The Second Amendment

by Englishman 81 Replies latest jw friends

  • Double Edge
    Double Edge
    Common Sense. We have it, you don't.

    .... uh, yeah.... right.... whatever you say...

    Results Are In on British Gun Laws

    Dr. Michael S. Brown

    January 20, 2000

    Many advocates of gun control point to Great Britain as an example of a gun free paradise where violence and crime are rare. Well, there may be trouble in paradise. Our friends across the Atlantic did tighten their already strict gun laws, with the Firearms Act of 1997, making self-defense with a firearm completely impossible for ordinary people.

    Obedient British subjects generally maintained a stiff upper lip as they surrendered their guns and their rights. How much did crime drop as a result of this sacrifice? It did not drop at all. In fact, according to the local newspapers, England is being swept by a wave of crime, including plenty of gun crimes.

    The London Times published a story on January 16th that sums up the situation rather well. The headline reads, "Killings Rise As 3 Million Illegal Guns Flood Britain". Armed crime rose 10% in 1998 and the numbers for 1999 may be even more dramatic.

    The British experiment with gun prohibition has resulted in the same outcome as other forms of prohibition. Since guns are banned, every criminal wants one and it is very profitable to smuggle them in.

    According to a police spokesman, weapons from Eastern Europe, some still new in their boxes, are turning up during investigations. Criminals now have unprecedented access to high quality guns at affordable prices.

    The Manchester Guardian, on January 14th, laments the fact that their city is being called "Gunchester". Police sources were quoted as saying that guns had become "almost a fashion accessory" among young criminals on the street. Some gangs are armed with fully automatic weapons and the generally unarmed British police say that they risk confronting teenagers on mountain bikes brandishing machine guns.

    The Sunday Express sent a team of reporters out to investigate the problem and reported in their story of June 20, 1999: "In recent months there have been a frightening number of shootings in Britain's major cities, despite new laws banning gun ownership after the Dunblane tragedy. Our investigation established that guns are available through means open to any criminally minded individual."

    The government is expected to respond by further tightening the laws on weapons of all sorts. Additional regulations controlling knives and airguns are said to be in the works, although this might be likened to beating a dead horse. The very act of armed self-defense is already punishable by law. That right has been handed over to the government in return for a promise of protection.

    Perhaps motor vehicles need to be more heavily regulated as well. According to a commercial security report, New Wave in Retail Crime, British bandits are using vehicles to smash storefronts in a type of crime called "ramraiding", which would be impractical if shopkeepers had the option of arming themselves. The report states that, "Many retailers have actually gone out of business because of the repeated attacks on their premises."

    This recent rise in crime is part of an upward trend that correlates well with the gradual tightening of gun control over the last several decades. The relationship between increasing gun control and rising crime is well documented in a scholarly 1999 report by Olsen and Kopel, All the Way Down the Slippery Slope - Gun Prohibition in England.

    The traditional view of England as a low crime society has also been seriously damaged by the 1998 study, Crime and Justice in the United States and in England and Wales, which is available from the U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics. This report concludes that English crime rates in the period from 1981 to 1996 were actually higher than in the United States due to differences in the way crimes are reported.

    The negative result from gun control laws should not surprise us. American cities have had similar counterproductive results whenever gun control has been implemented locally. Recent reports from Australia tell exactly the same story.

    It is no coincidence that crime typically goes up after a government enacts new gun restrictions. Several American researchers and criminologists have explored this effect. Whenever people give up their right to self-defense in return for a promise of government protection, the results have been negative. No amount of social engineering will change this basic consequence of human nature.

    Unfortunately, the downward progression of gun control goes only one way. British subjects will never regain the right to armed self-defense.

    Proponents of gun control in America have a lot of explaining to do. Unfortunately, with the aid of their media allies, this new information will probably be ignored completely or brushed off with a few carefully chosen sound bites.
  • hillbilly
    hillbilly

    As noted before... a true trend for Crown subjects to ponder over and even scoff at US regulations and politics... ask them to discuss their's; it's like pulling teeth....

