The Father does not call Jesus Yahweh, how about double checking that one. Yahweh does call Jesus God but also says he is God to Jesus ". . . therefore God (Jesus), your God (Yahweh) has set you above your companions by anointing you with the oil of joy." Heb 1:9 NIV. The trinity doctrine is false, those who are fooled by it are plague with darkness about the true meaning of scriptures, it denies the Father and the Son in short.
John 1:1 - A "Sacred Secret" Revealed
by AGuest 145 Replies latest watchtower bible
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noko
Get right down to it, Jesus has a God, one he worships, one he always obeys and follows, who is greater then he is. Those who truely believe the Lamb of God would also listen to what he has said over and over again about himself and his father.
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UnDisfellowshipped
Noko said:
The Father does not call Jesus Yahweh, how about double checking that one.
It is always good to double-check the information one posts about the Bible. However, I would like to ask you to double-check Hebrews 1:10, and for you to tell me what Scripture was being quoted in Hebrews 1:10.
The Scripture that was being quoted in Hebrews 1:10, and was applied to JESUS, was Psalm 102:25 (Septuagint Version):
Psalm 102:21-27: to proclaim the Name of the Lord in Sion, and His praise in Jerusalem; when the people are gathered together, and the kings, to serve the Lord. He answered him in the way of his strength: tell me the fewness of my days. Take me not away in the midst of my days: Your years are through all generations. In the beginning You, O Lord, did lay the foundation of the earth; and the Heavens are the works of Your hands. They shall perish, but You remain: and they all shall wax old as a garment; and as a vesture shall You fold them, and they shall be changed. But You are the same, and Your years shall not fail.
The Septuagint translated Yahweh as "Lord" each time it appeared. The New Testament does the same thing.
In Psalm 102:21, the Septuagint says "Name of the Lord", while the King James Version, and most all the other Translations say "Name of the LORD" [and "LORD" is YAHWEH or JEHOVAH].
Also, in Psalm 102:1, the Septuagint reads:
Psalm 102:1: A Prayer for the Poor; when he is deeply afflicted, and pours out his supplication before the Lord. Hear my prayer, O Lord, and let my cry come to You.
However, the King James Version reads:
Psalm 102:1: A Prayer of the afflicted, when he is overwhelmed, and poureth out his complaint before the LORD. Hear my prayer, O LORD, and let my cry come unto thee.
You see, the Hebrew Text shows that Psalm 102 is a prayer to YAHWEH ["LORD"], but the Septuagint simply says "Lord".
So then, since, in the Hebrew Text, the Hebrew word YHWH appears several times in Psalm 102, and the Hebrew word "Adonay" ["Lord"] does not appear at all in Psalm 102, I would say that the words "O Lord" in Psalm 102:25 (Septuagint) are actually "O Yahweh".
However, even if the word used in Psalm 102:25 is "Adonay", it is still talking about Yahweh, because the entire Psalm 102 is a prayer to YAHWEH, therefore, in Psalm 102:25, it is discussing Yahweh, and Hebrews 1:10 shows that Jesus is the Lord who was being discussed in Psalm 102, and that Lord is Yahweh.
Also, there are some Translations which actually show that Hebrews 1:10 is saying that Jesus is Yahweh [LORD - all capital letters]:
Analytical-Literal Translation: And, "_You_ LORD, in [the] beginning laid the foundation of the earth, and the heavens are works of Your hands.
English Majority Text Version: And: "You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth, and the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Noko said:
Yahweh does call Jesus God but also says he is God to Jesus ". . . therefore God (Jesus), your God (Yahweh) has set you above your companions by anointing you with the oil of joy." Heb 1:9 NIV.
I agree with you. Absolutely no problem with that. That is what the Bible teaches, and that does not disprove the Trinity at all, not one bit. I believe that Jesus is in subjection to The Father, and The Father has a greater position over Jesus, and that The Father is the Head of Jesus.
I also believe that The Father, The Son, and The Spirit are God Almighty, The Supreme Being, YAHWEH, I AM WHO I AM.
Noko said:
The trinity doctrine is false, those who are fooled by it are plague with darkness about the true meaning of scriptures, it denies the Father and the Son in short.
