Relationship questions (mildly long read)

by Descender 42 Replies latest social relationships

  • Descender
    Descender

    Hi folks, it’s been awhile since I last posted here. And I’m coming here now to see if I can find a few that have been in similar situations as me and to see what they did or didn’t do and how they would handle it if they could do it again.

    The last 2 months have been hell. My wife of almost 5 years has made a few decisions, I’m 28 and she’s 23 years old. I know that age is a factor here, because we married young. But I have always loved her with all my heart and we have always been very close, we had great conversations, always felt comfortable around each other, and she always seemed proud to be my wife. But she started acting strange and distant when she came back from a trip to Las Vegas a few months back. She’d gone out there with her family and had done a bit of partying and had a long talk with her sister-in-law in which she had come to a few harsh conclusions.

    She came back and was very distant. I kept on trying to get to the bottom of the problem and maybe I pushed too hard to find the answer. I was always pestering her to tell me what was wrong everytime I was around her. Finally she came out and said that I wasn’t the man that she wanted me to be and that she didn’t love me anymore and she had a lot of built up resentment because I had taken her for granted and hadn’t taken the time to make her feel special. She told me that she’d been holding in these feelings of resentment for 5 years, and she had just recently realized all of this. Then she took off her wedding ring.

    That was a huge bomb dropped on my head. I thought we had a great relationship, but I guess we didn’t. I asked her to give me 3 months to make some changes, to which she agreed. Since the day she told me, our relationship has been a rollercoaster ride. The first half of February was simply horrible. I didn’t know how to handle the situation at all and my wife would tell me a new batch of things that were wrong with me every other night. I would either push to hard or not push hard enough, making her mad by jumping to conclusions and end up feeling stupid and depressed or keeping things inside and end up feeling depressed.

    I decided that we needed to see a counselor because I really didn’t know how to fix our problems. My wife begrudgingly agreed to go with me. The week we started going to the counselor, my wife told me that we weren’t making progress living together and she wanted to move out. She told me that it would be a good idea because we could make a new start and maybe she could lose her resentment, we could date and she would move back in in 6 months or so. I didn’t like the idea that much, but she was persistent and I ended up helping her move out within the week.

    While she was still living with me, she did a few things differently, not bad per se, but different. She started by getting a navel piercing, the next week she got a tattoo on her inner thigh, and the next week she got a job as a cocktail waitress at a strip club. All the while, she’s still a grad student getting her degree in secondary education.

    She had been talking to five different guys on the internet during this time when we were having problems and all of these guys decided that they had fallen in love with her because she would talk to them until 3am in the morning and she would sometimes send them pics and videos of her. She didn’t know that I knew about all of this. When she moved out, she didn’t have Internet or phone connection for a week, so she spent a lot of time with me, which I enjoyed.

    Then the next week came and she started to be more distant again because she could talk to guys on the Internet again. She’d still call some and we’d see each other a few times a week, but she shy’ed away from my touch and wouldn’t let me kiss her. She told me she didn’t want to hold my hand or have me put my arm around her, and for the next week she told me that she didn’t think that we should really see each other at all. This got the assumptive wheels in my head turning and I write her a lot of e-mails so I logged into her e-mail account to see if she had checked the mail I’d sent her and there it was. There was a round trip ticket for one of these guys that she talked to on the Internet to come see her that day and spend a week here.

    I called her and told her that I’d checked her e-mail, which I know was wrong, but I’d seen the tickets and now I knew why she didn’t want to see me for a week. She told me that he hadn’t been able to board the plane because his ID was expired and that he hadn’t been able to make it. She was mad and it didn’t end on a good note. So I apologized for over-reacting and got her a card and flowers. She called me over the next few days, but we didn’t see each other. And then on Saturday, she called and told me that she really missed me and that she would like it if I came up to her work that evening and saw her. So I called a friend and asked if he’d like to go with me and we both went to the titty bar. She was friendlier to me than she had been in months and always had a big smile on her face everytime she saw me. That made me happy, and I went out to see I band at a club with a few friends later that night. After I got done there, it was about 1:30 am and I knew that she should be close to getting off work, so I thought I’d stop by her apartment.

