Does the Bible interpret itself, or a fiddle you can play any tune with?

by Rod P 66 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  adelmaal

  Who said we had to understand the entire Bible? Who said we all had to agree on its meaning for that matter?

  I believe God is a person and the Bible encourages each of us to have a unique and personal relationship with him and his son. We are all individuals and we all have individual relationships with each other. I say the same should be the case with God and Jesus. Each of us will interpret portions of the Bible differently just as each of us interprets portions of communication, stories, television programs, etc. differently. It doesn't mean we need to get all bent out of shape over it because we don't all see things or understand things the same way. Heck, I read some of what's in the Bible and just think "how does that make sense..." But I endeavour to get from it what I can and I try to apply what seems right to me in my life and in my relationship with God and with Jesus. I don't believe any more is required of me (based on my interpretation - lol).
• 

  Rod P

  adelmaal,

  You realize, of course, there are a lot of Religious Organizations out there who claim that they, and they alone, are the one right religion, and the only pathway to God. You can't do it on your own, because you have to do it thru their Organization. And if God is on their side only, then God will reveal the correct interpretation of the Bible solely by and thru that one right Religion. That's their argument, not mine. I am trying to make the point of just how spurious this whole notion really is!

  The question is one of Authority. You do not have the individual authority from God to interpret the Bible. Otherwise, there will be nothing but confusion rampant in the earth. God supposedly works thru His Church to reveal His Truth, His Word, His Will.

  The JW's claim that they alone demonstrate the signs that they have Jehovah's blessings, the "Faithful and Discreet Slave Class", the Governing Body. "By their fruits you shall know my disciples." is their banner held high, proving that God is using them to teach the Truth from the Bible. Thru Jehovah's spirit, all is and will be revealed to and thru the G.B. Everything else is the worldwide empire of false religion.

  The Mormons claim they and they alone have the Authority to act and speak for God in these latter days. It is thru the principal of Divine Revelation that God reveals his Truth to a Prophet, Seer and Revelator here on earth, who has the Power and Authority of the Priesthood to act in the name of God. Without that Authority, we have no right to speak for God, and our interpretations of Scripture would, at best, be just another competing theory amongst many.

  The Catholic Church teaches that the Authority was given by Christ to the Apostles, and Peter as the head of the Church. "Thou art Peter, and upon this Rock I will build my Church." Thru Apostloic Succession, this authority was passed on down thru the ages, and the head of the Church, referred to as the "Pope", when he stands in the Office of the Holy See, is supposed to be under the Infallible Direction of the Holy Spirit (hence Papal Infallibility). And they teach that without the Authority of the Catholic Church, you cannot understand the Scriptures nor interpret it correctly.

  There are many others who claim they are the ones authorized to speak for God and His Book the Bible. Many cults have grown up around this notion. (eg. Mary Baker Eddy with her Science and Health with Key to the Scriptures, Second Adventism, David Koresh and the Branch Davidians, Reverend Jim Jones, and many more.)

  So then, how do we interpret the Bible? With or without authority? If we do it on our own, then it doesn't matter who believes what, and we will all just do our own thing! Is that the way God works?

  Rod P.
• 

  Narkissos

  The classical Protestant answer is the illumination of the Holy Spirit on the individual reader-believer. Of course this is a theoretical answer: as the main Reformers endorsed the results of the ecumenical councils Protestantism, de facto, accepted a measure of tradition -- which resulted in the condemnation of "heretical" free thinkers like Michel Servet.
• 

  adelmaal

  Rod:

  You realize, of course, there are a lot of Religious Organizations out there who claim that they, and they alone, are the one right religion, and the only pathway to God. You can't do it on your own, because you have to do it thru their Organization. And if God is on their side only, then God will reveal the correct interpretation of the Bible solely by and thru that one right Religion. That's their argument, not mine. I am trying to make the point of just how spurious this whole notion really is!

  I definitely see where you are coming from. I choose not to believe God is working through an organization or a specific religion. I don't believe that any religion or organization that sets itself up as God's sole channel for salvation or for truth has done so as a result of God's divine direction. I don't believe the Bible encourages us to worship God through an organization on earth and I don't believe it teaches use to take what is fed to us by man at face value. We have the Bible, we have Jesus' example and we have the Holy Spirit to guide us. It is for each of us individually to draw upon that personally. I agree with your line of reasoning that the whole notion of salvation based on an exact interpretation of the Bible or based on membership to a specific religion is ridiculous! I think your points are valid and the JWs are a long way from understanding the true meaning of God's word.

  I believe a personal relationship with God is what is important. I believe that what is in our hearts shows through in the way we conduct ourselves and in the way that we treat others. We are all brothers and sisters and we are all bound together. We should act like it and not separate ourselves from eachother because we believe differently. I believe Jesus left a guide for us to follow and that is all we need. It's simple for me. I do go to church but I do not believe my church is the one true source for spiritual guidance and salvation. They do not claim to be either. They actually work with other churches side by side to encourage spiritual freedom. I take what I believe to be from the Bible and I leave the rest behind.
• 

  Rod P

  adelmaal,

  So then, you agree that the path to God is an individual matter.

