@Jeffro
Do you have any article links where they talk about it? I currently can't find much at all about it.
sloppyjoe2
JoinedPosts by sloppyjoe2
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299
Who told the first lie?
by nicolaou inthis is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
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299
Who told the first lie?
by nicolaou inthis is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
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sloppyjoe2
@Jeffro,
I should have clarified that more, when I was a JW I was under the impression that after Armaggeddon, no one would die of old age or sickness. That was the "people won't die anymore" I was referring to. I remember being taught always that someone that sinned and didn't repent whether during the millennial reign or after that Jehovah would destroy them.
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299
Who told the first lie?
by nicolaou inthis is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
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sloppyjoe2
@Jeffro, Don't JWs believe that for the entire millennial reign, humans will be growing back to perfection? As in there will be no death by old age, sickness and so on? Or do they believe that the millennial reign things will stay the same as they are today? The tree of life appearing after the millennial reign is the only reason the bible indicates anyone won't die.
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299
Who told the first lie?
by nicolaou inthis is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
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sloppyjoe2
TonusOH25 minutes agoI'm more fascinated by the concept of the Tree of Life. The story implies that Adam and Eve were not immortal- they had a finite lifespan. They had to have access to the Tree of Life if they wanted to continue to live. Yahweh is not above the most petty mechanisms of control.
The story does not read well if it is taken literally, as JWs do. A literal reading makes Yahweh something of an extortionist, dangling the Tree of Life in one hand and the Tree of Knowledge in the other. Take from one, lest ye run out of life. Take not from the other, or I shall deny thee access to the first one. Then he looks away as a snake tempts the hopelessly unprepared Eve into breaking god's rules. And finally, he curses humankind and even the planet itself, as punishment.
The story portrays him as a petty thug. A mean and unscrupulous person. A jerk. He creates a world, populates it with a pair of sentient beings, then places traps all around them. Their failure is inevitable, and he knows this. It's part of his plan to... build himself up as a savior????
Nothing about it reflects the actions of a considerate, kind, or caring person. Which makes the attempts at explanation even worse. I cannot accept that a loving being would do any of this. It is incoherent. It makes no sense. An impersonal and uncaring god might spawn a universe and leave it to its devices, leading to a world where suffering happens constantly and happiness is fleeting. Thatgod is more likely to be real than Yahweh.
TonusOH25 minutes agoI'm more fascinated by the concept of the Tree of Life. The story implies that Adam and Eve were not immortal- they had a finite lifespan. They had to have access to the Tree of Life if they wanted to continue to live. Yahweh is not above the most petty mechanisms of control.
The story does not read well if it is taken literally, as JWs do. A literal reading makes Yahweh something of an extortionist, dangling the Tree of Life in one hand and the Tree of Knowledge in the other. Take from one, lest ye run out of life. Take not from the other, or I shall deny thee access to the first one. Then he looks away as a snake tempts the hopelessly unprepared Eve into breaking god's rules. And finally, he curses humankind and even the planet itself, as punishment.
The story portrays him as a petty thug. A mean and unscrupulous person. A jerk. He creates a world, populates it with a pair of sentient beings, then places traps all around them. Their failure is inevitable, and he knows this. It's part of his plan to... build himself up as a savior????
Nothing about it reflects the actions of a considerate, kind, or caring person. Which makes the attempts at explanation even worse. I cannot accept that a loving being would do any of this. It is incoherent. It makes no sense. An impersonal and uncaring god might spawn a universe and leave it to its devices, leading to a world where suffering happens constantly and happiness is fleeting. Thatgod is more likely to be real than Yahweh.”
Speaking of the tree of life. It reappears in Revelation 22. Since the Bible indicates this is the way Adam and Eve would live forever, I conclude that that is the way God in Revelation 21 makes “death no more.” All of this takes place though after Jesus Mellennial reign. JWs believe that people won’t die after Armageddon. The Bible by its account indicates that doesn’t take place for a thousand years.
