings(1), speaker(1), speech(10), statement(18), story(1), talk(1), teaching(2), thing(2), things(1), utterance(2), what he says(1), what*(1), word(179), words(61).
Break the chains that bind you,
unless, of course, you're into that sort of thing.
Dearest Wiz:
here are some examples of your attempts at seeking comeraderie:
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=22863&site=3&page=5
>In the words of the drug addict and continuous trouble-maker,Rodney King; which resulted in a burning city and the deaths of @54 people:
"Can't we all just get along."
It really makes me wonder, how many of you people here, like to act and think that you are better than Jdubs.
your pagan Xmas was just less than 2 months ago. Where's your love?<
This was a post that had absolutely nothing to do with the watchtower. It was about Simon and Tina. Nobody said a word about watchtower. You just breezed in, said something obviously intended to be hurtful, and you wonder why Alan acts the way he does towards you.
____________________________________________________________________
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=10484&site=3&page=2
This guy who claims he is was a PO, how do you verify that he is telling the truth. These forums can be so impersonnel, a person can make up any identity. This can just be some wack job posting just to foment hatred for a certain group of people. Did you ever think it could all be made up?
If true, this person is just getting a taste of his own medicine. It'll stop and he knows it. To call it harassment in the tone he appears to be using, is way out there. His internal struggle will continue for some time, but the visits will stop.
This last was Aug 22, 2001. your date of registration was Aug 20, 2001 12:39. Two days later, you were REALLY looking for comeraderie...Someone says two people come to his house uninvited and harrass his family and you say the above. And you wonder why Alan acts the way he does towards you.
__________________________________________________________________
There's plenty more where this comes from. Snide, cruel remarks. That isn't what I'm taking issue with. It's your claim...about coming here to seek comeraderie. You, sir or madam, came to this forum specifically to engage in the kind of behavior that you did.
There is something that many of us here on the forum have learned that you, sir or madam, have not.
BEWARE THAT PAPER TRAIL.....
John 1:1 :: New International Version (NIV-IBS)
John 1
1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
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John 1:1 :: New American Standard Bible (NASB)
Listen to this
1 (1) In the beginning was (2) the Word, and the Word was (3) with God, and (4) the Word was God.
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John 1:1 :: New Living Translation (NLT)
1In the beginning the Word already existed. He was with God, and he was God.
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John 1:1 :: King James Version (KJV)
John 1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
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John 1:1 :: Amplified Bible (AMP)
John 1
1IN THE beginning [before all time] was the Word ([1] Christ), and the Word was with God, and the Word was God [2] Himself.(1)
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John 1:1 :: Revised Standard Version (RSV)
John 1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
John 1:1 :: NIV (verse by verse) (NIV)
John 1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
John 1:1 :: Worldwide English (New Testament) (WE)
John 1
1 The Word already was, way back before anything began to be. The Word and God were together. The Word was God.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
John 1:1 :: Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
John 1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God;
------------------------------------------------------------------------
John 1:1 :: Darby Translation (DARBY)
John 1
1 In [the] beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
John 1:1 :: American Standard Version (ASV)
John 1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.picknowl.com.au/homepages/rlister/jw/jwtrin.htm
by Siegfried Strohbach,
Ex- Jehovah's Witness
THE DEITY OF OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST
It is important to know that the Witness is holding in his hands a
Bible which has been deliberately twisted to back up their uninspired
doctrines. According to their own definition the Witnesses make our
Lord Jesus Christ a created being and a false god. In nearly every
publication of this cult you can read that Jehovah is the only true God. By this they mean the Father only. By saying that our Lord Jesus
Christ is only a god, in even rendering it so in their own
translation in John 1:1, they automatically make our Lord Christ Jesus a false god.
Just a few scriptures to prove the Deity of our Lord Jesus Christ. In
Matthew 14:33, 15:25, 20:20, 28:9 and 28:17 we read our Lord Jesus
Christ was worshipped and he never refused it. Angels always refused
to be worshipped (see Rev. 19:10 and 22:8-9).
So our Lord Jesus Christ can never be Michael the Archangel as the
Wimess cult teaches without any Scriptural justification. Isaiah 9:6
calls Him the Mighty God. Thomas says in John 20:28 to Jesus "My Lord
and my God" (literaly "The Lord of me and the God of me"). Exodus
3:13-16 God calls Himself I AM and in John 8:58 our Lord Jesus calls
Himself I AM. Many hundreds more scriptures could be quoted to prove
beyond any doubt Ihe Deity and equality of our Lord Jesus Christ with the Father. But normally the Witnesses will say "But". One of the most common words a Witness uses is "But".
Only the Lord can open the eyes of the cultist. As Luke 18:27 says, "The things which are impossible with men, are possible with
God".
---------------------------------------------------------------------
The King James Version (Authorized)
Joh 1:1
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
jEn ajrch'/ h\n oJ lovgoß, kai; oJ lovgoß h\n pro;ß to;n qeovn, kai; qeo;ß h\n oJ lovgoß.
Ok, I know that did not turn out right but that garbage above is the Greek words for John 1:1, word for word. translated...
En Arche En Ho Logos Kai Ho Pros Ho Theos Kai Theos En Ho.
En(Preposition)= in, by, with, among, at, on, through
Arche= beginning, origin
En(Verb)= was were had been had
Ho= which, who, the things, the son , (miscellaneous)the
Logos= a word ,the sayings of God ,decree, mandate or order
Kai= and, also, even, both, then, so, likewise
Ho= which, who, the things, the son , (miscellaneous)the
Pros(Preposition)= unto, to, with, for, against, among, at
Ho= which, who, the things, the son , (miscellaneous)the
Theos=God , god, godly, God-ward
Kai=and, also, even, both, then, so, likewise
Theos= God , god, godly, God-ward
En= was, were, had been, had
Ho= which, who, the things, the son , (miscellaneous)the
Well, hopefully you get the picture here that NWT is wrong in saying that the WORD is "A" God. Obviously you need to REALLY know what you are reading to do a good translation and ALL the Bibles above show the same translation.
Alan, is this reply good enough for you?
Break the chains that bind you,
unless, of course, you're into that sort of thing.
OK, who broke page 6? It's going way to far to the right. I hate scrolling to read!
Break the chains that bind you,
unless, of course, you're into that sort of thing.
