If 'Jehovah' was REALLY a just ruler, he would do away with all humans and leave the Earth to the animals. At least animals don't ruin the Earth's environment like humans do.
The problems Bible believers have with Atheists is the burden of proof is on the Believer and we just do not have enough proof.
by booker-t 68 Replies latest watchtower bible
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Doug Mason
Have you ever thought about the countless creatures (etc) that are in a constant life-and-death struggle on the outside of your body and inside it?
Doug
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Focus
The problems Bible believers have with Atheists is not the burden of proof
but simply that the atheists are right.
Furthermore, the Bible is a load of rubbish. Utter tripe.
And I know it better than anyone else I've encountered to date. For reasons I'd prefer not to go into.
The bits of the Babble that are useful were common-sense and didn't need to be put there.
The best part - the Golden Rule - was stolen property.
The irrelevant, horrid, bizarre, nonsensical and false bits comprise the majority of the book.
Shakespeare afforded the KJV some beautiful text. Doesn't change the rotten nature of the inside of the fruit, though.
Aesop's Fables, Hans Christian Andersen and Harry Potter are all more consistent. intelligent and beneficial - whatever Timothy (the book) claims to the contrary. And there's more evidence they are true than that the Bible is the word of some gOD.
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Focus
("Born an Atheist" Class)
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Focus
"She brought up another question about animals and if Jehovah and Jesus really cares about animals then why do animals kill each other. This seems to contradict what Jesus told his disciples about Jehovah caring for a sparrow when it falls. I watch the nature channel and I literally start getting teary-eyed watching the lions and tigers shred a deer in a matter of minutes. I just have to wonder does Jehovah really care about those animals getting torn to pieces?"
Excellent question. For a 20-page discussion of that, please read this thread from start to finish:That it needs not just 20 pages of discussion but, historically, hundreds of thousands of pages of exegesis and apologia to defend it, should suggest to you, defender of truth, a simpler explanation.
"It ain't true."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor
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Focus
("Logic" Class)
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villagegirl
Jehovah will never forgive people he destroyed in the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah
In the above qoute, you are describing WT doctrine. The WT is no authority on
the mind of God. They have no idea who God forgives or what he cares about.
I was watching a program on birds, tropical birds, parrots to be exact and their life
in the wild. Parrots are playful, joyous and happy birds who in the wild live gregarious
and social lives. This was filmed in Australia. There were a few predators, but their
coloring protected them in their environment. The natural world is not Disneyland.
But I see far more beauty in the world than anything else. I do not know how men
come to the idea there is no "evidence" of intelligent design and purpose in this
universe. I see "evidence" everywhere in my daily life and observations.
I guess we all look at the same things and see it differently, or opposite,
depending on our own way of seeing. Looking for literal measurable calculations
and historical explanations in the Bible, may be naive. Perhaps it is more mystical
and like scientists observing a phenomena can change the outcome by the act of
observing it. Its called the observer effect. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6l5Zh7w9yQ
"The Observer Effect, a fundamental premise of quantum theory, raises an open question regarding the nature of existence. Numerous experiments over the past century allude to the role of consciousness in the construct of reality; it has been shown time and again that it is the act of observation itself that causes a wave function to collapse out of either/or uncertainty into what we experience as a particular reality... My reality. Your reality. Everybody's reality. "
As Niels Bohr once famously remarked, "Anyone who is not shocked by quantum theory has not understood it."So it may be the observer who has changed his own reality by his own perception
or created an alternate state that is not really connected to what he assumes is "real"
Some religiouos philosophies maintain we create the reality around us, much like the
observer effect in scientific observation.
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defender of truth
@Focus.. I'm an atheist myself, as you would know if you had bothered to read even the last page of that thread. Feel free to add your thoughts to it, the theists seem to have given up.. It's incredible how many people take one look at my moniker and lump me in with believers. The question of animal suffering is what led me to atheism.
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Finkelstein
This what happens when people believe ancient mythology, instead acknowledging it as being inherently fiction.
The ancients told many stories to create power and relevance to their gods, the Hebrews did more by scribing text,
other civilizations used pictographs on temples or places of worship, with the same intent.
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One thing that is quite inarguable is that humanity has endured the ignorance of the world in which we live,
the same world that the ancient Hebrews once lived in 3000 years ago.
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Gods were perceived as being connected with humanity by ancient civilizations for the simple reason that humanity
was created by Gods. There was simple no other direction for them to perceive anything else,
in comparison to what scientific knowledge we have today.
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All the perils of which humanity endures today is what the ancients endured themselves such as death,
sickness, wars, famine, catastrophic events such as earthquakes, floods lightning and thunder ...etc.
...and the ancients asked their gods for help and resolve of these problems .... ie. the Gospels
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cofty
I do not know how men [people] come to the idea there is no "evidence" of intelligent design and purpose in this universe. - villagegirl
I do. It is a direct result of learning about how the world works.
I still marvel at the beauty of it all but there is no longer any supernatural dimension. I find that demeans and trivialises it all.
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ablebodiedman
I do not know how men come to the idea there is no "evidence" of intelligent design and purpose in this universe.
Me neither.
The amount of evidence is overwhelming!
It can only be denied through ignorance or ridicule.
The burden of proof has been well taken care of.
In fact its not a burden except for the athiest who rather imagine the proof does not exist.
Its not the amount of evidence that keeps them in denial, ........ its something else.
abe
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cofty
That is such a thoughtless and arrogant remark ablebodiedman.
If you know of one single thing that requires intelligent design, and if you can explain it in your own words witout copy-paste, I would love to hear it.
Same goes for you Villagegirl.