UN FINDS WMD...OK saddam lovers, what now?

by dolphman 280 Replies latest social current

  • back2dafront
    back2dafront

    This is so dumb.

    Never ceases to amaze me how blind and ignorant people are.

    If Sadaam was such a big threat to the world, why aren't the NEIGHBORING COUNTRIES the ones instigating this war and supporting it???

    This whole thing is such clear bologne I'm not even gonna waste any more time on it.

    Get your heads out of your asses, people. This war is not going to do anyone any good. Gas prices will go up, and the hatred against the USA will INCREASE, which will lead to more terrorists attacks across the globe.

    Not to mention the thousands of lives that will be lost.

  • Realist
    Realist

    ashikita,

    the problem is that saddam is portrayed like a crazy, bloodthirsty madman. this is an OLD OLD game used by all sides and is called propaganda.

    saddam is a ruthless person but to portray him as a second hitler or stalin is rediculous.

    the people he gased were fighting against iraq...they were not "his" people. they fought for an independent state respectively to overthrow him.

    now i asked you what would the US government do if a part of the US would try to get independence from washington? ... i guess the civil war answers that question.

    back2dafront,

    exactly!!!!!!!!!!!

    this war costs you guys 50 to 100 BILLION DOLLARS!

    what does the average american get for this? NOTHING! only more hate against the US.

    Edited by - realist on 17 January 2003 17:20:48

  • Yerusalyim
    Yerusalyim

    Realist,

    So all those babies and old women that Hussein gassed, THEY were trying to overthrow him? No, they weren't. He wasn't attacking military forces, he was attacking women, children, BABIES, and old men. Justify that!

    Back,

    You asked,

    If Sadaam was such a big threat to the world, why aren't the NEIGHBORING COUNTRIES the ones instigating this war and supporting it???

    well, in large part because they are afraid of him. They saw what he did to Iran, they saw what he did to Kuwait, they're scared shitless. Turkey would be the only one MAYBE strong enough to take out Iraq, and as Iraq and Turkey both view the Kurds as ememies "The enemy of my enemy is my friend."

    The war is against Terrorism and those who support terrorists, ANY Terrorists. Not only has Sadam been funding the families of the suicide bombers, he's been giving money DIRECTLY to Hamas.

  • Realist
    Realist

    Yeru,

    i don't want to give the impression as if i would excuse any atrocities committed by saddam....however, you just said on the other thread that war always includes the loss of civilian lifes. especially with the history of the US (using carpet bombardments in most wars ...including afghanistan, correct me if i am wrong) i find it a little strange to use the death of 3000 woman and children during the conflict with the kurds as main reason to go to war now.

    you have stated two arguments for going to war....

    a) hussein supported the terrorists. -- for this there is no shred of evidence. none zero nothing. furthermore it wouldn't make any sense for him to support al-qaida and possibly direct US revenge against him. please tell me how this would make sense and what evidence CIA or anyone else showed that would suggest hussein is behind the 9 11 attack.

    b) hussein poses a threat to his neighbors. -- i have to ask you how you come to this conclusion. how can he possibly be a threat with the US controling the north as well as the south of iraq and him having nothing but worthless equipment from the 60ties. even if he would develop or possess WMD what could he do?

    tell me why he would start a new war or support anti US terrorism or use WMD if that would mean his certain destruction?

    the whole thing just doesn't make any sense.

    PS: if i am out of posts for today then i am gonna reply by editing this post.

    Edited by - realist on 17 January 2003 18:22:7

  • Yerusalyim
    Yerusalyim

    Realist,

    I'll try to go point by point with ya here. First, the US did NOT use carpet bombing in Afghanistan. We did kill civilians there, which is unfortunate, but go ask the afghanis if their glad we kicked out the Taliban.

    Second, where did you get this figure of 3000 women and children kurds killed by Saddam, it's been much much more.

    Was Hussein behind the 9-11 attack? Not as the master mind, the Czecs still insist inspite of the CIA's protestations to the negative, that Atta met with Iraqi intelligence in Prauge. This has not been disproved, just dismissed. Then there's the training center in Iraq attested to by Inspectors that was used to train terrorists intelligence agents how to take over a commercial airliner without guns, to include "using box cutters"

    Further, there were the documents recovered from Arafats headquarters by the Israelis that Saddam was funneling money to Hamas and Islamic Jihad both. You say this makes no sense. You're right. It also made no sense for Saddam to fight us in the first Gulf War when all he had to do was leave Kuwait. The guy's a megalo maniac as most/all dictators are, he doesn't have to make sense.