Interesting statements.
I have a friendly challenge for you. Are you willing to accept the challenge? I challenge you to read through my entire post about the Trinity on Page 3 of this Thread, and disprove any of the main points of that Post, using only the Scriptures, and then I will stop believing in the Trinity. Are you willing to do that?
Noko said:
Get right down to it, Jesus has a God, one he worships, one he always obeys and follows, who is greater then he is. Those who truely believe the Lamb of God would also listen to what he has said over and over again about himself and his father.
I agree.
Now, let me ask you, do you follow Jesus Christ's Command at John 5:23?
John 5:23 (NIV): that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father, who sent him.
Do you honor, praise, and worship The Son equally with The Father?
Revelation 5:11-14 (NIV): Then I looked and heard the voice of many angels, numbering thousands upon thousands, and ten thousand times ten thousand. They encircled the throne and the living creatures and the elders. In a loud voice they sang: "Worthy is the Lamb, who was slain, to receive power and wealth and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and praise!" Then I heard every creature in heaven and on earth and under the earth and on the sea, and all that is in them, singing: "To him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb be praise and honor and glory and power, for ever and ever!" The four living creatures said, "Amen," and the elders fell down and worshiped.
If you are not honoring, praising, and worshiping The Son and The Father equally, then who is the one that is actually denying The Father and The Son?
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noko
UD,
Please be aware that the Masoretic Tex,t which the oldest complete copy known is the Leningrad Codex, which was copied in 1008CE and the Codex Sinaiticus (Septuagint) is from 400CE does differ in PS 102:25. The oldest text know for PS102:25 is from the Dead Sea scrolls dating from mid 2nd century BCE to 50-68CE, you could say more reflective of the writtings that Jesus in the flesh and his apostles used. This is from the Dead Sea Scrolls Bible:
PS:102:24,25
24 "O my God. Do not take me away in the midst of my days--you whose years endure throughout all generations!" 25 Long ago the earth was founded, and the heavens are the works of your hands.
The MT and Dead Sea Scrolls agree.
Someone could argue that the Septuagint later was altered which affected our current translations of the greek writtings we use today reflecting the altered greek Septuagint text. In any case if Jesus is Yahweh you would be denying that Yahweh has a Son since you are talking about the same person, yet there are many Sons of Yahweh who just like you and me are separate individuals, maybe united in many ways but are individuals. Father and Son relationship is very clear in the Bible we have today, Yahweh is not a God of confusion, Jesus is the Son of Yahweh just like you are a son from your father. Jesus does represent his Father fully, so by obeying Jesus, worshipping Jesus, listening to Jesus is indeed doing the same with his Father. Even today we have many examples of this principle where the son represents the father in legal matters, orders, judgements in many different types of businesses. Still the Father and the Son are not the same individual, to say so means the Father is not a Father and the Son is not a Son but only one individual. Any doctrine that denies the Son and the Father is false.
No need for challenges, the Holy Spirit can teach you all things, that is what we have to pray for and to listen to. The living word is alive, loud and clear, the Bible clearly points us to listen to the Holy Spirit.
Now "God said, 'Let us make man in our own image, in the likeness of ourselves, and let them be masters of the fish of the sea, the birds of heaven, the cattle, all the wild animals and all the creatures that creep along the gound.'" ". . . male and female he created them."
May you find favor and be blessed from our saviour Jesus Christ (Mighty God) and from his Father Yehweh God Almighty.
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AGuest
May you all have peace! Please forgive my delay in responding... I have been away and there was no access to a computer. My apologies!
I have had a chance now to read all that has been posted on the subject... and, of course, it has turned into a "some are saying that the resurrection has already occurred," type of situation. Unfortunately, I cannot let myself be led by that, but only by the spirit of my Father, holy spirit, that resides in me through Christ. With that said, I am going to say a few things here... as I am directed to... and then I will leave the subject (as I once stated before)... as there is no benefit in continuing after this point. Here is what I KNOW... and the means by which I KNOW it is as received from my Lord himself, the One whom "comes in the name of JAH," JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH, the Son and Christ of the Most Holy One of Israel, whose name is JAH... of Armie (VEH):
1. The Bible... is not the Word of God. The SON is... so that it is by HIS mouth... and not by words written on stone tablets... that truth is known. For it is HIS mouth that utters truth itself... in low tones. For he IS the Truth.
