Jesus' Teachings - Helpful or Harmful? (page 12)

humbled

Really, cofty?

The practical reality of following Jesus' teaching still seems best known by the ignorant slave girls tortured by Pliny's orders. Jesus' teaching had them aspire not to lie,steal or commit adultery. Perhaps they felt they had their sins remitted, felt a return to dignity.

I felt that way. It is not a small thing. If you can give me a way to dignify the poor and the help ones who do wrong to a renewed life, tell me what it is. And how well would it "read" off the page in 2,000 years? Especially if some bumble fingers did the writing instead of you?

cofty

First what about my question above?

humbled

In the gospel of Mary, Simon Peter is even more derogatory of women than is here indicated-- as he feels slighted that Jesus talked so much to Mary.

so you truly think that Jesus was a misogynist?

cofty

According to the gnostic gospel of Thomas that you recommended to me, Jesus said "every woman who makes herself male will enter into the kingdom of heaven ."

He doesn't sound too enlightened to me.

cofty

he feels slighted that Jesus talked so much to Mary

The most parsimonious explanation is that Jesus and Mary were lovers.

humbled

This saying simply reminds me of the age old problem of discussing any equivalence of men and women in a pervasively misogynistic environment, one that only recognizes invidious comparisons in communicating that women even so DO have the mental power of men....

This point is made in this story of Teresa o' Avila. She was a 16th century nun whose strong spirituality was matched by a mind also strong. Her confessor in trying to express to a fellow priest that this woman was not a vapourish nun who was subject to fancies of holiness, described her mental integrity by saying "she has a beard".

I hope you don't cavil at this by forcing me to prove that she didn't in fact HAVE a beard.

humbled

that they were lovers.... ?

There are credible arguments that she was even his spouse. Your point?

cofty

So Peter, who was to become very influential in the early church, expressed a deeply misogynistic attitude..

He said " Let Mariham go out from among us, for women are not worthy of the life".

It is impossible to exaggerate how damaging this notion was, and how vital it would be for Jesus to correct Peter in no uncertain terms.

But instead Jesus says... " I will lead her that I may make her male, in order that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every woman who makes herself male will enter into the kingdom of heaven. "

Not a single word to correct Peter and teach the truth that women and men are equals, but rather a requirement that women must become like men to enter the kingdom.

Yes I think Jesus was a misogynist just like most men of his time.

Your point?

That Jesus' closeness to Mary was not due to any enlightened view of women in general.

humbled

Is Mary the Magdalene the sister of Lazaras? It is thought not

Yet the Mary of Bethany , Lazaras' sister, didn't cook(like a man) for Jesus' visit, and she is not reprimanded when her sister complains about her.

Jesus well knew his followers,it seems. Peter complained about Mary magdalene in other writings--writings deemed heretical.

Yes Pete influenced the early church. And the patriarchal big "C" church persecuted for centuries that unbroken tradition of the women-are equal-to-men branch that HAD understood Jesus' teaching about women. One being the Cathars.

But to return to the OP. Jesus' teachings have been helpful--if you have ears to hear.

confusedandalone

Why didn't mighty Jesus just write a book himself so this multiple story hodge podge of magic and lies we have today wouldn't confuse people? That would be the real question

Jesus' Teachings - Helpful or Harmful?

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