by H. 80 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Just being here a few minutes I have seen one that had the word devil in it but with a cryptic form so it could be said "it doesn't say that"
You called? Actually, it means "Vampire"
I have one question to ask you, after all the publications that have come out, warning you of the dangers of the internet, WTF are you doing on the internet????
When I began to study I came upone persecution like I have never felt. When I became inactive it kept on for a bit but it stopped until a few years later I began studying again, isn't that funny how that works? I did not look at it as persecution, I looked at it as if it were a sign for me that I was headed the right path because it became tough, no one said it would be easy,
You know, that's really similar to the rationale of pedophiles "They are persecuting me for my "lifestyle" to love who i want, so I must be right!
Another anaolgy, you say this site is deceptive in wording. Kind of like when the elders say "We'll take care of it, we keep these things quiet" With pedophiles, and give the pedophile private reproof, when the victim is allowed to think it's "been taken care of". Now THAT's Deceptive.
Wow.
I could not verify my post was up probably because I am not "enlightened" but anyway, I saw a quite a few posts, you guys are quick to jump on anything that does not go with the flow are you not? Avashia you just did what you said Jehovah's Witnesses do... Anyways, I just saw an example of what you guys do, wow. and 1 more for the road, WOW.
Random Task, I did not realize what it was until after I registed, I do not surf the net much since it is just junk like TV. You are right, maybe I should have not posted, probably a mistake, but look at the quick response everyone had. I do not want to argue with you guys even though I felt a bit attacked, but maybe I made you feel the same and I apologize for that it was not my place. Thanks for the some what reply that at least took some time to type instead of just provoking a type of tempered reply. I know if I ask if you guys are so enlightened why didnt you try to provide info instead of harsh remarks, but you would say you are not a religion or some other reply. So, I say instead, why name the website what it is, obviously it is deceitful to those that are not aware. Why not name it something more closely to what this website really is? Just a question is all. But to me, if I may have an opinion, the remarks that were posted back were just filled with spiteful comments, I see the world has not changed much.
Love you all,
H.
Hey sister
We are not an organisation/not organised. That idea is false wt fluff. There are probably other lies from the wt about apostates/faders/dfd.
SS
H., I love you too. I'm serious.
However, this is what THe JW's have done to my Family. Tyler Davidow is my brother.
Suit Targets Jehovahs Witnesses
Benton complaint about sex abuse and church policy is said to be the first of hundreds across the U.S.
The setup is such that the elders are the voice of the Watchtower, and the Watchtower is the voice of Christ. Theyre taught that if you take it to the elders, you get the best forum already that you could ever be in. Kimberlee Norris, Forth Worth Attorney
10-6-02
BY JENNUFER ROUSE
MID-VALLEY SUNDAY
A man is suing the and North Corvallis Jehovah's Witness congregations and the religion's 'national headquarters for $3 million. The lawsuit accuses church leaders of ignoring the sexual abuse he suffered as a Child.
The suit is the first of hundreds of mass filings against Jehovah's Witnesses planned by the law firm that filed it. The complaint names the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York and numerous other defendants. It alleges that when Tyler C. Davidow, now in his early 20s, was 4 or 5, a fellow Jehovah's Witness member abused him. His mother, Cathy Davidow, contends that when she went to the elders of the church, they did nothing to stop the abuse.
Tyler and Cathy Davidow both declined to be interviewed. In this report, Mid-Valley Sunday is not identifying the defendant also named in the suit because he could not be located to respond to the allegations.
Jim Rifle, an elder from the congregation said ho couldn't comment on the situation because he didn't know anything about it and hadn't been served with court papers yet. "We'll address the matter when we are Informed of it through the proper channels," Riffe said.
Steve Cuda, an elder from the congregation, also had not heard of the complaint and could not comment. It usually takes some time before are served with notice of civil complaints. Officials at the national headquarters of Jehovah's Witnesses in , didn't know of the suit either.