2. If you TRULY want to know what is true... NOT what this man says... or that man says... or this translations means... or that translation suggests... or what such and so word in this language means... or such and so word in that language suggests... then there is only ONE "Way"... ONE... who will lead you... by means of HIS spirit... into ALL truth.
3. We can speculate, commiserate, ruminate and transliterate all day long. We will not be the first... nor the last. However, IF you truly want to know what the "scriptures" SAY... what they MEAN... then it is to the One... ABOUT WHOM THEY ARE WRITTEN... that you should go. It is HIM that you should KEEP ASKING.
I understand the points made here: of course, they sound as if they make sense. Does not almost ALL religious doctrine, if the argument is made well enough? How, then, are we to KNOW? There is only ONE WAY... for God only SPEAKS to us... by one means: His Son.
Now... I have inquired of that Son regarding all that has been "spoken" here, long before now. No, that is not true, so I must take it back. I did NOT ask. What HAPPENED was... I was TOLD... that IF I obeyed his voice... and spoke whatever it was that he gave me to speak... to whomever it was that he sent me to speak it... I, in turn, would be shown and told things, that I would hear sacred secrets, that I would KNOW THE TRUTH. Not as earthling man has told it to me.... but as he, THE TRUTH... would himself tell me. Why? Because I exercised faith and BELIEVED... when he FIRST started speaking to me. I did NOT doubt. And from that time on... I have exercised faith in ALL that he has spoken to me.
I do not get my understanding from a book, or books, including the Bible. But my Lord did tell me this, from the start: "ALL things that I tell you... are written. But not all things that are WRITTEN is what I will tell you." What did this mean? I asked, and was told that DUE TO LACK OF FAITH... earthling man will follow and worship... what he can SEE. However, FAITH... is the assured expectation of the things hoped for... though NOT seen. Since, then, earthling man always needs to SEE it... IN WRITING... the Adversary uses such things to MISLEAD...as it is WRITTEN... IF POSSIBLE... EVEN THE CHOSEN ONES.
And we fall right into it: we put our trust in "earthling man"... in his versions, his translations, his transliterations, his interpretations... etc., etc., etc.,... rather than doing what we were TOLD to do... repeatedly... even in the very book that many put their faith... and that is: LISTEN TO THE SON! For it is HIS voice... that the sheep... must KNOW.
So, with that said, I now say to you that I stand by what I have shared with you, just as I have heard it from my Lord, the Son of God:
1. My Father is one.
2. My Lord is a God... just as we, too, will one day be Gods. It does not matter: big "G"... little "g"... it does not matter.
3. My Father created my Lord... OUT OF HIS LOVE. Thus, he is the SON... "of His love," created in the womb of my mother, Jerusalem Above... the spirit realm. My Lord... is the son created according to a PROMISE... versus Adam, who was created "by means of the flesh."
4. By means of my Lord... my FATHER... created everything else. For it was my Lord... the One who is LIFE... that my Father used to "beget" life. Before him, I was DEAD. By MEANS of him... I have been brought TO LIFE.
5. My Lord is the Light that came into existence "in the womb"... between the Darkness and whom my Father put a division. I, too, have become that Light... so that I must let it shine... before ALL men.
There is SO much more to say... but as said before me, "hard to be explained." Why? Because... YOU HAVE BECOME DULL... IN YOUR HEARING. You do not HEAR... thus, you do not understand, but still "search the scriptures."
So be it. Search the scriptures... but you will not find him. For he does not exist in pages, on stone tablets, on paper... or in BOOKS. He is ALIVE... and EXISTS... IN YOU... IF... you HEAR HIM KNOCKING... and OPEN TO HIM.
May you hear... and get the sense of it. For if you do, perhaps you will also hear his invitation, through the Spirit and Bride... which invitation is to:
"COME!"
I ask you... to WHOM will you come... if you DO NOT HEAR?
