by Touchofgrey 189 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
peacefulpete:
The last section of book of Daniel was reinterpreted as referring to Rome prior to Christian usage.
Of course. Christianity didn’t start in a vacuum. But the key word is ‘reinterpreted’. When the original apocalyptic hopes in Daniel failed after the Maccabean period, it was reinterpreted. Just as Christians reinterpreted their end times beliefs after Jesus didn’t return within a generation.
FreetheMasons, I'm not sure if you are new here, or posting with a new account. With respect, you are simply paraphrasing selected bible passages that you believe to have some kind of meaning in 2024.
This board is full of people that lived a majority of their lives as JW's and have heard all of this before. Since leaving the org, a lot of those same people have studied the Bible in great detail - including the inconvenient parts of the bible they don't talk about much at the meetings.
All you seem to be saying is, ' the bible said it- that settles it'. That's not good enough if you want to be taken seriously.
@joeyjojo -
If I cared more about what people think than about what Jehovah thinks, I'd still be in the JWborg now.
You seem to care more about impressing people than truth, which is why you value "being taken seriously" more than I do.
Are you a former JW elder?
Being in JW dot boring is allllllll llllll about pleasing people & keeping people happy.
Once you get over that hurdles/ obstacle ....its. .
Allll good. Its just people thats all
That's not good enough if you want to be taken seriously.
How's the third line of this song go, @joey jojo, do ya know?😜
its 😎🍺
Allll good. Its just people thats all
Amen, @BethSarim! Jesus hung out with people - he didn't care what the freakin Pharisees thought...cheers to you, @BethSarim - having a cold one right now - may you have an awesome evening, my friend🫶😁
Vidqun:
Jeffro, it's a case of the pot is calling the kettle black. I have clearly demonstrated your irrationality by you insinuating "destroy" means "corrupt," in order for you to fit it into your brand of theology.
Notice this common apologist tactic… personalise the issue and falsely imply that some novel interpretation is being asserted. Back in reality, the fact that the book of Daniel is about the Maccabean period is the mainstream view in biblical scholarship.
We need more Garth Brooks! No more politics, just music
FreeTheMasons
@joeyjojo -
If I cared more about what people think than about what Jehovah thinks, I'd still be in the JWborg now.
You seem to care more about impressing people than truth, which is why you value "being taken seriously" more than I do.
Are you a former JW elder?
No. In my 30 - ish years as a born in jw I never 'reached out'. Never an elder or m.s. - I didnt even auxilliary pioneer once.
Im not a fan of Garth Brooks or country music, so I dont know the song you are referring to, but thanks for dedicating it to me.
Enjoy your beer- I wish i was drinking one right now.
FreeTheMasons: For the same reason Herod saw him in a negative light - they didn't want to lose their power and control over people.
Even though they knew he was divine?
I asked the question to point out a flaw in the argument that the apostles would not have died for a fraud. We can point out this flaw in other ways, such as the claim that the Jewish priests --who were waiting on the Messiah-- would reject a man who performed miracles and spoke in a way that left people amazed. If people can act in an irrational manner, why not the apostles who supposedly preferred martyrdom? If their actions only make sense in the context of an actual god in their midst, how does that explain his rejection by the priests? Because they wanted something that they knew they would lose anyway? That doesn't make sense.
This sort of selective interpretation might be excused if it happens once, or if it can be explained away in a coherent manner. But this is typical of the Bible-- it is interpreted many different ways and inconsistencies and problems like the one described above are ignored or handwaved. After a while, it's not hard to understand what is happening-- we interpret it to suit our beliefs. This, in itself, is a flaw.
@JoeyJoJo said: FreetheMasons, I'm not sure if you are new here, or posting with a new account. With respect, you are simply paraphrasing selected bible passages that you believe to have some kind of meaning in 2024.This board is full of people that lived a majority of their lives as JW's and have heard all of this before. Since leaving the org, a lot of those same people have studied the Bible in great detail - including the inconvenient parts of the bible they don't talk about much at the meetings.
All you seem to be saying is, ' the bible said it- that settles it'. That's not good enough if you want to be taken seriously.
FreeTheMasons
@joeyjojo -
If I cared more about what people think than about what Jehovah thinks, I'd still be in the JWborg now.
You seem to care more about impressing people than truth, which is why you value "being taken seriously" more than I do.
Are you a former JW elder?@JoeyJoJo said: No. In my 30 - ish years as a born in jw I never 'reached out'. Never an elder or m.s. - I didnt even auxilliary pioneer once.