    When I got there, I didn’t see her car, but I did see that all the lights in her apartment were on. So I walked up and when I got to her door, it swung open and there stood the guy that she’d gotten the round trip tickets for. My brain snapped, I had a few options. One option was to spring through the doorway and break his nose with a swift hit, but I took another option. I just walked by and pretended I wasn’t related to the situation at all. I got in my car and drove to her workplace, walked in and asked her to go eat with me. She said ok, but she knew something was wrong by the look on my face. I didn’t even have to say anything. She started crying and said that she was going to tell me after he was gone, but she didn’t want to tell me while he was here because she didn’t want any trouble. She said that him being here had let her see that she still loved me and that she’d gotten him a one way ticket home for the next morning because she said he was expecting something he wasn’t going to get.

    The next morning she came over to the house after she dropped him off and told me that she loved me and ended up spending the whole day with me. The next day she was distant again. And on Tuesday she told me that she didn’t want to hurt me or lead me on, but that she did love me and that she wanted to grow old and have kids with me, and I was her best friend, but (the big but) she didn’t want that right now. Right now she wants to enjoy her freedom, she wants to live it up a bit and date other people and have sex with other people. She says that she will eventually settle down in a few years and then she knows exactly what she wants when that happens….. me.

    So now she wants to be my best friend with benefits of sex, but otherwise, she wants to be free to see and be with other people if she so chooses. She even told me that she wanted me to see and have sex with other women, which is hard for me to come to grips with at the moment.

    Anyway, that’s my situation. It seems strange to me, but I know a lot here have been through some strange things. If you’ve been through something similar, did you stick it out? Leave? Go crazy? If you stuck it out, how’d you do it? Are you happy now? You know, the normal questions.

    Don’t get me wrong, I love this woman and I’d do about anything for herand I want it to work out. And I don’t want to make her sound bad and I wouldn’t normally air my problems to a bunch of strangers, but I am just at a loss as to what to do. And I can see the problems that she says that we’ve had over the past 5 years, even though I was totally oblivious to these things while they were occurring. So I’m trying to improve myself as well and I’m hoping the pricey counseling sessions start to help eventually as well.

  • Xena
    Xena

    I went back and read some of your history...your wife and you were both dubs, right? You both drifted in the last year or so?

    My ex and I were both dubs and when we quit going we realized the only thing holding us together was the religion. We still love each other but we both want different things now....we tried an open marriage for awhile, which in retrospect I can now see was a last ditch effort to save our marriage...but ultimately we realized we were better off apart.

    I don't know all your circumstances and your situation may be totally different, but it sounds like your wife is wanting to spread her wings and fly a bit...she was a dub...married young...and probably never felt like she got to "experience life". Personally I guess I would steel myself for the possiblity that you might grow apart during this time and find you want different things, you can't force someone to be the person you wish they could be...

    I'm sorry you are going thru this...I know how much it hurts....wish I could be more help....

  • Elsewhere
    Elsewhere

    I have to agree with Xena... this is the result of a repressed upbringing and an early marrage. Most people get that stuff out of their system before they get married, but JWs dont' get that. Now she is going through that phase far later in her life.

    I wish you the best.

  • Nosferatu
    Nosferatu

    A lot of this sounds very familiar to what I went through.

    But she started acting strange and distant when she came back from a trip to Las Vegas a few months back

    This is probably a pretty good guess; she probably met a few guys in Vegas that she partied with, and she discovered that she was missing out on her freedom. Within an incredibly short amount of time, she probably found herself attracted to those guy(s) and started questioning the situation she's in.

    Finally she came out and said that I wasn’t the man that she wanted me to be and that she didn’t love me anymore and she had a lot of built up resentment because I had taken her for granted and hadn’t taken the time to make her feel special.

    This is usually a load of bullshit. She's trying to get herself out of the relationship. She's saying "I just want out". I had my ex tell me the same thing.