Believe what you will. And follow who you will. As for ME... I will follow the Lamb... wherever HE goes... wherever HIS voice... leads me. For he is the Fine Shepherd, and for ME... there is no other.
Again, I bid you all the greatest of peace.
A slave of Christ,
SJ
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DJ
Oh, so this is where everyone has been>>!! Hi!
Listen up folks......the heavens and earth were made by the Word. He spoke it into existence. This is said throughout the bible. The Word was GOD the creator. He made it alone by himself. They are one. Doesn't make sense? How humbling.
I will be more than happy to supply all of the verses upon your request, if you want them. Give me a day or two to gather them all up though. There are many. Love you guys, dj
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UnDisfellowshipped
Noko said:
UD,
Please be aware that the Masoretic Tex,t which the oldest complete copy known is the Leningrad Codex, which was copied in 1008CE and the Codex Sinaiticus (Septuagint) is from 400CE does differ in PS 102:25. The oldest text know for PS102:25 is from the Dead Sea scrolls dating from mid 2nd century BCE to 50-68CE, you could say more reflective of the writtings that Jesus in the flesh and his apostles used. This is from the Dead Sea Scrolls Bible:
PS:102:24,25
24 "O my God. Do not take me away in the midst of my days--you whose years endure throughout all generations!" 25 Long ago the earth was founded, and the heavens are the works of your hands.
The MT and Dead Sea Scrolls agree.
Someone could argue that the Septuagint later was altered which affected our current translations of the greek writtings we use today reflecting the altered greek Septuagint text.
Are you saying Hebrews 1:10 has been altered or corrupted in all our modern Bible Translations? I find that very hard to believe. If Hebrews 1:10 has been altered, then how many other Verses have been altered? That would mean that God has not preserved a reliable Translation of His Word the Holy Scriptures, and I am sure that is not true.
Let's do a comparison of some Verses:
English Majority Text Version of Hebrews 1:10: And: "You, LORD, in the beginning laid the foundation of the earth, and the Heavens are the work of Your hands.
Septuagint Version of Psalm 102:25: In the beginning You, O Lord, laid the foundation of the earth; and the Heavens are the works of Your hands.
Modern King James Version of Psalm 102:25: Of old You have laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the work of Your hands.
Dead Sea Scrolls Version of Psalm 102:25: Long ago the earth was founded, and the heavens are the works of your hands.
Now, which Version of Psalm 102:25 was quoted in Hebrews 1:10? It is obvious to me that it is the Septuagint Version (or the Hebrew text that the Septuagint was translated from) that was quoted in Hebrews 1:10.
And, since the Holy Spirit inspired the writer of Hebrews to include that Version of Psalm 102:25, it is definitely the correct Translation.
Even if Hebrews 1:10 or Psalm 102:25 did not contain the Name "Yahweh", Hebrews 1:10 is still proclaiming Jesus as Yahweh, because Hebrews 1:10 says that Psalm 102 was talking about The Son, not The Father.
Also, notice here is another Verse where the Septuagint (or the Hebrew text that the Septuagint was translated from) is quoted in Hebrews Chapter 1:
English Majority Text Version of Hebrews 1:6: But when He again brings the Firstborn into the world, He says: "Let all the angels of God worship Him."
Septuagint Version of Deuteronomy 32:43: Rejoice, you Heavens, with Him, and let all the angels of God worship Him; rejoice you Gentiles, with His people, and let all the sons of God strengthen themselves in Him; for He shall avenge the blood of His sons, and He shall render vengeance, and recompense justice to His enemies, and will reward them that hate Him; and the Lord shall purge the land of His people.
Modern King James Version of Deuteronomy 32:43: Rejoice, O, nations, with His people; for He will avenge the blood of His servants, and will render vengeance to His foes and will be merciful to His land, to His people.
________________________________________Noko said:
In any case if Jesus is Yahweh you would be denying that Yahweh has a Son since you are talking about the same person, yet there are many Sons of Yahweh who just like you and me are separate individuals, maybe united in many ways but are individuals. Father and Son relationship is very clear in the Bible we have today, Yahweh is not a God of confusion, Jesus is the Son of Yahweh just like you are a son from your father.
