Racial Insensitivity

by Coded Logic 127 Replies latest social current

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  nancy drew

  The black lives matter movement is not improving the situation it's whipping people up to a frenzy of hate. I don't like racism but is that what is really happening here? Where I live you hear on the news almost everyday more shootings and sad to say 99% are perpetrated by black males. The next day you see the mother being interviewed and if no police where around she complains where were the police. If her son was the shooter and was shot by police she says he was sick and needed medical help. It's a never ending situation here yesterday a teenager tried to kill his mother and burn the house down then charged the police with a weapon and was shot. I could go on but I don't know the answer but people make it sound like innocent black men are being rounded up and shot. I think there's a real problem and the police are in a difficult situation because when a criminal is resisting and he's a big guy with a weapon or not it's hard to be gentle.

  This is just making everybody feel edgy and very sad.
  
• 

  never a jw

  Thank you Slim.

  Better. We still have the unsubstantiated claim of an individual with a big title. The strange thing is that Coded logic gave us statistics with lots of details that refute the claim in your quote. Who do we believe?

  Edit:

  I read the article and have to correct myself. We have statistics available, but not from police documents. Got it! By the way, I read the article and I feel is quite bias. It offers shocking numbers, but provides no context or the proper analysis of those numbers. Example: "Blacks are shot at twice the rate as whites", but crime rates of either group are ignored.
  
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  silentbuddha

  This same study stating black people are not killed at a higher rate also states that more guns make a society safer so hopefully we can believe that line as well.

  Also in regards to people being taught that everything that happens to them is because of racism, is not true. As a kid i lived in a very crime filled neighborhood. Police would sit at the city limits and pull us over and prevent us from going to STATE and CITY parks in white areas. I had 2 JW friends of 17 and 19 who had there lives ruined by officers who planted drugs on them during routine traffic stops. I saw PLENTY of racist behavior perpetuated by police. I dont understand why people have such a hard time believing this.
• 

  Simon

  Why don't we believe some of the stories? Lack of evidence ... evidence of false claims ... i.e. when things like "hands up don't shoot" are claimed and then shown to be BS it makes people less willing to believe stories. And without evidence, it's just a story.

  Your own previous post is the typical "I have been pulled over a million times this year for being black" but anyone can make that claim. Here: I got pulled over 10 times this year by a black cop in our city. Is it believable? Probably not ... see how it works?

  Here's what makes me think "hmmn ..." over some stories, using yours as an example:

  You thrown in extra irrelevant detail that is meant to color people's opinions (e.g. the cop being young, you being rich).

  You claim you try to complain and do something about it but don't do the one simple and obvious thing: fit a dash cam, record the encounters. Why something apparently so commonplace is rarely recorded in the age of easy monitoring.
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  silentbuddha

  I never said 1 million so no need to exaggerate. The reason it is a ttpical post is because it is the type of thing that typically happens. There are also laws in some places about recording police. People who get there phones taken as well.

  Honedtly if i had 13 recordings of officers pulling me over for no reason except to hardass me you probably would cone up with a reason to justify it.

  You have a black member of he House of reps givong a speech before stating in DC he has been pulled over 7 times this year. I guess he is lying too. Thise damn blacks do nothing but lie and kill people I suppose
• 

  nancy drew

  As humans we have a natural profiling to assess danger inside of us for example if you get on a plane and see about six muslim men sitting quietly what do you think? Mostly they are peaceful but a fair portion has created a situation that breeds fear. If your walking down the street and you see a couple of pit bulls running toward you then your reaction would be different than a couple of pugs. A certain amount of bad apples and fear takes over. There's just been too many young black males with guns and it is reflecting on the group and black lives matter is just stirring up the pot and creating more and more dangerous confrontations. I think it's the responsibility of the adult black community to get control and calm the situation because I don't believe it's racism that's driving this i think it's criminal activity that rearing it's ugly head.
  
• 

  Simon

  silendbuddah: I never said that it never happens. I am merely pointing out that whenever someone makes a big song and dance claiming racism and then it comes out that it was nothing of the sort (e.g. Django Unchained actress) it undermines the credibility of the other stories which may be genuine. But I suspect there are more than a few made up anecdotes being put about.

