I was thinking of forbidding my wife from taking the kids out in service (page 10)

kls

Truly my fellow posters why bother with this Troll who is brain damaged . Ignore and it will flee to the vomit it so loves ,the wt.

a friend in need

kls ... I see you always add so much to each thread ;)

jgnat

Well, I refuted and AFIN got personal. So I am done. Can't argue with an illogical person. Just for reference, let's break down the bad arguments here.

That does not get around CYP saying ... that it is a little harder to 'PAWN' off a two year old. Again, are those the words of a caring, loving father? I think not.

That's right. Without confirming what the father meant, you are making grand assumptions about the quality of his loving care from a single phrase. Ad Hominem argument.

If he used them against this child ... may we assume he means the same toward all his children?

No we can't assume that. We know very little about the family dynamics in CYP's home. You are hanging CYP with a word. You are assuming that babysitting a two year old is equivalent to babysitting a nine year old. And generalizing a parent on very lean evidence.

The problem is one conceived in CYPs mind without benefit of discussing this with his wife before broadcasting it here.

You don't know this either.

If you doubt my honesty, you have no scruples.

Only if you are proven honest. Which only you know personally, and I have no way of verifying.

If you do have scruples, you would have no converstion with me.

Only a JW's scruples prevents them from talking to someone they consider "bad association". I have no such restriction. I talk to all sorts of people, even my schizophrenic son.

If I doubt your honesty, I have nothing more to say to you.

So, if I doubt your honesty, my honesty comes in to question? How?

I am not expecting a response, however. Like, I say, I am done. Honest or dishonest, neither is provable on the big, wide net. But your bad arguments are obvious. At least to me.

a friend in need

jnat ... you started a post to me saying you doubt my honesty. With no qualifier, I am supposed to say fine ... sit back and let you supposedly take the high road ... think again. That is precisely why I brought your honesty or lack of into the conversation. I have no idea whether you are a liar ... and you know nothing about me. So why start a post that way????

While my arguments may seem bad to you , you have none ... just your opinion. An opinion you picked out of thin air that I am not honest.

luna2

Nicely done, jgnat!

My question for afin is this: Why do you post here?

I'm really curious.

CYP, at least you got some good advice before our afin's needling hijacked the thread. Good luck to you and your family.

outoftheorg

AFIN, as usual you have impressed no one, you have been of no help to cyp in his quest to care for his kids.

You offer no information as how he and his newly jw wife can keep the marriage together and take the needed care of their children.

You criticize and and belittle only.

If you want to be noticed and respected, you will have to offer some real world suggestions on how to deal with a situation such as cyp is facing.

How can they hold the family intact and satisfy the needs of the husband-wife-and children in all areas including religious teachings and beliefs.

The point you are at now is you are laughed at or viewed as pitiful.

Outoftheorg

johnny cip

i read the first few pages of this. all this maybe be nice with the jw's is all BULLS$IT. my mom was reaming the shit out of the jw's . ever since my dad joined in @1969. mom has 5 children and none of us ever became jw's or even close to it. but we all went for a number of years only one hour a week. and we all hated it. mom cursed them every day . and still does. and it worked. we all hate the jw'smom is no christian but a good woman. only till about 6 years ago, did i , by my resreach make my dad pay for his lies. i'm telling you cut all these jw's off from your kids TODAY. I WOULDN'T EVEN THINK ABOUT IT. IT'S A NO BRAINER. i know i'm no fancy dan poster here. but i understand the jw's better than most here. like it or not. with little kids i would not let them anywhere near this dopes. and this is no JOKE. JUST today when my son went to stop to see my mom . i called my jw dad and told him of he says a word about jehoveh ect. i'll go over and punch him in the face. STRAIGHT OUT. my dad can't talk to my kids 13 and 16 about anything to do with god. i'll be pursecuted fast by my dad b/c he can't understand . i ain't fyucking playing any games . with him ,he can call the police on me 20 more times for exposing the wt as a scam artistsw BEEN THERE DONE IT ALL. . even if a jw thinks they can say more than what is the weather today to my kids. . i'll break their kneecaps with a bat. and they know how i feel. you take my hard works and temper them to yourself. and ream the shit out of them at every xhance. and you will win in the long run. .i think you get the idea. john

