JWN, 23 years posting Blondie

by blondie 73 Replies latest jw friends

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  TonusOH

  Rattigan350: people complaining that in 1969 an Awake article said

  So, we shouldn't focus on the past...

  Rattigan350: Or the current governing body.

  ...and we shouldn't talk about the present.

  I'm gonna take a pass on that advice. It's a forum for exJWs. We're necessarily going to talk about the organization's past and present. It might suck to talk about how they lied to us, but it sucks a lot more that they lied to us. I don't come here to try and save JWs; it's not the best place to start. I come here to commiserate with other exJWs. It's a normal and healthy human behavior.
• 

  Vidiot

  “…FreetheMasons (previous username - EasyPrompt)…”

  Damn, I’d completely missed that.

  I think their posts got even longer after they switched handles.
• 

  Vidiot

  Rattigan350 - “…The main problem is that they are constrained from changing things because Damned if they do, damned if they don't. IF they change 607 or blood transfusions, they will get so much flack from that, it is better to leave things alone.”

  Wrong.

  The main “problem” is that they are trying to avoid or mitigate the negative consequences of the Org’s mistakes and misdeeds…

  …but if said consequences are damning them no matter which way they go, that’s the way the cookie crumbles.
• 

  Beth Sarim

  ....the borg says things less,, less,, less & less in a way for the Dubs to forget.

  Its the opposite of indoctrination. Where its said more,, more,, more & more.

  ...the borg uses the opposite method for deprogramming.
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  LV101

  SED - Yup/the great Chicago video.❤️ Thanks!
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  Rattigan350

  TonusOH. No one lied to you. Just because a writer in the past had more faith of expectation than actually happened, does not make it a lie.

  Lie -

  1 - to make an untrue statement with intent to deceive

  2 - to create a false or misleading impression

  The writers in the past did neither to create a lie. They didn't create false or misleading impressions just because it didn't happen. I understand that which is why I'm not bothered by anything they printed in the past. The writers' faith is the writers' faith and I've never ridden on their coattails.
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  Rattigan350

  "People are pissed because it affected their whole lives"

  Why? Whose fault is that?

  It's nice to blame others for our choices. I know. I've looked in my past from 40 years ago and if so many things have happened differently then my life would be so much better today. But I don't know if I can say better, it would be different. I can blame God because he should know what the future holds. But the decisions ultimately were mine.

  Also, unlike so many Witnesses who want the kingdom to come because they want Jehovah to fix all of their problems, I have never been one to look to the kingdom like that. I have this life to live , I'm good with it and then when that is done, I'll live the next one. The kingdom has so many unknowns, that I'd rather go with what I know.
  
  
• 

  Rivergang

  But the decisions ultimately were mine.

  Maybe not nearly as much as you might think!

  This concept of a "Free Will" is a myth which was actually generated by Christian theologians.

  Humans certainly have a will - but it isn't always free. Humans do make choices, but these are by no means always independent choices. Nearly every choice depends on a lot of biological, social (including religious) and personal conditions which you cannot determine for yourself. These conditioned are determined in part by such things as ones gender, biochemistry, genetic makeup, family background and national culture.

  Christian theologians would have us believe that we all have a "Free Will", but the Advertising Industry has always known otherwise!

  Link
  
• 

  TonusOH

  Rattigan350: No one lied to you.

  I disagree. Example: the WTS told young people that they would "never grow old in this system of things." This fulfills the second definition of a lie that you posted. I would argue that it also is covered by the first definion, as I do not think they should get a pass for believing something they had no defensible reason to believe. If I tell you that a comet passing by the Earth is really a spaceship that is going to rapture true believers, the fact that I am deranged enough to believe this doesn't mean it isn't a lie.

  Mind you, I am not feeling charitable enough to wave off WTS lies by claiming that they were deluded. I'm confident that none of the WTS leadership who ever "clarified" anything thought that they were also not in their right minds when they made their own (ultimately failed) prognostications. At some point, the only options are that they are stupid, deluded, mislead... or deceivers. I'm willing to agree that they might be a combination of those, but they definitely have lied.
• 

  jhine

  May l , as a never a JW , put my two penny worth in .

  I have certainly learnt an awful lot about a lot of things since joining this group

  Certainly about the WT but also about people in general

  It's been a real eye opener so thank you to all of you .

  Jan from Tam