@LostGeneration ,I agree there are many questions unanswered in the Bible ,is that enough reason to refute Jesus' historicity or God's power all together ?May I suggest we wait and see .We will be given the answers in time .
Did Jesus really exist?
by slimboyfat 97 Replies latest watchtower bible
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raymond frantz
@designs ,don't confuse Jesus ,with evil Christianity that uses his name for manipulation and power ...
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slimboyfat
No, where is Jesus in the gospels? That's the question. Almost every part of the gospels can be explained with reference to earlier narratives or tropes. If there was a real Jesus at the heart of the stories then why do the gospel authors rely so heavily on earlier narratives in their compositions?
Isn't the better explanation that Jesus was a divine figure who was worshipped, as many were at that time, and that earthly stories gradually came to be associated with him?
The very earliest Christian sources do not mention an earthly Jesus, only a supernatural one. Isn't that an extremely odd state of affairs if a Palestinian Jew named Jesus really was the basis for the Christian faith?
Have you heard of The Ascension of Isaiah? It shows that the earliest Christians conceived of Jesus entirely in terms of a divine figure to be worshipped. They knew nothing about Jesus as a man who walked about on earth.
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adamah
RF said-
The first century Jews crucified him for being a threat to their system !
Nope, the Romans crucified Jesus for sedition, as a threat to the power of Caesar; the land of Palestine had been taken over by the Roman Empire, long before (although the account of Jews crucifying Jesus was likely inspired by the infamous account of Hasmonean ruler Alexander Jannaeaus killing 800 Jewish rebels by crucifixion, circa 80BC.)
You REALLY should read a book like Reza Aslan's recent best-seller "Jesus: Zealot" in order to gain insight into the proper historical context (ironic, since you accused Cofty of taking your quote "out of context", when it wasn't anything CLOSE to an example of such).
Adam
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designs
ray- It is by the supposed words of this Jesus in the NT that millions of his followers took up the sword, spear, arrow, rope, fire anything they could get their hands on to murder and rape millions of people over the centuries. If Jesus lives, as you assert, he didn't raise a finger to stop this genocide. For that you can keep your Jesus.
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raymond frantz
@designs ,Jesus never promoted killing of others in the name of religion .If his supposed followers did that then it is their fault. On the other hand the Quran openly promotes the subversion of others with use of violence as a good thing
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designs
Oh yes he did, his scenario of the End Times and returning with his angels and followers to kill the wicked was all his crazy ass followers needed. Transference.
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raymond frantz
@SLIMBOYFAT ,isn't "Ascention of Isaiah"a late second century apocryphal text made up from different sources with an unknown author ?Can that be used as evidence for historicity of Jesus or more likely as a Gnostic apocrypha document of short?
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raymond frantz
@designs ,don't give me your psychonalysis lingo! YOu call it Transference I call it Faith ,faith is based in facts is not a feeling ,that's blind faith(your blind faith to psychoanalysis maybe)
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designs
Yes Faith, these faithful took up arms against the 'Christ Killers' and slaughtered Jews by the millions, lovely god you have there.
Go worship him, spend your life devoted to him, its your life to live just don't pretend or suppose this character as anything worthy of my faith.