2 Peter 1 = Deity of Christ.

by towerwatchman 99 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • cofty
    cofty

    Sex slaves

    Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man... Divide the spoils equally between the soldiers who took part in the battle and the rest of the community... The plunder remaining from the spoils that the soldiers took was.. 32,000 women who had never slept with a man. - Num.31:18

    When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and are attracted to her, you may take her as your wife. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband and she shall be your wife. - Deut.21:11

  • Vanderhoven7
    Vanderhoven7

    marked

  • The Rebel
    The Rebel

    Most of us are here because we listened to the talks given from the K.H platform and realized they made no sense. We re-read the W.T magazine in a different light and realized it didn't make sense. We looked at the history of the organisation and realized it didn't make sense. We were shocked by the child abuse, and thousands of other injustices this religion has done to its " people"

    So why continue to live in the Stone Age? What's the word " AWAKE" to Deut 21:11. Its written in black and white.

  • towerwatchman
    towerwatchman

    To Rebel

    I understand your position. i once was ;part of the organization also. What I noticed was, it was not God that let me down by the WTS. The Bible makes sense, the WTS does not. Again judge a movement by its originator and not by its followers. Does the WTS follow the teaching of Jesus or went against it. If the actions of the WTS are a logical outworking of Christianity, then give Christianity up, but if the WTS goes against Jesus' teachings then give up the WTS and embrace Jesus.

  • towerwatchman
    towerwatchman

    Cofty

    Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man... Divide the spoils equally between the soldiers who took part in the battle and the rest of the community... The plunder remaining from the spoils that the soldiers took was.. 32,000 women who had never slept with a man. - Num.31:18

    Your post claims sex slaves, nothing here supports that. We call this taking verses in isolation. I can take any verse, keep it in isolation, and apply any twist to it. And this is what you are doing. God punished these people for inviting Israel to worship their gods. Read Num 25. God punished them, He used Israel as His instrument of punishment. What I find interesting is no one argues against Noah’s flood, or Sodom and Gomorrah where God killed everyone, but they argue against this, why? God used Israel as His instrument to dispense His justice, so that Israel and anyone that reads the accounts can see the real and ugly result of sin.

    BTW the ‘virgins’ were kept alive and absorbed into Israel by marriage.

    When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and are attracted to her, you may take her as your wife. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband and she shall be your wife. - Deut.21:11

    BTW why would it matter to an Atheist that someone has a sex slave. It does not matter now, why should it matter then? Everyone wants to jump on the “Sex slave trafficking” wagon, on one end and support the industry that fuels the appetite. America’s greatest export is pornography, which fuels the appetite, which claims protection under the First Amendment. Without an objective source how does the Atheist address this dilemma ?

  • towerwatchman
    towerwatchman

    cofty

    Slavery

    As for your male and female slaves whom you may have—you may acquire male and female slaves from the pagan nations that are around you. Then, too, it is out of the sons of the sojourners who live as aliens among you that you may gain acquisition, and out of their families who are with you, whom they will have produced in your land; they also may become your possession. You may even bequeath them to your sons after you, to receive as a possession; you can use them as permanent slaves. But in respect to your countrymen, the sons of Israel, you shall not rule with severity over one another. - Lev.25:44

    If a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod and he dies at his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, he survives a day or two, no vengeance shall be taken; for he is his property. - Ex.21:20

    And we shall repeat.


    Owning somebody as property.

    Not that simple, in ancient times there was no welfare programs for the needy. People either sold themselves or their family into slavery so they would not die of starvation or exposure, they basically exchanged labor for food and housing. Notice the rules in the Bible about slavery are there to protect the slave.

    Killing a slave punishable up to death.

    "If a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod and he dies at his hand, he shall be punished." (Exodus 21:20)

    "If a man strikes the eye of his male or female slave, and destroys it, he shall let him go free on account of his eye. "And if he knocks out a tooth of his male or female slave, he shall let him go free on account of his tooth." (Exodus 21:26-27)

    "He who strikes a man so that he dies shall surely be put to death." (Exodus 21:12)

    No work on the Sabbath.

    "Six days you are to do your work, but on the seventh day you shall cease from labor so that your ox and your donkey may rest, and the son of your female slave, as well as your stranger, may refresh themselves. (Exodus 23:12)

    Slander a slave

    Do not slander a slave to his master, Or he will curse you and you will be found guilty. (Proverbs 30:10l

    Have sex with another man's slave,

    Now if a man lies carnally with a woman who is a slave acquired for another man, but who has in no way been redeemed nor given her freedom, there shall be punishment; they shall not, however, be put to death, because she was not free. (Leviticus 19:20)

    Return an escaped slave.

    "You shall not hand over to his master a slave who has escaped from his master to you. (Deuteronomy 23:15)

    A Hebrew was not to enslave his fellow countryman, even if he owed him money, but was to have him work as a hired worker, and he was to be released in 7 years or in the year of jubilee (which occurred every 50 years), whichever came first.

