Does This Make Me A Racist?

by Englishman 77 Replies latest jw friends

WhyNow2000

If blacks have it so much better than white would you "wish / switch" to be black?
Nemesis

yrs2long:
assigned attitudes and intentions to the groups he spoke of which he really has no way of knowing. . . because they want to be taken care of and don't want to work and so on
In regard to what? It’s pretty obvious if people travel half way around the world when they could have made an asylum claim in any other of the multitude of countries they have passed through to get here. We are famous for being a soft touch—there is an international trade in human cargo, it’s big money shipping immigrants across Europe and from further a field. Show me one country that gives as much as we do to undeserving foreigners. As for those who arrive, we have been handing it out to many for decades with little to no improvement in their progress, while others get off their but and apply themselves. I saw it all the time at school, if the Indian can get of their arse and apply their brain so can the Pakistani sat next to him, or the black in the next chair. A large amount of black youths don’t even go to school, their parents don't seen to give a damn, is it any wonder they end up as delinquent street robbers?
when racism includes racial prejudice. . . Would he not also have to include housing and employment discrimination
Well that is a rather circular argument, all racism is prejudice. And I did bring in housing, there is massive prejudice, and it’s against the natives. They are under represented in all sectors. Makes me laugh when we have what is called CRE [the commission for racial equality] an organisation that is supposed to represent the entire United Kingdom, and guess how many white natives they have with the power controlling commissioners [like a Governing Body]? I will tell you, there are 12 on the commission, and only 1 is white, none of the rest were even born in this country! The UK is 95% white, and we get less than 8.5% representation! Out of the staff also [over 200] only 29% are ‘white British’, which can include any pale skin foreigner who has managed to get a passport. Come to the UK and see how many blacks, Asians, and other non-whites you see sleeping on the streets, there are virtually zero! They are all white natives who get the luxury of sleeping in the freezing cold with the junkies, filth, and diseases. Come and look at the council jobs where ethnic minorities are grossly over represented, no one seems to care about that, or when they frequently are incapable of doing the job. Just look at Hackney [in London], a Labour run black council, now so corrupt and incompetent they are £50,000,000 in debt! Look at Lambeth, another black run labour council, they have been prosecuted many times for abusing their white minority staff and now have the pride of being the most violent crime ridden council borough, not just in London, but the whole of Europe! I could go on and on, but you are obviously not interested, and it would fall on deaf ears. This is not America, yrs2long, please don’t forget that.
Nemesis

If blacks have it so much better than white would you "wish / switch" to be black?
There is a difference between ‘so much help’ and then what you choose to do with it. No, I would never change my race, I am very happy to be English, why the heck would I want to be black? What help and benefits would they all get if they went back to Jamaica and Africa? A heck of a lot less than they get here! They already get too much help and just squander it like the Africans do in their own continent with foreign aid.
jwsons