    While she was still living with me, she did a few things differently, not bad per se, but different. She started by getting a navel piercing, the next week she got a tattoo on her inner thigh, and the next week she got a job as a cocktail waitress at a strip club.

    When women begin making changes in their personal life, they usually change who they're with as well. My ex began listening to different music before she left me.

    She told me she didn’t want to hold my hand or have me put my arm around her, and for the next week she told me that she didn’t think that we should really see each other at all. This got the assumptive wheels in my head turning and I write her a lot of e-mails so I logged into her e-mail account to see if she had checked the mail I’d sent her and there it was.

    What I've noticed in failing relationships is that one person pulls back while the other tries to pull closer. You became desperate to save your relationship, and you ended up doing dumb things because you were afraid. When this happens, usually the other person pulls back even more. In reality, everything you were doing to try and save the relationship only made it worse.

    So I apologized for over-reacting and got her a card and flowers.

    Yup, I did that. It doesn't work. Cards and flowers fall under the "Romance" category. It's hard to have romance when there's no relationship. Using romance is a terrible way to start or save relationships. Romance is the spice that you add to a relationship to make it better.

    but (the big but) she didn’t want that right now. Right now she wants to enjoy her freedom, she wants to live it up a bit and date other people and have sex with other people. She says that she will eventually settle down in a few years and then she knows exactly what she wants when that happens….. me.

    More bullshit. She's now trying to let you down easy. Again, I was fed the same thing. She's trying to give you a false hope for the future just to make you feel better.

    If you’ve been through something similar, did you stick it out? Leave? Go crazy?

    I tried to save the relationship and only ended up going crazy. After about a month, I saw it wasn't getting any better and I should make the effort to move on (she already moved out). Here's some advice: the quicker you move on, the quicker you're going to get over it. From the sound of it, this bitch isn't worth working that hard for. I know I'm sounding a bit harsh here, but she's not putting effort into the relationship. She's putting effort into her desires only. She's the one who doesn't want to make it work, and there's no use trying to change her mind about it. You can lead a horse to water, but you'll drown the fucker trying to make him drink. She's made her mind up; she wants to move on. She's not taking the marriage commitment seriously. The two of you gave up your freedom of dating when you put your relationship in stone. It sounds like she never realized that. You'll do yourself a huge favor if you work on moving on with your life. The frustration and the craziness will decrease and eventually end.

    You're basically left with two options: Separate or Divorce. Those are the only options she left you with. She may eventually leave you with one: Divorce.

    I hope this helps, and I wish you luck on whatever path you decide to take.

  • FreeWilly
    FreeWilly

    Hi Decender,

    My ex and I went through a similar period. She lavished the attention she got from other guys. She ended up sleeping with one of them. We are divorced. We are friendly when we talk, which is not that often. She really laments her life now, because we really did have a good thing going. She has called me crying at what her life is now compared to when we were together. I think she just needed to figure a few things out on her own. Unfortunately it cost us our relationship.

    There was a 2 year period where we went through all sorts of scenario's in an attempt to work it out. We were together, seperated, and everything in between. The bottom line is that I could not live with that kind of betrayal. I tried and I hated myself and her for it. It take's a little while to get over things like this, but for me I came out of it great. I just wish it didn't take me 2 years to figure that out.

    It sounds like your wife has some issues to work out. Being a former JW no doubt contributes to this. Unfortunately this probably results in putting you through the meat grinder in one way or another. If I were you, I would seriously consider starting the Divorce process. In the US this can take awhile (3-6 months). If things work out in the mean time great, but if it doesn't, you won't have to drag it on and on. Also, I wouldn't give yourself to her every whim. I think she is totally taking you for granted, She likely has no respect at all for you especially since you've thusfar shown yourself willing to be her doormat. She probably thinks she has you anytime she wants. I would tell her to "F#%* off, you B!#ch" (no offense to any ladies reading this, this is not a male thing, just a respect thing) then wait a few weeks to even speak to her. Don't answer phone calls, don't agree to anything. Don't tip toe around her feelings in an attempt not to make her mad, in fact I would go out of your way to piss her off. Afterall she does deserve it. If you cast yourself as the pansy ass who will jump at any shred of hope you're doomed. Would you want to be around someone so pitiful and desperate? You must respect yourself before anyone else will. After some time has gone by you may see what, if anything, is left. She will likely try to make up with you, fearing that she lost her Mr. Last Resort.