Then why are you trying to imitate their tactics?
@JoeyJoJo said: Im not a fan of Garth Brooks or country music, so I dont know the song you are referring to, but thanks for dedicating it to me.
(First Verse)
Blame is all on my roots
I showed up in boots
And ruined your black tie affair, yeah
The last one to know
The last one to show
I was the last one you thought you'd see there
And I saw the surprise
And the fear in his eyes
When I took his glass of champagne
And I toasted you
Said, "Honey, we may be through
But you'll never hear me complain"
(Chorus)
'Cause I've got friends in low places
Where the whiskey drowns
And the beer chases my blues away
And I'll be okay
I'm not big on social graces
Think I'll slip on down to the oasis
Oh, I've got friends
In low places
(Second Verse)
Well I guess I was wrong
I just don't belong
But then, I've been there before
Everything's alright
I'll just say goodnight
And I'll show myself to the door
Hey I didn't mean
To cause a big scene
Just give me an hour and then
Well, I'll be as high as that ivory tower
That you're livin' in
[Chorus]
(Third Verse - not part of the original song but morphed into it over time...)
Hey, I didn't mean
To cause a big scene
Just wait 'til I finish this glass
And sweet little lady
I'll head to the bar
And you can kiss my ass!
[Chorus]
(Outro)
Yeah!
Oh, I've got friends in low places
Where the whiskey drowns and the beer chases
My blues away
And I'll be okay
I'm not big on social graces
Think I'll slip on down to the oasis
Oh, I've got friends in low places
'Cause, Honey, I've got friends
In low places
@JoeyJoJo said: Enjoy your beer- I wish i was drinking one right now.
Thank you. I did enjoy it.🙂 Maybe sometime we'll all have one together - while hanging out with Jesus too.😉
FreeTheMasons: For the same reason Herod saw him in a negative light - they didn't want to lose their power and control over people.
@TonusOH said: Even though they knew he was divine?
I asked the question to point out a flaw in the argument that the apostles would not have died for a fraud. We can point out this flaw in other ways, such as the claim that the Jewish priests --who were waiting on the Messiah-- would reject a man who performed miracles and spoke in a way that left people amazed. If people can act in an irrational manner, why not the apostles who supposedly preferred martyrdom? If their actions only make sense in the context of an actual god in their midst, how does that explain his rejection by the priests? Because they wanted something that they knew they would lose anyway? That doesn't make sense.
That's why the Bible calls it "stupid" or "foolish" in the Proverbs.
It's also why it's referred to as "mentally diseased" or "corrupted thinking" in the New Testament.
To reject God's Son is stupid. It is foolish. The thinking of God's chief enemy is mentally diseased and corrupted. Just as a rusty car or a corroded wire stop functioning properly at a certain point, it's the same with Satan's brain. His thinking is so messed up from being disconnected from God. Satan knows God exists, but in his twisted mind he actually thinks he'll succeed in living even after disconnecting from Him. It's ridiculous.
The wicked priests in the first century knew God existed. They knew it. And they knew who Jesus was. But their thinking ability was so out of whack that they really thought they'd succeed and get away with it.
Jesus gave that illustration about the man with a vineyard who sent his heir to collect the harvest and the workers killed the heir. When we hear that illustration, we're like "what were they thinking?" And that is the point. Their thinking is so messed up - it's not logical at all.
The same thing happens to people today who are following in the ways of the Pharisees.
@TonusOH said: This sort of selective interpretation might be excused if it happens once, or if it can be explained away in a coherent manner. But this is typical of the Bible-- it is interpreted many different ways and inconsistencies and problems like the one described above are ignored or handwaved. After a while, it's not hard to understand what is happening-- we interpret it to suit our beliefs. This, in itself, is a flaw.
It is a flaw. It is a flaw in their thinking. You see it again and again and again in those who are following in the footsteps of the Pharisees.
They reject truth. They refuse to change. They deny God's Son. They are retarded. Seriously - they are mentally retarded - and I don't mean that in an insulting way - "retarded" as in slow.
If they choose to wake up and turn around, that would be nice.
It's too late for the Devil and the demons to turn around, but it's not too late for some of these pharisaical-types. When the Bible says there is no sacrifice left for those who blaspheme, what it means is that there's not going to be another ransom sent. The only ransom is the one Jesus paid with his blood already. So those retards have to look to that ransom. They must bend the knee to God's Son, Jesus, if they want to live forever.