Englishman went to China for a research course in 3 yrs.
He always avoid to go to the Club at the corner of Tiamen
Square, where all English-speaking reporters used to be there
and avoids to speak English even though he surrounded by
English and English-speaking friends for he hates "ghetto"!!!!
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=26245&site=3
After those 3 years, Englishman decides to stay there
because he can see the hospitality of Chinese people. He
applied for a citizenship but he couldn't understand well
Chinese writting. Luckily, the offical is a Hongkong Chinese,
can speak his English and kindly help him to use the interpreter
service availlable to fill the form (all E.T. characters!).
Englishman thought this Chinese man should shout "YES, YES you
should know 'our easy language' before you can be our citizen" (in reality, it's only easy
for people with the similar culture like Japanese or
Korean). Even if the INS official did shout to him,
he can only smile and answer in Chinese:
"Me no Mendaring spoking" eventhough there are
100 free Chinese-courses availlable(HeHeHe???).
Today, after 10 yrs in China, Englishman still can not write Chinese
but he did enjoy love and kindness from the true good neighbours.
His wife is the black-hair Chinese girl with red-Hawaiian-dress who's
dancing on the left picture. His wife doesn't believe any barriers
can stop they love each other as human being. She studied English
for she knows he has difficulties with WacoTowerism. They are now
living in happiness with a little boy can speak two languages.
However, Englishman' sister-in-law (the blue-Hawaiian-dress dancer
on the right) can not understand why Englishman could ever believe
in a couple of decades about a Paradise, where Eve tried to repeat
"Flu-wer" after Adam when she first saw the tulips field in Holland !
Englishman now feels fully happy and he even can sing-a-long with Mr.
Bing Lee(an owner of a couple of electrical shops in China) "I like
Chinese ...foods" that 2UE radio plays every morning, while Englishman
enjoying Yum-Cha,looking his wife and his sister-in-law dance.
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How do you feel if someone in the Kingdom Hall said about you with others:
“Anyhow, he/she is a new baptizer” ?????. It’s a WacoTower ‘s typical sickness
==================================================
Then he wrote:
:
Can I just re-iterate something here. I don't care what colour a person is, be he purple or sky-blue-pink. I don't care where they come from, I believe eveyone should be treated equally and receive opportunities according to their merits.
My main point in starting this thread was to voice my frustration at persons who do not make an effort to adapt to their adopted country's customs and language.
LDH and Abaddon both made valid points that some persons are inacapable of learning a new language. I gave this some thought and my conclusion is that it is precisely this sort person who should not emigrate to another country
I agree with those words
And.. the Fact is:
When the British first land to Oceanic continent (Australia + islands).
The first thing they tried to do is to kill as much the local people as they can (we call them Aborigines here, similar to the Indian in State). Yes they tried to wipe out all the Aborigines at Tasmania state instead of tried to learn Aborigines language ! (Is it fair to suggest all the immigrants from Italy arrive UK and kill all Anglo-Saxon, then teach Italian ?). Eventhough long before British, the Chinese Gold-diggers already been in Tasmania around 4,000 years ago (according to a comment by Mr. John Law, a talk-show host of 2UE-radio about the existence of Dingo-dog came from China and we also have the word 'dinkum' in 'fair-dinkum' from these mine-diggers, whenever they find out the pure gold, they raise it up and shout 'chinkung,' means 'real, genuine, 100%'), they didn't try to wipe out the local people from this continent; and latter on, the French came but they didn't grasp this land, too (they left a lot of places that they named them in French, ie. Brighton le Sands, Matraville, Gladesville and all -ville).
If the British can not learn the local language (Aborigine Australian), should they come to this Oceanic continent?
Prisca

John Laws is an overpaid radio DJ, he is not an authority on Australian history.
BTW, jwsons, what is your native language?
yrs2long

Allow me to demonstrate for you what you call my circular reasoning:
Say there are 5000 white people in England and 5000 blacks. And let's say 3000 of the white people feel superior to the blacks because of their race. On the other hand, only 1000 of the blacks feel racially superior to the whites. Of the 1000 blacks who feel superior, 10 have committed crimes against the whites. According to your reasoning, this means that the blacks are more racist. But I disagree. Here is one definition of racism( courtesy of dictionary.com):
rac·ism n.
1.The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
2.Discrimination or prejudice based on race.
You see, racism includes more than just racist acts, like discrimination and hate crimes. It also includes prejudice, which includes: (also courtesy of dictionary.com)
1.a. An adverse judgment or opinion formed beforehand or without knowledge or examination of the facts.

b. A preconceived preference or idea.
2. The act or state of holding unreasonable preconceived judgments or convictions.

3. Irrational suspicion or hatred of a particular group, race, or religion.
As you will note, unless you conduct a poll of all of these residents and the residents answer truthfully, you would be hard pressed to get an accurate measurement of this form of racism. As I stated, this form of racism is difficult to measure and this is why I object to your statement that the blacks are more racist than the whites. What criteria were you basing this upon? Just race hate attacks? If that is the case, fine, provide documentation and reword your statement to reflect that. If not, that is why I mentioned prejudice, housing and employment discrimination. These would also need to be figured in if you want to spout racism statistics.
Here is your statement:
On just race hate attacks 165,000 (65%) in the year 2000 were committed by
non-white ethnic minorities against whites! That's less than 5% of the UK's population causing 65% of all race hate
attacks. When broken down to race it gets worse as for every 1 white racist in the white population there are 45 black
racists in the black population! 4,500% more racist in the black community is no joke.
Also by you:
I could go on and on, but you are obviously not interested, and it would fall on deaf
ears. This is not America, yrs2long, please don;t forget that.
There you go again, making statements which you cannot possibly know. Actually, I read your comments with some interest, as I admit I know very little about England or the UK. But when you start throwing figures around and guessing at motives and attitudes, am I really expected to take you seriously or think anything you say carries weight simply because you said it?
Sorry, I am at work today and hurriedly posting.
Nemesis