    'If a countryman of yours becomes so poor with regard to you that he sells himself to you, you shall not subject him to a slave's service. 'He shall be with you as a hired man, as if he were a sojourner; he shall serve with you until the year of jubilee. 'He shall then go out from you, he and his sons with him, and shall go back to his family, that he may return to the property of his forefathers. 'For they are My servants whom I brought out from the land of Egypt; they are not to be sold in a slave sale. 'You shall not rule over him with severity, but are to revere your God. (Leviticus 25:39-43)

    "If you buy a Hebrew slave, he shall serve for six years; but on the seventh he shall go out as a free man without payment." (Exodus 21:2)

    The slave owner was encouraged to "pamper his slave".

    He who pampers his slave from childhood Will in the end find him to be a son. (Proverbs 29:21)

  • cofty
    cofty

    TWM - It is a long time since we had a theist on the forum so unwilling to reason on facts.

    God told his people to murder babies in cold blood, to kidnap and rape thousands of virgins and to keep slaves as possessions.

    These facts are inescapable.

    I posted short extracts in the interest of brevity. I assumed you would take the time to check out the wider context. Clearly I over-rated your intellectual honesty.

  • towerwatchman
    towerwatchman

    To Cofty

    I answered you multiple times on the above mentioned topics, The proper thing to do is to post a rebuttal explaining where and why I am wrong, with support. All you keep doing is reposting your original post.

  • cofty
    cofty

    The challenge is yours.

    Please explain how owning another human being as an inheritable possession, infanticide and forced marriage are perfect acts of goodness.

    See the OP of this thread for more on genocide and infanticide and compare Number 31, Joshua 8 and 1 Samuel 15.

    You still have all your work ahead of you.

  • cofty
    cofty

    Scenario 1 (Numbers 31)

    You are camped on the east side of the Jordan waiting for orders to cross into the Promised Land. Moses is nearing the end of his life but he has some unfinished business to take care of before he hands over to Joshua. He announces that he has had an instruction from God to take revenge on the Midianites before he dies.

    The ensuing battle is a complete rout, not one Israelite soldier is killed in return for the complete annihilation of the Midianite army. You return to camp with a massive amount of spoil including tens of thousands of women and children. As you keep guard the commanders go off to report back to Moses. A while later they return with new instructions - Moses is furious about the prisoners of war and wants them separated into groups. The rest of the afternoon is spent separating the youngest girls from the rest of the captives. Its a horrifying task, the cries and of the mothers and the hysterical pleadings of the young girls is very distressing. When its over there are 32,000 girls who your commander says are to be shared out, 16,000 to the army and 16,000 to the rest of the families of Israel.

    Cowering in front of you is a mass of terrified humanity, tens and tens of thousands of women and boys, some are only just too young to have fought with their fathers and brothers, others are just babes in arms clinging to their mothers, blissfully unaware of their fate. Now the order comes that you have been dreading. Moses’ command from Yahweh is that every one of them is to be put to death.

    As your fellow soldiers unsheathe their swords and move towards the crowd there is a growing cacophony of screams. The women cover their children in a vain attempt to protect them from the massacre. Bodies are being dragged from the heap to uncover babies underneath so they too can be dispatched.

    So what do you hope you would have the courage to do?

    Faithfully carry out God’s command through Moses, or refuse to follow orders?

    Scenario 2 (Joshua 8)

    Moses has died and the leadership has passed on to Joshua. The nation has crossed the Jordan and the city of Jericho was defeated miraculously. The next military target is the city of Ai. Yahweh has assured Joshua that the city will be easily defeated and the army have been given permission to take spoils of war.

    Joshua has a plan and you are assigned to be part of a group of 30,000 of the best soldiers who are to sneak around the back of the city during the night and lie in wait. Joshua leads another section who moves out in front of the city gates towards Bethel. In the morning the men of Ai set out to repel Joshua’s frontal attack but the Israelite army flee with the Canaanite army in pursuit. With the city unguarded your section invades Ai and sets it on fire before marching out to help Joshua surround the men of Ai. The bluff works like a treat and victory is quick and decisive. You are excited now at the thought of getting straight back to Ai to discover what riches it may have to plunder.

    Then comes that order again that you have been dreading. Before anybody gets to search out any valuables there is a job to do. The army is commanded to first go through the city carefully searching every house and execute every last woman and child. As you kick doors open you find women and children cowering together pleading for their lives.

    So what do you hope you would have the courage to do?

    Faithfully carry out God’s command through Joshua, or refuse to follow orders?

    Scenario 3 (1Samuel 15)

    The nation has been settled in the Promised Land for about 400 years. Your parents have often told you the old stories about the exploits of your ancestors who fought under Moses and Joshua and conquered the land. Israel has its first king now and you are proud to be a soldier in Saul’s army just like your forebears. Mostly your battles are defending the borders of Israel from hostile neighbours but then one day right out the blue you receive a strange instruction. You are ordered to muster at a town called Telaim, when you arrive you see that there are 200,000 foot soldiers as well as another 10,000 from the tribe of Judah. Something big must be happening.

    Samuel addresses the troops and tells them he has had a word from Yahweh. Four centuries ago when your forefathers were leaving captivity in Egypt the Amalekites had attacked them in the desert at Rephidim. Joshua defeated them but not without a number of Israelite casualties. Now all these centuries and many generations later, Samuel says that God wants revenge on the descendants of those Amalekites.

    Then comes the order you were dreading, “Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys”.

    So what do you hope you would have the courage to do?

    Faithfully carry out God’s command through Samuel, or refuse to follow orders?

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