Wife arranging for me to study with a brother! I need a plan!

by M.J. 48 Replies latest jw experiences

• 

  bebu

  ROFL at the scientist pic, MJ! What an image!

  I would refrain from being too obtuse with the potshots. If any brother thinks you are not sincere in a study, even though your questions are legit, then you will likely be dropped and your wife will be led to think that it is YOUR problem, not theirs. You could win 1 battle, but lose the bigger war.

  One thing I've had to do is restrain myself from tipping my hand all at once...

  I think that if you can persuade this brother to RESEARCH for you on the WEB about your questions, then you will have given him quite the gift. You could explain that YOUR research keeps going one direction, and you HOPE that he could show you PRECISELY WHERE you have misunderstood/mislead. This will require his reading 'apostate' literature, but you must insist on it if he balks. Tell him that it is impossible for him to answer to your satisfaction if he is unaware of the complete issue. And why would Jesus tell us to beware of false teachers and false teachings, if he did not expect us to be very thorough and careful?

  Only thing is, that even though he might gain some serious doubts, it will be a long time before he would ever admit this to your wife. Maybe the best you could hope for is for him to say he doesn't know, and look uncertain or whipped... or that he would have to contact the Society... and at that point you could ask your wife whether it all comes down to "Bible (or Integrity) vs. WTS" in the end? Their typical response at being cornered is to redirect attention to something else (point out that this is avoiding the issue).

  Good luck to you, M.J.

  bebu
• 

  Check_Your_Premises

  If you do this,

  1. let's pick a topic

  2. Write out the questions.

  3. Let our esteemed and worthy former dub brethren here give you their painfully predictable talking point responses.

  4. and then we can provide the punch lines.

  Let me know if there is anything I can do to help.

  Game-Set-Match
• 

  codeblue

  M.J.

  Wow....do you really want to study a book??? He will NEVER answer your questions fully....it will take forever to get the answers you want and he will be gloating he has a "new study"...Do you want to see him at your house every week and keep asking you to the meetings???

  I say: write down the specific questions your wife couldn't answer....Use these questions for ONE meeting witht the super JW. Don't get hooked into a weekly study. He should know how to answer ONLY your questions.

  You are a smart guy....if you feel you need to read the Knowledge book to get an "edge" on the reasons why he is answering a certain question, I suggest you do that in your spare time...Maybe before you meet with the super JW. (also grab your wife's "Reasoning From the Scriptures" for a quick analysis of JW terms and answers to questions. That is the book all super JW's carry in their "book bag" for quick and easy reference when in the door to door work.)

  Anyways....more power to you!!!

  Keep us posted!!!

  Codeblue
• 

  jaredg

  study what he doesn't want to study and that is the history of the organization. get a copy of the proclaimers book and a copy of "captives of a concept" by don cameron. the last few chapters of the book talk about studying w/ the JWs and how you are in the best situation at that point b/c you are expected to ask questions. make sure to ask the right ones. never let him concvince you that the organization is the faithful and discrete slave!!! that is a big point with the JWs. if he can't prove that to you then everything else has no foundation. GOOD LUCK!!
• 

  undercover

  The additional benefit to this method is that if you catch a brother who is pretty good, he might kick your ass

  The only way "he might kick your ass" is if you allow him to use circular logic and silly illustrations. If you stick to the subject, one at a time, he can't kick your ass. You might not convince him he's wrong, but he will lose patience and drop the study out of impatience at your "not getting it".

  The only advice I can give is that you know your material and know it well. Don't recite answers given here, but research it yourself and learn both sides of the issue; backwards, forwards, sideways, down.

  Another thing is to stick to one subject. Don't let it get sidetracked. The JWs are good at deflecting arguments and criticizm by introducing new arguments into the middle of a previous one. They aren't trained that way, it's just human nature to find a way to reaffirm what you think is true is true when evidence contrary presents itself. The cognitive dissonance thing. That's when they deflect that argument and go to another subject thinking that that one will prove them right.

  Here's one idea I've had if ever the elders come calling wanting to "study" with me to help me regain my "faith". I'll be ready with my Bible and notepad when they show up. They'll show up with the "Knowledge" book and bible. I'll say, I thought we were studying the Bible. Let's not confuse what the Bible says with any other commentary. Let's start in Genesis and see what we learn as we go. By the time you get to the Garden of Eden story and you study it on it's own merit, you can blow a JW(or any other fundamentalist) out of the water. You can confuse em so bad that they will either start to doubt or question what they believe or they'll run screaming from you and leave you alone. Either way you have controlled the situation.
• 

  Check_Your_Premises

  Good point Bebu,

  How about that MJ. What does your wife think your motive is? Are you trying to "be open minded and learn more about her religion", or does she think "he is trying to prove the jw wrong"?

  If your wife thinks it is the second reason, stump-the-chump could backfire big time... especially if you kick his ass.
• 

  Sunspot

  I would LOVE to see you "stump the chump", but the chump will have control over what's being discussed, especially if this would be considered a "study". It's very rare that a householder will just get to sit and choose the subjects for any length of time. The JW may like to have you think that you are "asking the questions, but you will be directed to a publication of their choice before very long.

  That's when the pre-digested material comes in, and the canned answers from the paragraphs arise. If you don't follow this prescribed pattern, you will be looked at as "difficult" and depending on the conductor, the study may be cancelled.

  One way to possible get around this (just a suggestion) would be to get the "study book" of his choice, and take a few days to absorb the first few chapters. Find out what's being taught and what you question about it (privately---no wife just yet). If you have any questions, come back on here and we can discuss them so you can be prepared to ask these things during the study.

  Some folks on here may have access to the particular study book, and can help you even further. If and when the deeper stuff comes in later on, then it might be time for your wife to sit in....while we are helping you on the side!

  I think it could work!

  Anybody else think so?

  Annie
• 

  candidlynuts

  yeah, he'll just want to study a BOOK with you.. read the paragraphs / answer the questions listed.

  it probably isnt worth your time.
• 

  sweet tee

  I like sunspot's idea. If you study the publication he chooses then you can challenge him on his own 'turf'. If you should choose this method, I suggest you don't move on until he is able to answer the questions you posed in the chapter, or accept that you two disagree.

  If the new book is set up anything like the old 'Live Forever' book, then the meaty (insert puke here) parts are towards the end ie. the true crapola, that's when you can really kick his arse! I wouln't be afraid of him per se, and honestly, in a search for truth there should be nothing to fear.

  You have all the help you need to 'stomp the chump' here. But being a former witless myself, I don't know how you can keep this from interfering in the relationship with your wife ... that's the true dilemma.
• 

  TheListener

  CYP, ROFLMAO (your end zone spike dance)

  I laughed so hard I started to cry.

  ok i'll back and read the rest of the thread now.