Posts by Athanasius

15

does anyone know where this pic is from?

by wallsofjericho in

jw
friends

.

i am looking for a better image, i think this is partially cropped.

but i have no idea what publication it is from.

Athanasius

Van Amburgh was the Watchtower's accountant. Financial accounting was my profession too. So I'm sure that old Van knew all the dirty financial dealings of Russell, Rutherford, and Knorr. RR, who used to post here, told me that Van Amburgh later regretted putting Rutherford in office. This was based on private corespondence between him and a non-JW relative. Since Van was one of the few Russell holdovers to survive the Rutherford purges, no doubt the old man kept a safety deposit box full of incriminating evidence as his insurance policy.

When I first saw the picture that the OP presented, I thought the first guy on the right was Sid Caesar, the famous commedian. But I guess it's supposed to be Freddy Franz.

6

Need Scan from KIT 1985 version

by JWOP in

i'm looking to see what the 1985 version of the kit says at matthew 27:52-53. i'm looking for the word-for-word greek/english part.

i have a 1969 kit, so i just need to compare to see if there's been any changes between the two.

if you can send me a scan of it, pm me.

Athanasius

The word for word Greek/English verses of Matthew 27:52-53, 1969 Purple People Eater KIT and Blue 1985 KIT, read the same: "and the memorial tombs were opened and many bodies of the having fallen asleep holy (ones) were raised up, and [they] having gone forth out of the memorial tombs after the being raised up of him they entered into the holy city and they were made apparent."

The NWT rendering of the same verses is also the same in both editions. Since the Watchtower teaches that nobody was resurrected that day, they change verse 53 to read: "(and persons, coming out from among the meorial tombs after his being raised up, entered into the holy city,) and they became visible to many people."

Not sure if the Watchtower still teaches this, but back in 1984 when I left the JWs, they believed that the earthquake mentioned in Matthew 27:51 caused dead bodies in the tombs to be scattered and that it was live persons visiting the tombs that went to the city and told what happened. But a literal interpretation of the verses seems to indicate that the holy ones were raised up and that they went into the city and were seen by many persons.

40

Purged songs of the Watchtower

by LogCon in

my memory of singing the kingdom songs go back to when i was a child in the 1950's.

they still hold a place in my memory and my heart.

how can something that is so much a part of your childhood not stay embedded in your heart.?.

Athanasius

This brings back a lot of memories. I remember the old green song book. I was only four or five when it was released in the early 1950s. Those were the days when we had live music at the KHs, and the CAs and DCs had live orchestras. Then they replaced the green song book with the pink one and did away with live music at the KH, CA, DC, and replaced it with canned music.

I left the JWs in 1984 just as they replaced the pink song book with the baby sh_t brown color song book. Glad I left when I did, as the new song book had some songs that were impossible to sing.

Later, when I started attending other churches, some of the hymns were sung to the same music as the songs of the old JW green song book. And doing a little research found that the Watchtower had ripped off some of their songs from old Christian hymns.

9

The final shackle thrown off

by moley in

.

i've been out for 13yrs but its still funny how some things are so ingrained, but no more.

i had a full english today complete with the devils offering "black pudding" and how mighty tasty it was..

Athanasius

I recommend Clonakilty black pudding. When I toured Ireland in 1999 and 2000 the best black pudding was served in Clonakilty. In fact I took some home with me it was so good. Unfortunately I haven't found anything like it here in the USA.

14

How much more strange can this get ?

by man in black in

ladt night i was talking to a coworker who's sister is a witness in my old hall, and i needed some asprin after listening to this.. how can this be tolerated by people who believe that they alone speak the truth ?.

a young couple ( early 30's) had two children, and they adopted another boy from the inner city, so they have three boys under the age of 13.. the father is a construction worker, and mom works pt doing various jobs.. as a babysitter they use the respected teenaged son of a very prominent elder.

well, the parents breakup.

Athanasius

Probably not, Valkyrie. The adopting couple most likely were more afluent and lived in the suburbs with a front and back yard. The boy they adopted probably came from a poor family and lived in a large apartment building, so it may have been a cultural shock at first now being able to enjoy a lawn and flowers.

27

The "Christian Greek Scriptures"

by Doug Mason in

from 1950 to 2013, the watchtower and bible tract society has been releasing its new world translation of the scriptures.. my study considers the christian greek scriptures (new testament).. http://www.jwstudies.com/why_does_wts_accept_christendoms_scriptures.pdf.

i have also provided the pictures that i created for the study.. http://www.jwstudies.com/pix_for_study_wts_accepts_scriptures.pdf.

please accept the fact that i have no idea whether colours clash or if they match.