  It's a sad fact that people lie about something so serious for personal gain or convenience and if you are angry at stories not being believed, you should direct it at the people who do such things.
• 

  Coded Logic

  Saying, it's okay that more unarmed black people are shot than unarmed white people because "they could have been going for the officers gun" is NOT a meaningful rebuttal. Because just as there are some unarmed black people that go for an officers gun there are also some unarmed white people that go for the officers gun.

  You don't just get to subtract some ad hoc hypothetical number from the number of unarmed black people who are shot without ALSO subtracting a comparable ad hoc hypothetical number for the unarmed white people who are shot by the police. And if we did this, we would STILL end up with a figure showing unarmed black people are six times more likely to be shot by the police than unarmed white people.

  ...

  Simon's point that black people have more interactions with the police is TRUE (good job Simon!). But stating that they're having more interactions because of criminal activity is FALSE (can't win them all). Rather, black people have more interactions with police because of Implicit Bias.

  As has been noted on this thread anecdotally, simply being a black man in a good neighborhood is enough for police to pull you over. I myself have also witnessed this first hand - and I live in a fairly liberal part of California. Last year I was pulled over seemingly without reason and, after giving my license and registration to the officer, I asked the officer for the reason of the stop. He said, and I'm quoting word for word here, "I noticed you had an African American juvenile sitting in the back seat."

  I explained that it was my friends teenage son whom I was giving a ride home and I was completely shocked he would pull me over for that. He said, "Well it's pretty weird that he would be hanging out with you guys."

  Crazy right? But this sort of thing isn't simply limited to anecdotal accounts. Implicit bias is a well studied phenomenon and clearly shows black people are far more likely to attract police attention than white people for identical behavior:

  http://fairandimpartialpolicing.com/docs/pob2.pdf

  It's also been shown that a persons race statistically influences an officers decision to shoot:

  http://faculty.chicagobooth.edu/bernd.wittenbrink/research/pdf/cpjw07.pdf

  But the Implicit Bias isn't just on cops either. We also know that us citizens are more likely to call the cops on black people than we are on white people. Simple Misfits noticed this after he locked his keys out of his car and called AAA a black tow truck driver came and tried open his car. Even though there was a big a tow truck there - the police still ended up getting called on driver. This experience prompted Simple Misfits to conduct a social experiment. While the video is kinda funny the results are pretty profound:

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuyMuLGXxTs
• 

  Simon

  Keep repeating your incorrect stats as though they are true and ignore the study that takes all the factors into account that you claim to, but don't.

  Whatever differences there are between the cause and behavior of black interactions with the police are at the heart of the matter. If you simply want to always equalize every number based on population percentage they you will always get the number you want - the wrong number.

  Here's a though experiment for you. Suppose there are no white people at all in a city of 1m people. I go there and stab someone and then fight with the cops, go for one of their guns and get shot (hey, more likely to happen going off the study). The death rate for unarmed white-people-shot-by-cop is now astronomically high, especially if you factor in that I only accounted for 1/1,000,000th of the population.

  Does that prove that the cops are racist? did anything wrong? or that the crime rate by whites guys was through the roof and had everything to do with the instances of police interaction and subsequent shooting.
• 

  scratchme1010

  This BS really makes my blood boil. We give our cops extensive training, specially modified cars, bullet proof vests, batons, mace, tasers, guns, and radios to call for back up so they can protect themselves and so they can stay safe. Even more important, every single police officer SIGNS UP FOR THE JOB!

  Do not for one second compare the hazards of being a cop with the unjustified killings of unarmed black men. Do not for one second think you can compare the honor filled funerals of fallen police officers where mayors come out and talk about "duty" and "patriotism" - with the unceremonious body bags of black victims who's every infraction and misdemeanor is touted before the press as public officials attempt to vilify the innocent.

  If we treated our African-American brothers 1/10th as well as we treat our cops no one would ever need to say the words "black lives matter".

  Just keeping it about the original post. Coded Logic, I'm with you. Politicians and all the people with power immediately want to appeal to "humanity" as soon as it's the police. They never have the same attitude towards any people of color. No one deserves to get killed for no reason other than hatred or racism.

  Whoever thinks that's is a fallacy black men are getting killed left and right, and that this country isn't full of racism and hate, lives like an ostrich.

  The killing in this country is out of control. And for as long as it's considered "horrible" only when it's the cops, things are never going to improve.