However, J.R. Brown, a national spokesman for the organization, said that while Jehovah's Witnesses deal strictly with child abuse within the congregation, it isn't the church's job to report abuse. "Nothing prevents them from calling the authorities," Brown said. "They don't have to call us first. These things operate separately. If the offender is part of the congregation, we will deal with it in a church setting.
But if they are also reported to the authorities, we will not try to shield them.
A copy of the complaint was sent to the newspaper by attorney James G. Nelson. According to the lawsuit, Cathy Davidow owned a store called Blackbeard's Market 145 N.W. ,Corvallis , in the 1980s. While she worked at the market, she often brought with her and let rim play in a storage area, Mother and child were members of the congregation in 1989, Cathy Davidow employed a woman who, was a member of the congregation. According to the lawsuit, this woman often brought her teenage son with her to work, and, according to he lawsuit, he often stayed with in the storage area while he women worked.
In 1985, according to the complaint told his mother that the teenager had been sexually abusing him for a year, and she went to the elders of her church.
Kimberlee Norris, the attorney handling the case, said that Jehovah's Witnesses encourage church members to take complaints to he church leaders.
The control issue is so strong in Jehovah's Witness corn congregation," Norris said. The setup is such that the elders are the voice of the Watchtower (the name of the Jehovah's Witness headquarters), and the Watchtower is the voice of Christ. Theyre taught that if you take it to the elders, you get the best forum already that could ever be in.
According to the suit, when Davidow went to the elders of the church, they told her they would research the problem and take care of it and that she shouldn't tell anyone else aboutit.
Oregon law requires members of the clergy, like teachersand social workers, to report any allegation of child abuse to disfellowshipping the police. However, another law (ORS 40.260) provides an exception if it is part of a church's religious practice to keep confidential communication secret.
Brown, the national spokesman, said that Jehovah's Witness elders do report sex abuse in states where there are mandatory reporting laws.
If it is a state that requires clergy to report, we of course would view that as taking precedence over ecclesiastical privilege," he said.
Time passed, and Davidow didn't see anything being done, either to help her son of to discipline the offender. She continued to ask the elders what they were doing about the issue, the lawsuit says. Eventually, she contacted the elders at the congregation, where the alleged abuser and his mother were members.
The elders of (Corvallis congregation) instructed her to stop talking about it, we've got it handled," the lawsuit states.
In 1993, Davidow says she reported the matter to the Corvallis police .
"For her to come to that point, as a Jehovahs Witness, you have to come to the point where youre willing to be shunned," Norris said.
Jehovahs Witnesses teach that church members who rebel against the teachings of the church should be disciplined, for their own good, so that, they might repent and return to fellowship.
That often takes the form of disfellowshipping all members of the congregation, even other family members, breaking all ties with the offender. An article on the Jehovahs Witnesses Web site mentions that even saying hello to a disfellowshipped person might be wrong.
When Cathy Davidow finally reported her sons abuse to the police, she was disfellowshipped. was not disfellowshipped but chose to leave the faith on his own.
The basis of the suit against the Jehovahs Witnesses is that the elders were negligent in failing to deal with the reports of sexual abuse. And according to Norris, it wasnt a simple oversight on the parts of elders in . She believes that child abuse in the Jehovahs Witness church is widespread because of the churchs policies.
Its not that they intend for children to be molested by the dozens, Norris said. Its that their crummy policy allows this to happen. Theyre had notice upon notice that it is, in fact, occurring. At some point, does it rise to the level of gross negligence?
Thats why the suit doesnt just name the two local congregations, but the churchs headquarters and subsidiaries in and . And Davidows suit is not the only one.
Norris and a team of other attorneys are filing suits alleging negligence against the Jehovahs Witnesses organization in all 50 states. Davidows is the first because of the impending statute of limitations a civil suit for child sexual abuse cant be filed in Oregon after the victims reaches the age of 24.
Norris said the mass filings are akin to a class action lawsuit.
Norris first began working on the issue last May, when a woman approached her with a story similar to Davidows.
Her initial allegations were so outrageous as to cause me concern as to if they were even truth, she said. After I began to investigate her situation and did research on other like situations, it became clear that what she experienced, and what others experienced, are systemic in the Jehovahs Witnesses organization.