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Robert King aka e-watchman
by RolRod inthere have been a few post about robert king, the first was 16 years ago, the last was 9 years ago.
just to the let the old timers here know, he's still at it.
and for you newbies, robert king who wrote "jehovah himself has become king.
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sloppyjoe2
At the end of the day, he ended up like everyone else, disfellowshipped. The organization he defended against the likes of people like AlanF, threw him out. He became an apostate to them, whether he knows it or not. He used to predict how close we were to the end before 9/11. He really thought that was going to be it when it happened. Now here we are 23 years later, he is saying the same things as back then.
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When JW.org drops 607BCE...
by Nathan Natas inprobably everyone else thought of this long ago, but i, being an "independent thunker" thunk of it just a coupla weeks ago.. we all know that since the year zero (on the fredfranzian calendar) the wtb&ts has defied archaeology and insisted that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, even though the physical evidence shows that 587 bce is a more likely date.
in fact, the book "the gentile times reconsidered: have jehovah's witnesses been wrong all along about 607 bce?
" by carl olof jonsson and rud persson made this conversation public.. it is a difference of 20 years.
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sloppyjoe2
If the ORG wanted to abandon 607, they could and would just get rid of it. There is nothing in the Bible that says you need to use the fall of Jerusalem to determine the last days. The Bible gives all those signs. In any case, if I were the org, I would only change one thing about 1914. I would say that 1914 was just the beginning of pangs of distress but identified the time of the end. I would make the last days start when the great tribulation starts. I would harp that we see the signs of pangs of distress now so the last days are very close. This fixes any “last days” going on for over one hundred years but keeps 1914 and therefore 1919. They could keep 607 or get rid of it, it really doesn’t matter. -
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Q about Jesus' sacrifice
by oncebitten ini have several jw family members.
i have been shunned many years now.
i was not baptized, but i was indoctrinated as a child.
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sloppyjoe2
If Jesus didn't die for everyone's sins, how would people survive armageddon? The witness implies the only way to have your sins forgiven, is to die. Witnesses believe there will be people that never die.
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Prediction: I think the Blood Policy is about to change.
by underground ini’d like to start out by saying this is my opinion.. i believe that the organisation is about to make blood transfusions in any form a conscience matter.. they will still ban the eating of blood.. they will gaslight everyone by talking about how it is so much safer now.
and will say something along the lines of how our stance protected us from the aids crisis etc.. and i believe this change is going to happen before the annual meeting 2024.. i think the annual meeting will announce they are scrapping the midweek meeting and instead we get to watch a streamed talk at home through a revamped website similar to the way netflix works.. obviously take my opinion with a hefty pinch of salt..
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sloppyjoe2
What's the point of making a random prediction out of thin air?
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What exactly IS 1914 these days?
by Halcon init's no longer a year tying to the present (the old pre-1995 generation belief).
realistically, that's the only reason why it mattered.
and if it doesn't really matter what it is anymore, why would jw not do away with it?.
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sloppyjoe2
1914 is the date most important to Jehovah's Witnesses. The only people who have a problem with 1914 are ExJWs. There is zero incentive to do away with 1914. Every JW accepts it as it as and accepts the generations teaching as it is.
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Prediction: no more changes for a long while
by slimboyfat ini’ve noticed a pattern where things don’t go the way i expect them to go and/or whenever i realise there is a trend and, i mentally adjust for the idea that the trend will continue, the trend stops in its tracks.
so on that basis, and given many people, including myself, and active jws, have been asking ‘what changes will the governing body make next?’ perhaps the (disappointing) answer is: ‘nothing much for a while to come’.
maybe they’ve made the changes they want for now, and will wait a while and see how it’s received.
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sloppyjoe2
I notice everyone keeps speculating about 1914. Why drop it while any of the current governing body are alive? The overlapping generation covers all of them to their death. That's a problem for the governing body 4.0