peacefulpete - “…They argue that the crucifixion defied expectations and required a creative explanation…”
You gotta admit, that is a much simpler explanation.
WATCHTOWER JAN 2025: WHY IS THE WATCHTOWER OBSESSED WITH THE RANSOM?
by raymond frantz 75 Replies latest watchtower bible
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Vidiot
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Sea Breeze
If you ask a JW to whom is the ransom paid, you'll get different answers.
Scripture says that : the wages of sin is death. That is the just punishment for our own sin. Jesus paid the wages "for us", in our palce, to our personal account.
So, the answer is quite simply: the ransom is paid to YOU.
1 Peter 3: 18 - Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust
God trades the Justified for the Unjustified.
Chew on that.
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peacefulpete
You gotta admit, that is a much simpler explanation.
It used to appear that way to me too, but now I see it as the more difficult model. Why did historians of the day never hear of him and why did his followers take so long to create a story about him but when they did, they made many, different contradictory versions. Why did early branches of the "Christian" tree not have a biography/narrative of an extended earthly sojourn at all but feature a mystic revealer/Logos. The more you learn about the broad acceptance of a second power/personified emanation of God concept the less the alternative appears surprising.
Of course, some historical person such as John the Baptist or the Jesus ben Ananias in Josephus that declares woes on Jerusalem just before the war might have provided some elements of the stories.
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Beth Sarim
Sometimes the Borg inserts this narrative to follow Jesus or honor Him,, is just to appear more palatable.
In light of mounting lawsuits & negative press like Norway,,Denmark,,Australia & New Zealand.
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Sea Breeze
Sometimes the Borg inserts this narrative to follow Jesus or honor Him
Here are some terms that come to mind.
1. Footstep followers of Jesus Christ
2. Imitate Jesus
It's all works based stuff, earing your salvation. They blatantly disobey Jesus' command to be born again. They disobey Jesus when he says to "take eat, take drink this is my blood of the covenant for the forgivenesss of sins"
When it comes to stuff that actually has to do with salvation, JW's are certain to reject that.
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Beth Sarim
In dubland works = salvation.
And suckholing up to elders & their circuit overseers.
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Beth Sarim
And having things two ways also.
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Dagney
It seems to be a uniquely WT thing, AFAIK. I've been around mainstream Christianity for nearly 50 years and have never heard of this ransom thing*, apart from when I see it being referred to here. Is there an actual verse (or more) they point to that uses that term? Perhaps they've translated a term differently than the way other translations do. Like they do with "grace", for example.
Exactly my thoughts. The "universal sovereignty 'issue'" and the whole ransom, perfect man vs perfect man scale thing is uniquely JW, AFAIK.
I was at a JW memorial at the KH several weeks ago. All of the family except the sister of the deceased were not JW. The children of the deceased were raised JW, but left years ago so their kids have no ties to the religion. As the brother so earnestly shared the perfect man and scale story, I could tell it was not as impressive to the hearers as the brother intended. That's the thing. JW's think they have this special knowledge/message/secret sauce and are so excited about it. It doesn't land like they think it should.
It's more stuff they came up with to fill the literature they were producing constantly for 100+ years.
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TonusOH
Earning salvation by trying to live a good life seems like a reasonable idea. If it's granted for any other reason, doesn't that imply that trying to live a good life is meaningless?
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raymond frantz
In the New Testament, the Greek word ἀπολύτρωσις (apolutrósis), meaning "redemption" or "deliverance," appears 10 times and where the word ransom comes from appears only 10 times , whereas The term χάρις (charis),or undeserved kindness translated as "grace," "favor," or "kindness," occurs approximately 157 times. The Watchtower concentrates only one the ransom with little to no mention on the second , the Grace. Talking about skewed theology!