    I wouldnt guess that some folks pulled up Jgnats link and looked at several catagories of stats before coming to some jaded (and media promoted) ideas about all of us "redneck" 'mericans awash in a sea of gunpowder and lead. Looks like there are some very dangerous countries out there...even with firearms "banned" from the average Joe or Jose.

    Sounds like you limeys need some muskets!

    ~Hill

  • talesin
    talesin
    I wouldnt guess that some folks pulled up Jgnats link and looked at several catagories of stats before coming to some jaded (and media promoted) ideas about all of us "redneck" 'mericans awash in a sea of gunpowder and lead.

    I think it's far from that, hill.

    Can it be that thou dost protest too much? We are not that far apart: you, me and the british.

    I don't see "'mericans" as "rednecks", but as an extremely diverse group, all of whom have differing opinions and standards ... it is a violent society (much like my own, and let's face it, far too close for comfort), and I'm not particularly fond of its mores ,,, but I must work from within to change them. Prolly much like yourself. ;)

    t

  • Mac
    Mac

    I'm always stupid and on rare occasion drunk...

    but, the right to bear arms has everything to do with the citizenry being able to protect life, limb, family and a way of life against any and all oppressors, whether they be incidental thugs or an unjust government. It is essential to a truly free society...(which I consider the most endangered of species)

    mac

  • talesin
    talesin
    I'm always stupid and on rare occasion drunk...

    mac,

    Where do I start? ....

  • Mac
    Mac

    J-Girl..

    Don't make me shoot you!

    mac

  • talesin
    talesin

    mac,

    Hey, I have my .22! Watch it!

    tal

    *gun-controlled-not-gun-deprived klass

  • Terry
    Terry

    When the second Amendment was drafted you owned a firearm, if you could afford one, for practical reasons. Food is practical. Defense against Indians is practical.

    A suspicion about the size of government was also in the back of many a man's mind. If an individual could rally his fellow countrymen against a despot; he might turn the tide on high-handedness on the part of government.

    However, none of the above applies AT ALL today.

    You could not successfully defend yourself against the Government today because you don't stand a bleeding chance.

    Secondly, the local Supermarket sells whatever food you may need; you don't need to kill anything yourself.

    Indians have not attacked recently; so, you can rule that out.

    My own personal view of owning weapons is this; I enjoy a well-made firearm esthetically; but, I don't want want any in my house because I have small children.

    When you have a weapon handy you have the weapon as an option. When you don't have a weapon handy; your field of choices does not include deadly force.

    All the scary scenarios we hear about home invasion, robbery, rape, etc. are contrived to make us feel fearful and, out of that fear, turn to weapons to solve our crisis of courage.

    Once you allow that option your odds of having somebody die around you go up dramatically.

    I feel like it is mainly men who fantasize about the POWER. Men crave power. They even have to hold the tv remote while watching tv or they get antsy.

    Nothing conveys POWER like owning a weapon. The artificial confidence is almost miraculous.

    But, for all you haters of gun-control out there, stop and ask yourself why it was necessary for Wyatt Earp and his brothers to BAN GUNS from Dodge City. Why was it necessary in the old West for law enforcement to take guns off the street to make cities settle down and become civilized? Why?

    The answer is obvious; but, you'll never get a logical argument out of a gun lover. They crave the power and they crave the logic and the arguments that support that view.

    I say to them: grow up you silly little boys.

    T.

  • Mac
    Mac

    mac,

    spelling class; klass..is just plain crass...

    * hears a Jersey-like Canadian mutter... "My ASS!!!" *

    machopalongcassidyclass (or was that young Cassidy?)

  • Mac
    Mac

    just a thought.......

    someone just broke into yer home and is about to rape yer wife and kill yer chitlins...

    which is faster...911 or old faithful?

    Take a look at Australia and the effectiveness of banning guns and the crime rate...

    *love the old: "If guns were outlawed...only criminals would own guns"...so true... they will...

    and isn't that a a lovely and intelligent scenario?*

    mac, shoots Terry class

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