Athanasius

Hi Doug,

St. Athanasius died in 373 AD and was never an emperor, though he greatly influenced the ancient Church. No doubt you had Theodosius the Great in mind as he was the Roman emperor 379-395.

6

I am looking for a page

by Doug Mason in

hi,.

i am looking for a scan of: the interpreter's dictionary of the bible, edited by george a. buttrick, volume 1, page 166.. thanks,.

doug.

Athanasius

The Interpreter's Dictionary of the Bible (Dictionary Editor, George Arthur Buttrick) that I have in my library was published by Abingdon Press, 17th printing 1989. Not sure if this is the edition that you wanted Doug.

However, page 166 is about the Apocrypha, New Testament. The article begins with: "The NT Apoc, or as it is often styled, the Apocryphal NT, consists of a host of books of all sorts, primarily gospels, acts, letters, and apocalypses--i.e., of books similar to, at least externally, the several kinds of writing in the canonical NT."

Is this what you are looking for?

42

Do You Think Many Engaged JW Couples Fooled Around B4 Marriage?

by minimus in

jw
friends

when i was an elder, i had a few couples approach me to confess that they either played around or went all the way.. i suspect there were many more that did not admit to it, though..

Athanasius

I confess. Back in the 1960s I was engaged to a JW girl and we played around. We were in our early 20s at the time and just did what was natural. While we didn't go all the way, still had we confessed we would have gotten into trouble. We were both pioneers and I was a servant in the congregation. This was before the elder arrangement that began in the 1970s.

Apparently the Holy Spirit didn't have a problem with our pre-marital activity as we were married in the KH, and a year later I was promoted to Theocratic Ministry School Servant. Then when the elder arrangement was initiated in 1972 I was appointed an elder.

I should also mention that when I served on JCs where an engaged JW couple confessed to "unapproved Watchtower pre-marital activity," I always voted for private reproof, even though the hard-line elders insisted on public reproof. I always stuck to my guns and got the couple off with a reduced sentence.

29

Did Jehovah's Witnesses Plagiarize HWA's False Prophecy Of 1975?

by Bangalore in

did jehovah's witnesses plagiarize hwa's false prophecy of 1975?.

http://livingarmstrongism.blogspot.com/2013/10/did-jehovahs-witnesses-plagiarize-hwas.html.

bangalore.

Athanasius

David 17, if you are only 17, your comments are understandable as you missed all the excitement of the 1970s. But I was an elder during that time, and though I was skeptical about all the hype coming out of Brooklyn about 1975, most of JWs in my congregation were expecting the big A to happen that year because of what they read in Watchtower publications. Though I kept it to myself, for fear of being labeled an apostate, I personally didn’t believe anything special would happen in 1975.

However, we had a CO who would begin his Tuesday night comments in 1970s with a stopwatch, and say for example, only two years, eight months, fifteen days, two hours, and 40 minutes until 1975. My cousin, who was in another circuit said his CO used the same gimmick. I’m sure others who were JWs in the early 1970s have similar experiences.

Why all the excitement if, according to the Society, 1975 meant only 6,000 years of human existence? Why would the Watchtower, in a 1974 KM state that many brothers are selling their homes and spending “the remaining months of this system” in the pioneer service? Somewhere in my archives I have a tape recording of talks given in Los Angeles early 1975 by Nate Knorr and Freddy Franz, discussing the urgency of the times and the nearness of the GT.

So don’t give me the BS that the Society only said 1975 merely marked 6,000 years since Adam was created. I lived through that time and saw the excitement of the brothers, encouraged by the Watchtower, ending in disappointment when nothing happened in 1975.

Then at a 1977 DC I heard a DO blame the brothers for expecting something special to happen in 1975. He went on to state that many JWs were disappointed and became inactive because in 1975 Adam had a birthday. The DO railed against those who served with a date in mind, ignoring the fact that it was the Watchtower that encouraged all the excitement and it was the GB that was responsible for the disappointment.

14

monthly report

by search4truth in

jw
friends

has anyone refused hand in monthly report with explanation that this practice is not biblical and what were the consequences of that ?

Athanasius

That's interesting, L3G. Back in the 1960s when I pioneered, I had a non-JW friend that I studied with. We would go fishing and I'd mention a "theocratic thought" or two and count to whole 6 or 7 hours we spent fishing at time in FS. I knew several other pioneers who did the same thing. We also rounded up our hours. So if we spent 2 hours and ten minutes in FS, we'd turn in 3. My guess is that a large percentage of JWs do the same thing. That's why the Watchtower reports show millions of hours spent in FS, but only 200,000 baptized. No doubt 50% of the hours reported for FS are padded.