I agree 100% that Jesus and The Father are Two separate distinct Persons, I have always believed this and I always will, because that is what the Scriptures teach.
However, I believe you are wrong about Jesus not being Yahweh.
Where do the Scriptures say that Yahweh is only One Person? Where does the Bible say only The Father is Yahweh? From what I have read, there is not one Scripture anywhere in the Bible, that says only The Father is Yahweh, to the exclusion of The Son.
I believe that The Father is Yahweh God, The Son is Yahweh God, and The Holy Spirit is Yahweh God. Three separate, distinct Persons, who are in Unity as One Almighty God, the Creator.
The following Scriptures show that there is more than one Person who has the Name Yahweh:
The Father is Yahweh (nobody questions this):
Isaiah 63:16: For You are our Father, though Abraham does not know us, and Israel does not acknowledge us. You, O Yahweh, are our Father, our Redeemer; Your Name is from everlasting.
The Son [Jesus Christ] is Yahweh:
Zechariah 3:2: And Yahweh said to Satan, "Yahweh rebuke you, Satan! And, Yahweh who has chosen Jerusalem rebuke you! Is this not a brand plucked out of the fire?"
In Zechariah 3:2, there are Two Persons who have the Name Yahweh. I believe it is The Father and The Son.
Romans 10:9-13: that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and you believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you shall be saved. For with the heart one believes resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth one confesses, resulting in salvation. For the Scripture says, "Whoever believes on Him shall not be put to shame." For there is no difference between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord of all is rich to all who call upon Him. For "whosoever shall call upon the Name of the LORD shall be saved."
Notice, in Romans 10:9-13, the Apostle Paul says that whoever believes and confesses with their mouth that Jesus is Lord will be saved, and that there is One Lord over everyone, and that is Jesus, and then Paul quotes Joel 2:32, which says:
Joel 2:32: And it shall be, whoever shall call on the Name of Yahweh shall be saved; for salvation shall be in Mount Zion and in Jerusalem, as Yahweh has said, and in the remnant whom Yahweh shall call.
Paul applied Joel 2:32 to confessing that JESUS IS THE LORD, therefore, Romans 10:9-13 shows that Jesus is Yahweh.
Isaiah 40:3-5: The voice of him who cries in the wilderness, Prepare the way of Yahweh, make straight a highway in the desert for our God. Every valley shall be exalted, and every mountain and hill shall be made low; and the crooked places shall be made level, and the rough places smooth; and the glory of Yahweh shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together; for the mouth of Yahweh has spoken.
Matthew 3:1-3: In those days John the Baptist arrived preaching in the wilderness of Judea, and saying, "Repent, for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand!" For this is he who was spoken of by the prophet Isaiah, saying: "A voice of one crying in the wilderness: 'Prepare the way of the LORD; make His paths straight.' "
Matthew 3:11-13: I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit, whose winnowing shovel is in His hand, and He will thoroughly purge His threshing floor, and He will gather His wheat into the barn; but the chaff He will burn up with unquenchable fire." Then Jesus arrived from Galilee to John at the Jordan, to be baptized by him.
Who did John the Baptist "prepare the way" for? Old Testament says Yahweh -- New Testament says Jesus. Therefore, Jesus is Yahweh.
Romans 14:10-12: But why do you judge your brother? Or why do you despise your brother? For we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ. For it is written: "As I live, says the LORD, every knee shall bow to Me, and every tongue shall confess to God." So then each of us shall give account concerning himself to God.
Romans 14:10-12 is very, very interesting, first of all, Paul quotes Isaiah 45:21-23:
Isaiah 45:21-23: Declare and bring near; yes, let them take counsel together. Who has declared this of old? Who has told it from then? Is it not I, Yahweh? And there is no other God besides Me; a just God and a Savior; there is none besides Me. Turn to Me, and be saved, all the ends of the earth; for I am God, and there is no other. I have sworn by Myself, the word has gone out of My mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, that to Me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.
Notice that Yahweh is the Only God, there are no other gods who are God by nature. Yahweh also says that every knee would bow to HIM [Yahweh] and every tongue would confess to HIM [Yahweh].
