by Elsewhere 111 Replies latest jw friends
Maybe one can even add Canada to that list, as they have recently sanctioned Islamic 'judicial courts' there.
Please show a reference for this comment. I would like to read the facts about it. Thanks.
btw, Canada ----> muslim? hahahahahahahaha
talesin
And you miss the point when I ask you to back yourself up. I was asking you to show by comparison that Muslims and the originating Arabic culture differed from European Christians of the same period.
They weren't any different---the Christians of the same time period were just as insane as the Arabic culture were. I'm not defending the history of Christianity as it's filled with just as much bloodshed, if not more, than what Islam is. My whole point is that Islam has not progressed---this is the 21 century for god's sake and they're still regressing; they're still living like they were 300 years ago. I noticed that you have absolutely no comment about their treatment of women........I guess perhaps that's a little something that you can't deny eh?
History of the world part one: http://www.impawards.com/1981/history_of_the_world_part_i.html CLICK ME
World domination,the commonality of demonic comics and the Watchtower cult.Hollywood is reinventing comic book characters for the big screen 
.We've seen the guys in tights and capes,fighting the evil villains:'hell boy','X-men mutants',the'joker'.. In their quest for world domination,the WT$ is right up there with the dark knights. 
..........Osama say's kill 'apostates'. The Latest "Osama bin Laden" Tape: Archive Entry From Brad ... ... of an audio message purported to be by al-Qaeda leader Osama Bin Laden, broadcast on ... kill the Muslims in Iraq, should know that they are apostates and outside ... www.j-bradford-delong.net/movable_type/2003_archives ............
......... Compare the Watchtower with Bin laden...."We are not living today among theocratic nations where such members of our fleshly family relationship could be """""exterminated for apostasy""""" from God and his theocratic organization, as was possible and was ordered in the nation of Israel in the wilderness of Sinai and in the land of Palestine.{{{{ "Thou shalt surely kill him;}}}}} thy hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. And thou shalt stone him to death with stones, because he hath sought to draw thee away from Jehovah thy God, . . . And all Israel shall hear, and fear, and shall do no more any such wickedness as this is in the midst of thee."-Deut. 13:6-11,
." "Being limited by the laws of the worldly nation in which we live and also by the laws of God through Jesus Christ, we can take action against apostates only to a certain extent, that is, consistent with both sets of laws." "The law of the land and forbid us to kill apostates, even though they be me...... A partial quote of the Watchtowers view on 'apostates'.LOL
Lol. I feel regret that context, history and all the dynamics that go into this history is either ignored or twisted.
One point I do agree with, is that the Crusades did not help foster mutual understanding among all involved.
Mary
They weren't any different---the Christians of the same time period were just as insane as the Arabic culture were.
Precisely. So the difference in religions does not explain the difference in the character of the culture today.
It is the difference in culture.
My whole point is that Islam has not progressed---this is the 21 century for god's sake and they're still regressing; they're still living like they were 300 years ago.
Very good, you're getting there. Yes, I'd say that's a fair statement. Many Muslims are like that in their heads; they are either directly from or one or two generations removed from ancestral villages where everything had been the same for hundreds of years. Electricity and cell phones don't change the inside of someone's head.
The traditional culture of many parts of the Islamic world has not been steadily changing since the 18th Century as ours has. It's been pretty much the same. Now change is thrust upon them from every corner. Our ancestors in the 18th Century would have standards we consider backwards or wrong (just as they would consider most modern people immoral). Is it surprising the same is true of many Muslims, considering the level of development of their cultures?
Of course, this means Islam isn't bad, war is no use, and what will bring peace is education, democratisation, sanitation, prosperity, emancipation and Western powers stopping using the Middle East as a playground for their strategic interests.
It's a more complicated solution, but it stands a chance of working.
I noticed that you have absolutely no comment about their treatment of women........I guess perhaps that's a little something that you can't deny eh?