Hi yrs2long,
Allow me to demonstrate for you what you call my circular reasoning:
Say there are 5000 white people in England and 5000 blacks. And let's say 3000 of the white people feel superior to the blacks because of their race. On the other hand, only 1000 of the blacks feel racially superior to the whites. Of the 1000 blacks who feel superior, 10 have committed crimes against the whites. According to your reasoning, this means that the blacks are more racist.
Point one, that is not one of my illustrations but one of yours. And point two, you then proceed to use a false line of reason that I haven't used. Why do you assume there are 3000 whites that feel superior, and only 1000 blacks? Before you have even stated you make assumptions that are neither mine, nor rational when trying to be objective. Point three you use very dubious maths in your supposed calculations. How would I deduce that 10 black crimes denoted more racism? You haven't given any figures for the white crimes, and to boot your entire 50/50 split is not representative of here in the UK, or even in the US.
If you want a more realistic maths problem, then how would you answer this problem? There are 1000 whites, and 50 blacks in England. The whites commit 10 race hate incidents* on the blacks, and the blacks commit 20 race hate incidents on the whites. Which race is the most racist based on these figures?
You might answer from a maths point of view, “well the blacks appear to be committing twice as many attacks as whites commit, and therefore blacks are twice as racist.” That would be faulty maths, as the black population is not the same size as the white, if there were 1000 blacks that would be correct, but there are only 50! So 1 in 100 whites are committing a racially motivated offence, and 1 in 2.5 blacks are committing a racially motivated offence. Therefore the black population would be not just be twice as racist/violent/criminal etc. as the white community, but a staggering 40 times more racist/violent/criminal.
*A racially motivated incident is any incident that can have a racial basis/motivation, from a street brawl to gang rape to murder etc.
As you will note, unless you conduct a poll of all of these residents and the residents answer truthfully, you would be hard pressed to get an accurate measurement of this form of racism. . . What criteria were you basing this upon? Just race hate attacks? If that is the case, fine, provide documentation and reword your statement to reflect that. If not, that is why I mentioned prejudice, housing and employment discrimination. These would also need to be figured in if you want to spout racism statistics.
The British Crime Survey, and the Home Office, collate and gain the figures from all over the country from each police borough/district for the figures. They are not mine, but their figures. As for criteria, they are based on all the victims and the victimisers, unless you are suggesting all the white victims, of rape, robbery, and worse all made the colour of their attacker up, and so did any witnesses? But then if you reason like that you would have to be balanced and apply the same rational to all the non-whites also, therefore making it void.
As for housing, I have already spoken of. And employment would have to be related to their educational levels, which black men have the lowest in the capital, increasingly due to them being excluded due to violence, drugs, and other serous offences they commit in the schools. Many also do not even attend school, as you would find that out even from many black organisations. All of that is going to have a massive effect on employment. I also mentioned London councils, which you have also ignored. The same applies to transport workers and many other sectors that are massively over represented by non-white ethnic groups.
On just race hate attacks 165,000 (65%) in the year 2000 were committed by
non-white ethnic minorities against whites! That's less than 5% of the UK's population causing 65% of all race hate attacks. When broken down to race it gets worse as for every 1 white racist in the white population there are 45 black racists in the black population! 4,500% more racist in the black community is no joke.
As for race hate/violence/murder etc. It doesn’t take Einstein to work out that less than 5% of a population is committing over 65% of all hate related crime, that there is a major problem with that group. (That 65% is just crimes on whites, when one minority attacks another minority and these figures are collated, minority hate crimes figures committed by non-white ethnic groups are a lot higher than 65%), Splitting that 5% group down to their parts shows even worse figures than 65%. If you feel for every one white man attacking a black, there are 45 black men attacking whites, that this is OK, and of no concern then that just shows your inability to accept reality no matter how in your face it is. I have given specific figures, which you seem to reject as generalisations, why? They are based on ALL police forces areas, not just London. That takes in the entire population, and all crimes within a calendar year from April to April.
Your reaction doesn’t surprise me, no amount of black crime would convince you otherwise, your mind seems to be geared to just write it all off as some anomaly, but if they were reversed white for black, then you would hold the figures with great concern for the welfare of all the poor black victims—that’s not very consistent is it yrs2long? And more akin to what we experienced in the Watch Tower mindset. We see this all the time here, whenever a black person does something remotely worthy of credit, we are constantly told of their colour. We saw that with Halle Berry, “Thanks for the award, but look everyone, ‘I’M BLACK, yes BLACK and don’t you forget it. . .” The same here: “a black man has got a music award. . .”, not just a man, but also a BLACK man “look everyone he’s black”. But if he’d just mugged and raped a 12 year old white girl we are suppose to instantly ignore his race, and not utter a word of condemnation—well I don’t buy that double standard crap. White scum, black scum, Pakistani scum all deserve equal condemnation. And when one group outstrips all the others with their crimes and prejudice then they will get publicity from me, even when the left-wing media shy away from reality, and cry racist to anyone who dares to open their mouth and say the truth.
A few years back one the metropolitan police commissioners [Paul Condon] gave the London street robbery figures, and mentioned that over 80% were committed by blacks. He got crucified for just speaking a factual truth, and got called all the names under the sun! If you don’t like reality yrs2long that is not my fault, it’s just how things are—if you choose to ignore it, fine—that’s your prerogative!
yrs2long