Since then, Norris said shes heard almost the same story from 200-300 different people.
There are two specific Jehovahs Witnesses policies that Norris contends foster sexual abuse. One policy, she says, tells church members to report problems involving other believers to church leaders instead of police. The other is that the church requires two eye witnesses to an incident before the accused person can be punished.
Brown, the Witness spokesman, said that while the church does require two eye witnesses or other compelling evidence before meting out any church discipline, thats beside church procedures. He said the church does not forbid members from reporting crimes to the police.
Were not trying to deal with the penalty of the law, he said. Thats a separate thing from our point of view. Yes, an abuser should pay the penalty, even if he has to sit in jail for 10 -15 years.
Norris said that despite what church leaders say about encouraging church members to go to they police if they wish to, that rarely, if ever, happens among Jehovahs Witnesses.
Norris said that while Tyler Davidow does hope to reclaim damages for the emotional pain his unacknowledged child abuse caused him, he and the other people she represents have a larger goal in mind.
"This is really difficult for him, but he wants to see policy change," she said.
We want to change Watchtower Society policy that, in my opinion, fosters and encourages child abuse
Abuse lawsuit brings forth new allegations
By Jennifer Rouse
Mid-Valley Sunday
On the heels of a lawsuit filed against mid-valley Jehovah's Witnesses congregations in September, another man has come forward claiming his child was sexually abused by the same person.
In a lawsuit filed in September, Tyler C. Davidow, 24, asked for $3 million in damages in the suit, filed in Benton County Circuit Court. The suit is one of a series of mass filings against the Jehovah's Witnesses that a Texas law firm is planning.
Davidow claims a man named Troy Christian McKenzie, now 34, abused him in 1984. According to the suit, Davidow, McKenzie, and both boys' mothers were all Jehovah's Witnesses.
The Davidow suit claims that when Cathy Davidow learned of her son's abuse in 1985, she went to the elders of her church and they told her not to make a report to the police so they could deal with it internally. Elders never addressed the matter, the suit claims. Tyler and Cathy Davidow both declined to be interviewed.
A lawyer for the Watchtower Society said elders at the Albany and Corvallis Jehovah's Witnesses congregations had no idea children in their flock were being abused.
"The elders did not know about this and were not responsible for this," said Philip Brumley, general counsel for the Watchtower Society, which is the Jehovah's Witnesses headquarters in New York.
After Davidow's lawsuit was filed, John Muir, a former member of the Corvallis congregation, came forward, claiming that McKenzie also abused his son, Eli.
When Cathy Davidow reported her son's abuse to the elders, other parents were not informed of the allegations against McKenzie, Muir said. But Muir heard about the allegations from another church member. He also heard that Davidow was not the only boy who had been abused -- and that Muir's son was one of the victims.
Shocked, Muir went to the elders and asked them to tell him what they knew.
"When I asked for information I was told I didn't need to know. It would serve no purpose," he said.
Muir and his wife then began years of wondering how to deal with the situation.
"You tell me, how do you ask a 4-year-old what was done to him?" Muir said. "Does he even remember? Maybe he has buried it so far in his mind that he doesn't remember anything."
After living with the uncertainty for years, Muir finally talked about it with his son. Eli told his father that he had been abused but did not remember the incident very clearly.
Muir has contacted the Texas law firm handling the case against the Jehovah's Witnesses church, but at this point has not filed a suit of his own.
Eli is now 25, and Oregon law says that civil lawsuits for childhood abuse must be filed before the victim's 25th birthday. But John and Eli Muir decided to speak out anyway, to encourage others who may have been abused. Even if there is no legal action taken in their case, Muir thinks that what was done was wrong.
"That boy was allowed to continue to roam about the congregation," he said. "Other families had no knowledge that they had a child molester in their midst."
Muir is no longer a Jehovah's Witness. He said he was "disfellowshipped" from the church several years after the abuse incident, for an unrelated matter.
He knows the elders did not intend for children to be abused. But he thinks church policy failed miserably when it came to dealing with abuse.