I probably know more about the issue than you; I've been discussing your seeming eagerness to charcterise Islam as an intrinsically violent religion when it's actually over-stressed and threatened cultures that are violent. I can discuss the treatment of women, but there's not much point until you see that we're talking about cultures not religions; the lot of a Taliban woman and the Muslim and Turkish women in my neighbourhood are rather different, to say the least. Further proof it's CULTURE, not religion that we should be talking about.
Thi Chi
Lol. I feel regret that context, history and all the dynamics that go into this history is either ignored or twisted.
Funny, it's what I've been saying...
Of course, this means Islam isn't bad, war is no use, and what will bring peace is education, democratisation, sanitation, prosperity, emancipation
You're right, but look what happened in 1979. The Shah of Iran (while certainly no Saint) was trying to improve things and bring them up to speed and they rebelled!! They didn't want change, they wanted to stay right where they are. And they haven't budged an inch since.
I noticed that you have absolutely no comment about their treatment of women........I guess perhaps that's a little something that you can't deny eh?
I can discuss the treatment of women, but there's not much point until you see that we're talking about cultures not religions; the lot of a Taliban woman and the Muslim and Turkish women in my neighbourhood are rather different, to say the least. Further proof it's CULTURE, not religion that we should be talking about.
It's the culture by it is also the religion. The Koran is very explicite when it says that men are superior to women. It also tells men that even if they suspect that their wife might be screwing around on him (no proof or evidence is required), he had the perfect right to beat her. Muslim men still take this at face value. Even the most liberated Muslim woman STILL cover themselves all up like good little girls, to show their submission to men. I am willing to concede that their culture has alot to do with it, but you need to concede that their religion plays a huge part in their culture which is a huge part of their problem.
Mary
The Shah of Iran (while certainly no Saint) was trying to improve things and bring them up to speed and they rebelled!! They didn't want change, they wanted to stay right where they are. And they haven't budged an inch since.
The shah was doing it way too fast. That was a big part of the problem. Many disasters resulted. Look at how slowly british govt introduces changes, say for instance joining w the european union. Big cultural changes need to be done slowly, in some races even more slowly than in predominantly white countries, such as the usa.
Look at nixon's effort regarding china, and chinese developements since then. Compare them w the antichina/anticommunist wars of vietnam and korea. Which has been more successful?
SS
Even the most liberated Muslim woman STILL cover themselves all up like good little girls, to show their submission to men.
Please be more precise. Are you talking about women living in, for example, Saudi Arabia? Or Muslim women living in western lands? I work in a law firm and right across from my desk is a Pakistani Muslim woman. She's drop-dead beautiful, does not cover herself with a veil or burka but wears business suits just like all the other women practising law here, comes to the office Christmas party, dances, goes out with friends, in short, she lives what we call a "normal" (read: Western) life-style with the exception being that she doesn't drink much alcohol. She has had a drink or two in the past, but since she's not used to it, she can't hold her liquor well so basically avoids it 'cause it make her feel sick.
I used to live in an area of the city where many ethnic groups lived and there were many, many Muslims. The vast majority of the women, probably in the 85%-90% range, did not cover themselves. They were mostly from Pakistan, so there is definitely a cultural/geographic difference.
While the hijab can most often be read as a sign of a patriarchal culture, it can also become an emblem of resistance against modernity. Veiled Algerian women fight for independence from France, and when Egyptian girls who wear the hijab are relesed from parental authority as they are acknowledging Allah as their father, therefore allowing them greater freedom of movement in society.
I have a problem with the labelling of Islam as inherrently evil as four of my neighbours are adherents of Islam and while they all follow it to varying degrees, they are all friendly and part of our community. Tarring all Muslims as Islamist is like tarring all Christian as pro-life killers of abortionists.
I agree with mary . I think their religion is very much the main thing wrong with their society and God help the US if they ever acheive power and control , the christian influence is bad enough .