Are you for real? You just ignored my point entirely and posted just so you can rant and rave some more. I'm sorry I interrrupted your monologue. Carry on, you obviously have some issues and need to vent.
LDH

Nemesis,
It's my contention that RACE doesn't breed violence, poverty breeds violence.
Would you mind finding some stats for the following:
What percent of "Group X" (choose any group you've preivously cited) live at or below the poverty level?
What percent of same group live a 'middle income' lifestyle?
What percent of same group live a wealthy lifestyle?
And then would you extract such data to demonstrate:
What percent of Group X living in poverty/middle income/wealthy are responsible for the commission of those crimes?
Those would be statistics that would mean something.
Simmply saying "30% of Jamaicans commit crimes" would take on a whole different meaning if the data were extracted to read "30% of Jamaicans living in dire poverty committed violent crimes."
If it isn't too much trouble; you've got the stats handy.
Thanks,
Lisa
Nemesis

Hi Lisa,
What percent of "Group X" (choose any group you've preivously cited) live at or below the poverty level?
The problem with that Lisa is that we have millions of native whites who have lived for decades under the poverty line, and although the crime levels are higher in all poverty situations, that are dramatic magnitudes higher with some communities like black West-Indians and their descendants, many of whom are living in situations far better than many natives, and who also have far more resources specifically just for them. Do you think blacks are the only ones living in poor areas? I can tell you they are not, but they stand out as the most criminal group. 1 in 4 (14.3 million) people in the UK were living in poverty in 1998/9 compared with under 1 in 10 in 1979. Poverty has risen sharply. In 1983, 14% of households lacked three or more necessities because they could not afford them. That proportion had increased to 21% in 1990 and to over 24% in 1999. By the end of 1999, 26% of the British population were living in poverty, measured in terms of low income and multiple deprivation of necessities. Roughly 9.5 million people cannot afford adequate housing conditions.
The natives of the UK are the most poverty stricken of all, and by your reasoning their proportion of crime should be the same as all other poor groups, but it isn’t, as West-Indians commit crimes/hate incidents far in excess of all others groups regardless of their socio-economic conditions. They are also six times more likely to be in prison compared to all other groups.
It's my contention that RACE doesn't breed violence, poverty breeds violence.
I have never said “race breeds violence”, It’s not just poverty, it’s their cultural attitude and morals/ethics (or lack of them) of certain races that cause the problems.
And to bring this thread back to where Englishman started it: “So I do sometimes wonder why people from another country choose to emigrate to Britain if they do not intend to adopt the host’s country’s culture and language. It would seem to be a one way street, where some immigrants love the UK welfare state but put nothing much back into their adopted country in the way of making a useful contribution to British society.”
Any immigrant community is not contributing and integrating if they 1. Can’t bothered or do not wish to learn some basic English. 2. Expect the natives to house, feed and take care of them costing the natives billion of pounds, at the same time as letting the destitute natives rot in poverty or sleep in the streets. 3. Have no qualifications/skills and do not work. 4. Have very little knowledge or respect for the natives culture with no intention of changing that, but then hypocritically expect the natives to respect their culture and learn about it and pay for festivals related to it. 5. Cause a disproportionately large amount of crime and hate regardless of their socio-economic status and situation. Who on earth would want to encourage immigrant groups like that to their country?
I welcome immigrants who 1. Learn some English, and mix with the natives and get to know them. 2. Rent/buy private housing with their own money. 3. Have some qualifications/skills and work for a living paying tax, which helps the country. 4. Abide by the laws of the land and have respect for their fellow countryman and the culture and heritage of the natives.

Does This Make Me A Racist?

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