    As to possing a threat to his neighbors, he still destabalizes the region. We should leave troops in Kuwait and Saudi until Hussein dies? Then his son takes over who is even wackier than Saddam. If he has Nukes he can threaten from within his own borders without ever leaving Iraq. Good for him, bad for world peace.

    tell me why he would start a new war or support anti US terrorism or use WMD if that would mean his certain destruction?

    the whole thing just doesn't make any sense.

    It's not just a matter of him STARTING a new war, its the matter of him being able to threaten his neighbors with WMD. The only reason he didn't hit Israel with Chems in 91 is because we destroyed what he had available at the time. Still he has 600 thousand tons that are unaccounted for.

    The WHole thing doesn't make sense. You're absolutely right, it doesn't. Why did he invade Kuwait? He owed em money and wanted their oil. He wants to be the main power broker in the Mid East. He's a megalo Maniac, he doesn't have to make sense.

    Try this scenario. The US invades Iraq. We send Saddam to the World Court for crimes against Humanity. The people in Iraq rejoice in the streets because they're finally rid of Saddam and the whole Ba'ath party system. Iraq's neighbors are grateful because they no longer have to worry about what the hell he's gonna do next. We establish a democracy in Iraq the second only in the mideast (the other being Israel). The only ones really pissed about the whole deal are the radical muslims (there's no pleasing them anyhow) and the anti-war crowd in the US and Europe (there's no pleasing them anyhow). How's that?

  • back2dafront
    back2dafront

    Yeru,

    well, in large part because they are afraid of him. They saw what he did to Iran, they saw what he did to Kuwait, they're scared shitless. Turkey would be the only one MAYBE strong enough to take out Iraq, and as Iraq and Turkey both view the Kurds as ememies "The enemy of my enemy is my friend."

    If the reason is they are simply scared, then why aren't they behind the almighty USA now? Nothing to be afraid of w/ USA support. If they really wanted him out but were afraid of him, I would think THEY would have been the ones asking the USA for assistance, and would especially now be taking a firm stand alongside the USA, yet the majority of these countries have been against the war from the start and seem to be very reluctant in giving the USA support even now. Furthermore, yet have I heard one country to verbalize they feel Sadaam is a threat to their security.

    The scenario you mention below is the hopeful outcome of this war. A lot of countries are concerned about the unstability a war would cause in that region though. For example, Iraq and Russia have numerous oil agreements - would these change? What if Sadaam does have WMS and uses them on troops - how will the American people react when thousands of their loved homes return home dead? What if N. Korea decides to attack S. Korea while Iraq is being invaded? There are a lot of speculative "what-if's" one could raise - honestly, I sincerely hope things go as smoothly as you say, but realistically I doubt they will.

  • Yerusalyim
    Yerusalyim

    If the reason is they are simply scared, then why aren't they behind the almighty USA now? Nothing to be afraid of w/ USA support. If they really wanted him out but were afraid of him, I would think THEY would have been the ones asking the USA for assistance, and would especially now be taking a firm stand alongside the USA, yet the majority of these countries have been against the war from the start and seem to be very reluctant in giving the USA support even now. Furthermore, yet have I heard one country to verbalize they feel Sadaam is a threat to their security.

    A lot of it falls into the whole "Arab Unity" thing. It's also the culture over there, ya don't really ask for help, especially from INFIDELS. Kuwait sees Iraq as a threat to their security, so does Saudi, that's why they let us use their bases.

    As too all the what ifs...what if pigs could fly. As it stands right now, we are gauranteeing (sp) Russian and French concessions and loans, which is another reason we'll go to the oil fields first. IF NK attacks SK several options pop up. The most likely scenario is that China would step in and help. WHY? Because they realize that a very likely scenario would be the US nuking NK. Not pretty, but a possilbe scenario. One other scenario, SK and US forces trade land for time and fight a defensive war. Much like the stratedgy with Russia during the Cold War, then we call up the rest of our reserves and active forces and go kick ass. The cool thing is, if NK does attack, their through, it would wipe them out militarily. They might make it half way through SK but not be able to sustain it. Then they'd be easy pickings. We'd clean up REAL fast, and NK would be reunited with SK.

    Just musing. The war in Iraq will go well, trust me. It did last time, it will this time. He has very few people trully loyal. When they see the handwriting on the wall, they'll give him up but fast.

  • Simon
    Simon

    The USA committed one of the worst acts of genocide in recent history by practically wiping out the native Americans.

    Also, over 620,000 were killed in the civil war which was about what exactly? ... power! I read somewhere that more Americans have been killed BY Americans than any other war in history.

    A study of history and foregn affairs shows that many countries have an intense hatred of the western nations for a reason. It is surprising the level of animosity shown by western people against muslim countries when they have caused no where near as much suffering and deaths as we have caused them. Yet that is Ok ?

  • Pleasuredome
  • ashitaka
    ashitaka

    PD....LOL. Great graphic.

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