bebu

CYP, I liked your comments about how you were asking for some evidence to prove the JW religion. You might possibly consider pushing this one a little harder. Because, as father and head of the household (!) it is your responsibility to oversee the well-being of your children. And you are ready to investigate anything, but evaluate it carefully. Until there can be a reasonable amount of evidence to sway you to feel comfortable that the WTS IS all that they say they are, you don't feel that it is morally proper as a father to permit a one-sided and dubious education.

The benefit of this is that this allows her, as an adult, to draw her own conclusions and act on them, while it preserves your duty as a parent to give your input for the well-being of your child (your right just as much as hers). Your children rely on both of your experiences and wisdom and ability to sort out what is best. And if you can't see the JW religion as best, then it really isn't anything personal between you and your wife/you and God ("Jehovah")... it just means that you haven't been convinced and that it would be a moral failing of yours to allow her to bury the kids in JW theology without a peep from you.

You should allow the kids to go to the JW hall... but you should also make it a requirement that they attend another (or several other) local churches so that they can have some points of reference. It would not be good if they get scared to enter another place of worship; you can help them see that the walls will not fall in on them. It might mean that you will have to pry yourself out of bed a little earlier, but for their education it could really help. Of course, mom won't go... and you'll be able to carefully refute some of the ridiculous things that the JWs say about other denominations (are people really worshiping a cross here? Do they hate God? Do they have ways to show God's love to people? (Find out about food banks, housing shelters, counseling services, etc. You could put some wedges or seeds of thought down here.)

(...Actually, one condition you might insist on is to let them attend a VACATION BIBLE SCHOOL in your area this summer, too. Lots of churches do this, and all neighbor kids are welcome (you won't need to ever join up or become a member of the church). This could really give a balance to their perspective! Your 9-year old will probably really enjoy it a lot, I'd bet. It's only 2-3 hours a day for a week, and there's crafts, songs, stories and games. The contrast will be sharp between the KH and a VBS.)

Everyone here's given you great advice and insight (most everyone). But I think, with the expanded reason of the original one you gave in your first post, you could make a pretty strong statement about your concerns. And you could, with that same argument, successfully push for providing alternative religious information/background. The point is to help them keep an open perspective, so that they will be able to make a careful choice; not learn knee-jerk fear.

bebu

AFIN, you certainly have a relative clause missing from your user name. Add "...who is..." and you could find more sympathy here... maybe...

Whiskeyjack

CYP,

How does that Catholic saying go? Give me a boy when he's 8 years old and he's ours for life? (or something like that). What the main danger is the extent of programming your kids will be subjected to. I agree with the posters who've advised against outright opposition.

Instead, educate your kids to become critical thinkers and they should be able to avoid being hoodwinked. Adolescence should do the trick. Make alternatives available to them. This will be time consuming but will help them many areas of life besides avoiding a religion past its expiration date!

W.

avishai

Children are out in service with their single parents every day. We all pitch in and help each other ... a new concept to you

Oh, NICE parenting. Taking kids out in a hot car all day long. I absolutely LOVED being the token guilt factor at the door to get them to take the mags, walking around in a hot suit all day long with a bunch of fat sweaty adults, no place to play and told to be quiet and sit still the whole time, just like at meeting..

Not to mention taking kids out in cars with adults in a religion that keeps quiet about pedophiles and sends those pedophiles out in service with kids. Nice.
Not a new concept to me at all. Pitching in to help with what? Telling the kid to shut up? Brainwashing? Telling the kid how billions are going to die? How he should'nt talk to his grandparents because they are'nt dubs and thy are gonna croak too? Telling them (Much like terrorists) that everyone who does'nt believe like they do are "bad" and "evil" and should "die horribly"? Sounds WAY better than a day at the pool at the uncles house!!!! Where the hell do I sign my kids UP!!!!!!!!!

I was thinking of forbidding my wife from taking the kids out in service

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