Notice the following Scripture, where Isaiah 45:21-13 is fulfilled in JESUS:
Philippians 2:9-11: Therefore God also has highly exalted Him, and has graciously given Him a Name which is above every name, that at the Name of Jesus every knee may bow, of those in Heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue may confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Also, in Romans 14:10-12, Paul says that we will all stand before the Judge, Christ, and then Paul says we will all give an account of himself to GOD. And Jesus Himself said that The Father judges no one, so we know that Romans 14:10-12 is talking about Jesus being God the Judge.
Isaiah 6:1-5: In the year that King Uzziah died I then saw the Lord sitting on a throne, high and lifted up, and His train filled the Temple. Above it stood the seraphs; each one had six wings; with two he covered his face, and with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. And one cried to another, and said, Holy, Holy, Holy, is Yahweh of Hosts; the whole earth full of His glory. And the doorposts moved at the voice of the one who cried, and the house was filled with smoke. Then I said, Woe is me! For I am undone; for I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips; for my eyes have seen the King, Yahweh of Hosts.
John 12:41: These things Isaiah said when he saw His glory and spoke about Him.
The Old Testament says Isaiah saw the glory of YAHWEH -- John 12:41 says Isaiah saw the glory of JESUS. Therefore, Jesus is Yahweh.
Exodus 3:2: And the Messenger of Yahweh appeared to him in a flame of fire, out of the midst of a thorn bush. And he looked. And behold! The thorn bush burned with fire! And the thorn bush was not burned up. (Verse 6:) And He said, I am the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. And Moses hid his face, for he was afraid to look upon God. (Verses 13-15:) And Moses said to God, Behold, when I come to the sons of Israel, and shall say to them, The God of your fathers has sent me to you, and they shall say to me, What is His Name? What shall I say to them? And God said to Moses, I AM WHO I AM. And He said, So you shall say to the sons of Israel, I AM has sent me to you. And God said to Moses again, You shall say this to the sons of Israel, Yahweh the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you. This is My Name forever, and this is My Memorial from generation to generation.
Notice in Exodus 3:2, it is "The Messenger of Yahweh" who was in the burning bush and who spoke to Moses. The Messenger of Yahweh then tells Moses that He is God, and that He is I AM WHO I AM and that His Name is YAHWEH.
I believe that this was definitely Jesus speaking, because He is called The Messenger of Yahweh (which would be The Father), and yet, He is also called YAHWEH and I AM WHO I AM.
Then, in the New Testament, Jesus proclaims that He is I AM!
John 8:24: Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I AM, you will die in your sins." (Verse 28:) Therefore Jesus said to them, "When you lift up the Son of Man, then you will know that I AM, and from Myself I do nothing; but just as My Father taught Me, these things I speak. (Verses 57-59:) Then the Jews said to Him, "You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?" Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM." Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself and went out of the Temple, having gone through their midst, and so passed by.
John 18:4-8: Jesus therefore, knowing all things coming upon Him, went out and said to them, "Whom do you seek?" They answered Him, "Jesus the Nazarene." Jesus said to them, "I AM." And Judas, the one betraying Him, was standing with them. Therefore when He said to them, "I AM," they stepped back and fell to the ground. Then He asked them again, "Whom do you seek?" And they said, "Jesus the Nazarene." Jesus answered, "I have told you that I AM! Therefore if you seek Me, allow these men to go,"
Jesus is I AM WHO I AM and Jesus is YAHWEH and Jesus is God Almighty.
Jesus is a separate and distinct Person from The Father and from The Holy Spirit.
Noko said:
Jesus does represent his Father fully, so by obeying Jesus, worshipping Jesus, listening to Jesus is indeed doing the same with his Father. Even today we have many examples of this principle where the son represents the father in legal matters, orders, judgements in many different types of businesses. Still the Father and the Son are not the same individual, to say so means the Father is not a Father and the Son is not a Son but only one individual. Any doctrine that denies the Son and the Father is false.
I agree completely and absolutely with what you stated there. It is the "Oneness Pentecostals" who believe The Father and The Son and The Spirit are all one Person. Trinitarians believe They are Three separate distinct Persons.
