2 Peter 1 = Deity of Christ. (page 10)

Earnest

towerwatchman : No it [Granville Sharp's rule] does not apply [to Proverbs 24:21 LXX].

Proverbs 24:21 LXX reads "Fear [the] God (ton theon), O son (uie), and (kai) king (basilea), and do not disobey either one of them (methetero auton)."

So, once again, Granville Sharp's rule is :

When the copulative kai connects two nouns of the same case [God and king are the two nouns of the same case] ... if the article ho, or any of its cases, precedes the first of the said nouns [the first of the said nouns is "God" (ho theos) and, as can be seen, it is preceded by ho], and is not repeated before the second noun [the second noun is "king" (basilea) and has no preceding ho], the latter [king] always relates to the same person that is expressed or described by the first noun [God]...except the nouns be proper names, or in the plural number.

If you cannot accept this is an exception to Granville Sharp's rule I have to conclude you are being willfully blind. I cannot express it any clearer.

Granville Sharp's rule states that when you have two nouns, which are not proper names (such as Cephas, or Paul, or Timothy), which are describing a person, and the two nouns are connected by the word "and," and the first noun has the article ("the") while the second does not, *both nouns are referring to the same person*. In our texts, this is demonstrated by the words "God" and "Savior" at Titus 2:13 and 2 Peter 1:1. "God" has the article, it is followed by the word for "and," and the word "Savior" does not have the article. Hence, both nouns are being applied to the same person, Jesus Christ.

Again in Proverbs who is God and king describing? No one. They have to be describing someone for the rule to apply.

Earnest

towerwatchman : Again in Proverbs who is God and king describing? No one. They have to be describing someone for the rule to apply.

No self-respecting Jew in the time of Solomon, or Christian in the time of Peter, would ask who is "[the] God" describing. It is a nonsense to say that "[the] God" is describing no-one.

Furthermore, you are rewriting Granville Sharp's rule or, more likely, pinching it from some website which didn't do their homework. See my post above for what he actually wrote.

towerwatchman

Earnest

For the rule to apply God and king have to be describing someone. Read the rule.

Earnest

towerwatchman : For the rule to apply God and king have to be describing someone.

So who is "[the] God and Father" describing in the examples Granville Sharp gives :

He gives as examples 2 Cor.1:3 "Blessed be the God [ho theos] and [kai] Father [pater] of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father [ho pater] ... and [kai] God [theos]..." which contains two examples of the first rule; and others including Rom.15:6; 1 Cor.15:24; 2 Cor.11:31; Gal.1:4; Eph.5:20; Phil. 4:20; 1 Thes.1:3; 3:11,13; James 1:27; Rev.1:6 wherein "the God and Father" is mentioned exactly according to this rule.

towerwatchman

Earnest

Our and Lord are genitive. God and Father 'belong' to the 'our Lord'

Earnest

towerwatchman : For the rule to apply God and king have to be describing someone.

Earnest : So who is "[the] God and Father" describing in the examples Granville Sharp gives

towerwatchman : Our and Lord are genitive. God and Father 'belong' to the 'our Lord'

The question was not who does "[the] God and Father" in 2 Cor.1:3 belong to, but who is "[the] God" referring to in order for the rule to apply.

In Proverbs 24:21 LXX, a comparison with the Hebrew text shows that "[the] God" is referring to Jehovah.

towerwatchman

Earnest

The rule does not supersede other grammatical rules. 2 Cor 'our Lord' is genitive. The rule does not apply. You are trying to fit a round peg in a square hole

Earnest

towerwatchman : The rule does not supersede other grammatical rules. 2 Cor 'our Lord' is genitive. The rule does not apply.

I am not saying that anything applies. Granville Sharp gives 2 Cor.1:3 as an example of his first rule. And you say that for the rule to apply it must be describing someone.

I am simply asking who is "[the] God and Father" describing in 2 Cor.1:3 for Granville Sharp to say his rule applies? And what about the other scriptures that refer to "[the] God and Father" (Rom.15:6; 1 Cor.15:24; 2 Cor.11:31; Gal.1:4; Eph.5:20; Phil. 4:20; 1 Thes.1:3; 3:11,13; James 1:27; Rev.1:6) ? Who are they describing ?

Earnest

So, if we are going to go along with Granville Sharp's rule as Granville Sharp understood it the rule applies to Proverbs 24:21 (LXX) as much as it applies to 2 Cor.1:3 and all the other verses cited (Rom.15:6; 1 Cor.15:24; 2 Cor.11:31; Gal.1:4; Eph.5:20; Phil. 4:20; 1 Thes.1:3; 3:11,13; James 1:27; Rev.1:6).

They have the same construction, namely two nouns relating to a person (or persons) connected by 'and' where the first noun has the definite article and the second noun does not.

The answer to your persistent question as to who does [the] God refer to, is that in both cases it refers to God also known as Jehovah to the Jews and the Father to the Christians. Whether the Jewish Christians also knew God as Jehovah is irrelevant for the sake of this discussion..

So we can hopefully agree that Proverbs 24:21 LXX "Fear [the] God (ton theon), O son, and king..." has the construction requiring the application of Granville Sharp's rule but is an exception to it.

Now, the question is why.

Granville Sharp's rule does not apply where the nouns are proper names, or in the plural number. The Hebrew of Proverbs 24:21 says "My son, fear Jehovah and the king..." and so does have a proper name.

So while the LXX does not have a proper name, it is a sort of proper name because it refers to Jehovah of which there is only one. There are many gods but there is only one "the God". There is only one Jehovah. If a Jew refers to the God s/he is only referring to Jehovah. If a Christian refers to the God s/he is only referring to the Father.

In the scriptures Granville Sharp cites which refer to "[the] God and Father", these are clearly and unambiguously referring to the same person, the Father. However, in other scriptures where the second noun may apply to more than one as in Titus 2:13 and 2 Peter 1:1 the rule need not apply just as it need not apply in Proverbs 24:21 LXX.

2 Peter 1 = Deity of Christ.

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