"I would say in most cases they do a good job," he said. "But in this case not only did they do a bad job, but they themselves caused harm to the children. They left the children exposed to future harm."
Brumley, the Watchtower Society lawyer, said that the elders aren't to blame for acts committed by another person. He says McKenzie wasn't even an official congregation member, though he may have attended some meetings.
"To our knowledge, he was never a baptized Witness," Brumley said.
Kimberlee Norris, one of the Texas lawyers filing cases against Jehovah's Witnesses, contends that church policies create an opportunity for abuse to occur. One policy, she says, tells church members to report problems involving other believers to church leaders instead of police. Another requires two eyewitnesses to an incident before the accused person can be punished.
She claims that McKenzie abused Davidow while he was a teenager living in Oregon, didn't face any consequences for it, and went on to abuse again.
Norris provided court records showing McKenzie served time in Alaska for sexual abuse.
McKenzie was convicted of sexually abusing a young boy in Alaska in 1994. He was sentenced to three years in prison, but two and a half years of that was suspended. He was considered a good candidate for sex offender treatment, and was allowed to move to Oregon with the condition that he remain on probation and attend a sex offender treatment program.
In 1995 and in 1996, the Oregon Department of Corrections recommended that his probation be revoked. His sex offender treatment provider wrote a letter saying McKenzie "is a fixed predatory pedophile who is extremely dangerous in the community."
McKenzie admitted that he had attended Jehovah's Witnesses meetings, where he was in contact with many young males, without receiving permission from his probation officer or obtaining an approved chaperon for the meetings.
"This is especially significant in that McKenzie's admitted history is that he met victims in the past through Jehovah's Witnesses gatherings," a probation officer wrote.
McKenzie is currently serving probation in Anchorage and could not be located for comment.
No court dates have been set in the case.
In October, documents were seized from a storage unit in Philomath and placed in a sealed envelope at the Benton County Circuit Court. According to court records, the envelope contains journals and documents belonging to McKenzie that may contain evidence of sexual abuse.
Brumley said his clients will continue to dispute the allegations.
"While our hearts go out to Tyler for the suffering he may have endured, we are confident that neither Watchtower nor any of the local congregation elders are responsible for what he alleges happened," Brumley said
H. We have all kinds of people here me 16 years out of JWland in November.....some were never JWs, some ExJWs, some current JWs, some disfellowshiped, some disassociated, some fading away, some never JWs, and a whole host of thier family members and those that share in parts of thier lives. Moms, dads, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts, children, friends who all have one thing in common. One way or another the Jehovahs Witness organization has had some impact on thier lives. Many of it not so nice. If you want to hang around then take the time to read the real bible discussions that go on here. Unlike reciting chapter and verse of the WTBTS' interpretation and being afraid to say you might think differently.. Reading some of the personal stories too will also give you all kinds of perspective into the lives Jehovahs Witnesses. Those kinds of discussions are what we work towards fostering, but these are real people who also have lives, in or out of the organization. That means sharing pictures, ideas, jokes, political discussion, as the different sections of the forum suggest. Nothing decietful about it. Stick around if you like and maybe you might find some people with simmilar stories to your own.
Sincerely,
District Overbeer
H you came to this site with spite, there are some here still in the org. If you would have said hi i am a practicing jw and would just like to chat ,instead of telling us how evil and blind we are you would have been greeted. You chose the replys you got.
Damn, I sure hope it wasnt cause we said Penis
How did I do the same thing I accused the dubs of? You are as welcome to this site as anyone else, just because I disagree w/ your rationale, especially equating persecution w/ the right path. If that were the case, The Jews would DEFINITELY be Gods people. It's warped logic, like saying "God is love, Love is blind, Ray Charles is blind, therefore, Ray Charles is God.
Just because I disagree, does'nt mean I don't care.
(((((H.))))))))
I hope you don't mind "apostate" cooties, cuz I sure as hell am ok w/ Jdub cooties!!!
Ray Charles is blind, therefore, Ray Charles is God
Bless you Avishai!!! Thanks for finally giving me a distinct answer. I know i'm on the right path now!!!!!!!