Noko said:
No need for challenges, the Holy Spirit can teach you all things, that is what we have to pray for and to listen to. The living word is alive, loud and clear, the Bible clearly points us to listen to the Holy Spirit.
Now "God said, 'Let us make man in our own image, in the likeness of ourselves, and let them be masters of the fish of the sea, the birds of heaven, the cattle, all the wild animals and all the creatures that creep along the gound.'" ". . . male and female he created them."
May you find favor and be blessed from our saviour Jesus Christ (Mighty God) and from his Father Yehweh God Almighty.
Thank you for your comments.
I agree that the Holy Spirit can and will teach us all things, however, the Scriptures, which were inspired by the same Holy Spirit, tell us that we should help each other, and to tell others the Truth from the Scriptures, including the Truth of the Trinity.
Notice, the following Scriptures say that we should tell others the Truth from the Scriptures:
Romans 10:13-15: For "whosoever shall call upon the name of the LORD shall be saved." How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear apart from a preacher? And how shall they preach unless they are sent? Just as it is written: "How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the gospel of peace, of those preaching the Gospel of Good Things!"
Mark 16:15-16: And He said to them, "Go into all the world and proclaim the Gospel to all creation. He that believes and is baptized shall be saved; but he that does not believe shall be condemned.
(Also, as a side-note, notice Jesus did not "he that does not get baptized shall be condemned", but Jesus said "he that does not believe shall be condemned")
Acts 26:12-18: "In which pursuits also, as I traveled to Damascus with authority and commission from the chief priests, at midday, O king, along the road I saw a light from Heaven, brighter than the sun, shining around me and those traveling with me. And when we all had fallen down to the ground, I heard a voice speaking to me and saying in the Hebrew language, 'Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me? It is hard for you to kick against the goads.' "So I said, 'Who are You, Lord?' And He said, 'I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. But arise and stand on your feet; for I have appeared to you, to appoint you a minister and a witness both of the things which you have seen, and of the things which I will yet reveal to you, delivering you from the people, and from the Gentiles, to whom I am sending you, to open their eyes, in order to turn them from darkness to light, and from the authority of Satan to God, in order for them to receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who are sanctified by faith in Me.'
Revelation 2:1-3: "To the angel of the Church of Ephesus write, 'These things says He that holds the seven stars in His right hand, who walks in the midst of the seven golden lampstands: "I know your works, and your labor, and your endurance, and that you cannot bear those who are evil. And you tested those who say that they are apostles and they are not, and you found them to be liars; and you have endurance and you have born patiently on account of My Name, and you did not become weary.
Notice those last Verses: Jesus blesses those who test what other Christians say to make sure they are teaching the Truth.
May God The Father, Jesus Christ the Lord, and The Holy Spirit bless you Noko!
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noko
Aguest wrote:
"In the beginning", which means... "In the Ark"... which means "In the womb of the Woman"... which means "IN THE SPIRIT REALM..."
Aguest wrote the truth from the Holy Spirit as I bare witness:
Gen 1:27
God created man in the image of himself, in the image of God he created him, male and female he created them.
Man does not give birth to anything except through the women or through the womb. God gives birth "in the womb of the Woman" which is Jesus. Eve came after Adam but of the same flesh in the garden of Eden or you can say "In the Ark" where all life began. Jehovah and Jesus "IN THE SPIRIT REALM..." the Most Holy place where the high priest (Jesus Christ) can enter stems all creation perfectly exemplified by the example God gives us in the Garden of Eden. Eve was an image of Adam as Jesus is an image of God. Remember this is only an image that reveals the truth.
What Aguest wrote further is also the truth as given to him by the Son of the MOST HOLY (Jehovah) revealed to him by the name JAHESHUAH MISCHAJAH.
Peace and Love to all followers of our Lord Jesus Christ (JAHESHUAH MISCHAJAH) the Son of God who are join together in the worship of the Father.
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DJ
Shall I give you an egg?
Think of an egg. It has three parts. The shell, the white and the yolk. It is all an egg.
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noko
Except an egg wasn't used as an image of God .