  Amen to that!

  The next question would be, by implication, "Is the Bible the only book in the world that can correctly teach us about God and have a valid relationship with the Divine?" This is not a ludicrous question, because millions of people around the world and thru history are just as convinced that this is so, the Bible notwithstanding. And since believing what you want about the Bible and within the Bible is apparently OK, then why does it not hold true that other writings and scriptures about God are just as valid for individual acceptance and interpretation?

  How about the Koran? The Vedas? The Buddhist writings? The Torah? The Gnostic manuscripts? The Book of Mormon? and others? If believing what you want from the Bible is valid, then why is believing what you want from books outside the Bible not of equal value? And just who gets to decide which is valid, and which is not, since you say interpretation is an individual matter? I am very serious here.

  Rod P.
• 

  adelmaal

  The next question would be, by implication, "Is the Bible the only book in the world that can correctly teach us about God and have a valid relationship with the Divine?" This is not a ludicrous question, because millions of people around the world and thru history are just as convinced that this is so, the Bible notwithstanding. And since believing what you want about the Bible and within the Bible is apparently OK, then why does it not hold true that other writings and scriptures about God are just as valid for individual acceptance and interpretation?
  

  How about the Koran? The Vedas? The Buddhist writings? The Torah? The Gnostic manuscripts? The Book of Mormon? and others? If believing what you want from the Bible is valid, then why is believing what you want from books outside the Bible not of equal value? And just who gets to decide which is valid, and which is not, since you say interpretation is an individual matter? I am very serious here.

  I, myself, have often thought about that as well. I'm not sure. I am inclined to believe that the Bible is God's one and only word and Jesus was sent to deliver God's message. I also believe that people can have a relationship with God separate from the Bible since there was a time when this was the case prior to its writing.

  I am going to go out on a limb and say that God provides us with what we need for salvation and it is up to us as individuals to seek him out. I trust that he ensures that each of us gets the opportunity to get to know him and his son. If, for no fault of our own, we do not receive that opportunity in our lifetime I do not believe God will hold it against us. His kindness is undeserved and Jesus' sacrifice was for all mankind.

  What do you think?
• 

  Terry

  Btw, I hate the large fonts, already - it doesn't lend your comments any more weight, but rather it detracts from readability. If folks need a larger font, they can always enlarge the fontsize for the whole site, in their browser.

  But, I can't see what I'm writing unless I use Larger fonts. Try to be more understanding. Sniff. Sniff.

  Terry
• 

  Terry

  Gee, Terry. Sounds like you have written off 5,000 years of human history, and the only thing left worth considering is the day and age we are living in. Sure hate to think that future generations are going to think about us in the same way. Maybe there's something to that, because by 10,000 A.D. the human race ought to be in outer space exploring other planets and galaxies, and they will say "Planet Earth? Wasn't that some Galactic Legend from centuries ago that claims our predecessors came from that distant planet in that far corner of of some Galaxy the inhabitants called the Milky Way? Well, of course, that's all just speculation now, because all the records got wiped out when an asteroid struck the planet and the whole food supply got wiped out, and they all died out. Pity! Wonder if there's anything to that story!........." Anyway, Terry, why don't we just end it all now, and put ourselves out of our misery?

  What is so great about the wacky ideas of ancient people? Would you use their ideas on medicine, childbirth, science, social heirarchy, slavery, economics, politics? Or, are you just enamoured with the religious ethos? Hmmm?

  Naturally we are all going to die. Nobody has ever escaped. That is what makes life NOW precious. In the Christian view this live NOW stinks and we need to get rid of it. So, you have your ideas backwards. It is the guy chasing after heaven who thinks being dead is a great idea; it is his ticket to God's Motel.

  Terry
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  Rod P

  Well Terry, before I comment on your last remarks, please indulge my curiosity, and answer the following questions in plain and simple English:

  1) Do you consider that the entire history of mankind has little or no value or validity?

  2) If there is no God, and this life is all there is, then how can there be any real value or meaning to life? And if there is no value or meaning to life, then what is the point of living?

  Rod P.
• 

  love11

  One guy's opinion is as good as another's.

  You got that right.

  So why is it that you have to believe in others opinion's of how the world began, or their thoughts on a human's possible afterlife? That is all the bible is- other humans views. Some people give the bible's words more weight by saying that it is written with god's guidance. Well who's to say that other books weren't written by god's guidance. It's your opinion. And opinions are just a human's thoughts. Then who has the truth? What ever you believe in makes it true. If you believe that a rock will heal you, it will. If you believe that your life is helped by a heavenly father, then it is. That's my views though. You have to decide what you will believe in because it's different for everyone.