    This is just my opinion. I followed that advice (after 2 yrs of trial and error) and realized that I didn't want the remnants of a broken down shell of a relationship. If I did want the relationship I could have had it back, but I didn't. My advice is to take back your self respect first before you make yourself vunerable again.

    The flip side of the coin is that you make yourself availible to her no matter what. She knows you will always be there for her. When nothing 'better' is going on, you are her man (Mr last resort). However, when opportunity knocks, it's meat grinder time again for you. Only this time you two may have wasted 10 additional years together with kids, a house etc. If only you knew it would have turned out this way when you were younger......... Just my thoughts, take it or leave it.

    I wish you the best.

  • bikerchic
    bikerchic

    Defender:

    Wow that was a painful read, I can't really imagine how painful it's been living it, my heart goes out to you.

    You asked for advise and I've learned that people seldom really take even good advise unless they are really ready. I doubt you are ready to let go of her, hopefully counseling will help you get there.

    Some thoughts that came to my mind about statements you made:

    Don?t get me wrong, I love this woman and I?d do about anything for herand I want it to work out. And I don?t want to make her sound bad and I wouldn?t normally air my problems to a bunch of strangers, but I am just at a loss as to what to do. And I can see the problems that she says that we?ve had over the past 5 years, even though I was totally oblivious to these things while they were occurring. So I?m trying to improve myself as well and I?m hoping the pricey counseling sessions start to help eventually as well.

    If you would really do anything for her, help her grow up! She is a married woman wanting a single life, give it to her. It would take two to make things work out, she doesn't want to make it work. You don't want to make her sound bad, don't worry she does a good job without your help. Don't be weak, at a loss as to what to do. Do her and yourself a favor and kick her to the curb. Cut the ties, divorce her and when in counseling the question you might want to focus on is why a woman like her is attractive to you? You want to improve yourself, getting rid of her is a big improvement.

    Sorry to sound so harsh, but I speak from my own experience and believe me life is too short to waste it on trivial things or crappy people. I wish you well, you are young and hopefully have learned a valuable lesson and will grow from it.

    Regards and best of luck,

    Kate

    PS You've got a PM

  • Country Girl
    Country Girl

    As long as you are willing to be treated like a doormat, you'll be one.

    CG

  • Maverick
    Maverick

    Wow! For a minute I thought I was reading my own history!

    There is no nice way to say this pal, you are toast!

    You can never go back, she tipped her hand, you don't want this!

    If you take her back at some future date she will punish you. You will be telling her she can treat you like dirt and you are OK with it!

    You picked a bad one, learn from it.

    If you have no children count your blessings! You are better than this, don't settle! Your young, be glad you didn't invest 15 years with her and lose your retirement over this person! Like I did!

    Maverick

  • SYN
    SYN

    I completely agree with what Maverick said. Don't reward this woman for playing with you like a cat toys with a catnip-toy!

    She'll only do it again! I've seen this happen time and time again to my friends.

    From the sound of it, this woman doesn't deserve you.

    Find someone that you can trust, who loves you, not someone who treats you like her own personal toy that she can do whatever she wants with.

    Liberate yourself! See other women - be more active socially. Don't curl up into a little cocoon. Soon enough you'll find a wonderful, warm, intelligent woman - just keep on looking. Be persistent.

    And then one day, I guarantee you, she's gonna come back when she realizes what she's missing out on, and you'll already be in a REAL relationship with a REAL woman! Not a player of games!

    There are too many great women out there to waste your time with one who treats you like this.

  • kat2u
    kat2u

    I have been on both sides of this one.And i agree with all thats beingsaid above>I asorry for the painyou are going thru.Do though know not alone and others have made thru sucessfully.

    I would begin move on unless you want to be her yo yo for awhile, and then probably end up divorced anyway.

    I feel for you

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