nicolaou asked me a question. How will I answer? (page 2)

Band on the Run

I believe the universe would be the same universe. It exists. Altho I can't keep up with the recent findings in particle physics and astronomy, the universe is real. The difference may be whether we perceive the universe as a friendly place or not. The universe has not changed. Our minds changed. I much prefer the classic bust to the woman in ectsasy. It creeps me out. The picture looks like one of Jesus is my boyfriend gals. Subatomic particles exist. It is a fact. I don't understand your reasoning, Kate.

Many people, my mom included, feel at peace with the mountains or ocean. The beauty and majesty leave an emotinal impression on them. I must say I am moved also by great scenes of nature. Hurricane or earthquake damage is very depressing. The law terms acts of nature's force "act of God," It must be as old as British common law. Humans saw violent cataclysms as Acts of God. God can be terrifying as in the Witnesses or a good force as in most churches today.

The universe is the universe. Our views change internally. The Alps or the American West can be breathtaking. I find masterpieces of art breathtaking, too. I am projecting my values. It starts with me. Humans may be have brains disposed to view things as beautiful or ugly. Urban blight is draining. I fail to see how subatomic particles prove God. Their existence is a neutral fact. I also read that it is much more complicated than just subatomic particles.Perhaps I misunderstand the point.

KateWild

Cofty, So you are refusing to answer the atheist question? Kate xx

Witness My Fury

Without. It's what reality looks like...

Read the bible again and ask yourself if that is what you ever see in the real world. or is it only in the mind of the believer. There is your answer.

bohm

Kate: "What would the universe look like with god?"

It depends on the notion of god; I am just going to assume you mean the christian god.

I think there are three key things which would be different provided a God like the christian existed. The first is the world would contain less terrible and easily preventable evil. Take for instance the cases where a psychopatic lunatic keep women as sex-slaves in an underground bunker, I see no just reason not to call the police and have them arest such a person and in particular I see no just reasons for God.

The second is God would not be hiding. If a loving god existed and wanted us to come to him, he would be easily able to demonstate his existence as clear and distinct as the table i am sitting at now. This problem is compounded by the fact God allow evil. One thing is to postulate it is perfectly reasonable for God to sit back and watch a women get raped to make some sort of point about how great he is, or because he feel it build character in the women to get raped, or because he feel it would infringe on the rapists free will to stop him, or because he just cant figure out how to prevent the rape without causing some worse evil; but the least he should do was to make it clear why he allowed such an evil.

The third is that the bible would not be in conflict with scientific discoveries (evolution, no flood).

cofty

Kate, my answer was serious. The world looks precisely as we would expect if it was the work of unguided natural processes

KateWild

Subatomic particles exist. It is a fact. I don't understand your reasoning, Kate.-BTOR

I was being socially inappropriate (rude), I was tired. It was a blanket assertion. A world without God is a world without sub-atomic particles, hence the world would not exist.

But I am trying to grasp it as a new concept, which cofty is refusing to do anyway. He just made the same assertion.

Kate xx

KateWild

bohm,

As an athiest, and one who understands my phys chem perspective. You have answered your veiws. Thank you. I am still thinking.....Kate xx

jgnat

Oh, he did answer. Which was the same as mine. There would be no change. Sub-atomic particles are not God.

bohm

Kate: Why is a world without god a world without sub-atomic particles?

Lets just take a humble photon. Why do we need God to have photons? photons pop in and out of existance in hard vacuum (simplifying this a bit), why does this process require god anymore than (say) a planet in orbit around a sun require god?

In fact, i see it exactly the other way around. It could have been the case the physics of the subatomic world had turned out like people imagined it to look like in the 19th century, ie. basically a miniature version of newtonian physics possible with some additional (classical) physics to solve the known puzzles.

I think such a world would raise a number of really good questions.. it would severely limit our ability to answer the question why our universe exist without resorting to a theistic explanation.

KateWild

Sub-atomic particles are not God.-jgnat

I agree, they just behave in a divine way, but all the particle physics is on the 10 page thread below

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/members/adult/267979/8/I-accept-that-science-cannot-prove-the-non-existence-of-God-But#.UqCFvPRdW8A

Kate xx

nicolaou asked me a question. How will I answer?

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