What was Jesus implying........................... (page 4)

Narkissos

Defd,

If it's about context, please stick to the fourth Gospel (I know, you haven't said anything yet, but it's just a word of caution). MrsJones has provided the previous part, I would extend it a few verses downstream:

At that time the festival of the Dedication took place in Jerusalem. It was winter, and Jesus was walking in the temple, in the portico of Solomon. So the Jews gathered around him and said to him, "How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly." Jesus answered, "I have told you, and you do not believe. The works that I do in my Father's name testify to me; but you do not believe, because you do not belong to my sheep. My sheep hear my voice. I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish. No one will snatch them out of my hand. What my Father has given me is greater than all else, and no one can snatch it out of the Father's hand.
The Father and I are one."
The Jews took up stones again to stone him. Jesus replied, "I have shown you many good works from the Father. For which of these are you going to stone me?" The Jews answered, "It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you, but for blasphemy, because you, though only a human being, are making yourself God." Jesus answered, "Is it not written in your law, 'I said, you are gods'? If those to whom the word of God came were called 'gods'--and the scripture cannot be annulled-- can you say that the one whom the Father has sanctified and sent into the world is blaspheming because I said, 'I am God's Son'? If I am not doing the works of my Father, then do not believe me. But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in me and I am in the Father." Then they tried to arrest him again, but he escaped from their hands.

joelbear

I think he was implying that he and God were in a monogamous homosexual relationship.

ozziepost

yeah, right!

ozziepost

Anyone get the feeling that defd is doing a lot of page turning right now?

ozziepost

Goodnight!

zen nudist

Jhn 10:29 My Father, which gave [them] me, is greater than all; and no [man] is able to pluck [them] out of my Father's hand.
Jhn 10:30 I and [my] Father are one.

Jesus said no one can take them from HIS hand and no one can take them from his FATHER's hand and so they were ONE or in accord...

however the jews saw what many trinitarians saw, a claim to godhood, equality with God or something along those lines as they stated...

Jhn 10:33

The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

Yet what all trinitarians IGNORE is that Jesus did NOT agree with them, but confounded their claim by showing them that THEY, who were seating themselves upon the JUDGEMENT SEAT of GOD were the ones who Jehovah was talking about when he called their kind GODS

as Jesus quotes that psalm....

Jhn 10:34

Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?

why did Jesus do that? because he was pointing out that if it is BLASPHEMY to be human and be a god, then THEY were the ones who were the blasphemers as THEY were the ones seating themselves in the JUDGEMENT SEAT of Jehovah as the GODS he spoke to....

yet he reminds them that he NEVER made such a claim for himself.....

Jhn 10:36

Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?

he never claimed to BE GOD, but only the SON of GOD....unlike them, he did not seat himself in the judgement seat and have the judgement of the gods upon him..... namely -- you will die as mortal men!

carla

Defd,

Just once I wish a jw could get through their heads that Christians do not say that Jesus is the Father!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Would a jw just once in their life do even the slightest research on what Christians really think and believe?????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Quit being so *&%$ lazy and check out a few Christian sites! Do you even try to understand it from what Christians say rather than what the wt tells you what Christians believe?

carla

defd

Jhn 10:33

The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

Yet what all trinitarians IGNORE is that Jesus did NOT agree with them, but confounded their claim by showing them that THEY, who were seating themselves upon the JUDGEMENT SEAT of GOD were the ones who Jehovah was talking about when he called their kind GODS

as Jesus quotes that psalm....

EXCELLENT! Zen that is what I was looking for. CONTEXT! You have understood that scripture accurately by reading the entire context. I agree with what you said. So why is it that MANY use that SINGLE scripture to support a false doctrine?

Chia

Hellrider

So why is it that MANY use that SINGLE scripture to support a false doctrine?

?? Who? I`ve never heard anyone use that single scripture to support the trinitiy-doctrine. Where did you hear that? Is that something you read in the WT? There are many, many passages that relate to the nature of christ, and his relationship with the Father. By the way, you should read Carlas post again: This is NOT what the trinity-doctrine is about. I`m not sure if the trinity-doctrine is right or wrong (it could very well be wrong), but I still think it`s a fascinating thought! The idea is, that the the Father, the holy ghost and the son are ONE, but at the same time SEPARATE! The trinity-doctrine is a logical impossibility! - but at the same time, the "impossibility" of it, the "inlogical" in it, is somehow an image of christianity as a whole! It IS inlogical that someone should rise from the dead, and by doing that, conquer death, and promise eternal life to all mankind. Within the "impossibility" and "inlogical...ness :o) of the trinity-doctrine, lays its mysticism. I don`t think anyone can really understand the doctrine, though. But the doctrine isn`t like you, or the WT claims, that "Jesus said he was God". Jesus never said he was the Father, he said he was the son. The question is, however, if the son is "in" the Father, and the Father "in" the son, while at the same time NOT! Please read up on this issue.

What was Jesus implying...........................

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