Posts by jaffacake

21

Jehovah's Witness! Nothing but a period in the world novel.

by free2beme in

jw
friends

often, more so then not, my former witness friends have the habit of wondering why more people do not hear or know about things witnesses do in modern history.

yet in time, from being on boards like this one and from knowing far more people that are not witnesses, then ones that are or were.

the crazy acts of the early 1900's that gained public attention, were replaced with a more invisable conformed organization that really does very little to be noticed.

jaffacake

they say things like, "Witnesses do not believe in Jesus." To which I often find myself defending the fact that they do

Is it surprising that people don't know what they believe when they keep changing doctrine, then sometimes back again? Perhaps what people mean is that JWs do not believe in Jesus as Christians do. Or that JWs don't worship Jesus (although they previously taught that Jesus should be worshiped) Or that they think he was nothing more than a perfect man, which is contrary to orthodox Christian belief, and amazing set against the evidence in the New Testament.

Two years ago all I knew about JWs was that they pestered people at weekends like double glazing salesmen, and that they refused blood transfusions. I did not even know that they did not celebrate Christmas or birthdays. They just don't realise that people view them as another form of salvation army, but without the music.

20

Could the Spirit world have helped your exit from the religion?

by free2beme in

jw
friends

boy, this might be that can of worms i meant to keep closed!.

i was thinking about something though and wondered what your thoughts might be.

if you believe in angels, the spirit realm, spirit guides or spirits of loved ones that have crossed.

jaffacake

I believe this is all superstition, but I am not sure. I am quite sure that so called spirit creatures do not exist except in the imaginations of JWs, whom I suspect invented the term.

56

Will the WTS Org change or Die Out?

by doinmypart in

jw
friends

the wts org has:.

a formidable enemy (ex/former members),.

an enemy with an excellent communication tool unavailable in the past (the internet),.

jaffacake

After all, "The time of the end" started in 1799.
Changed to 1874.
Changed to 1914.

In the 1970s 3 of the Gov Body realised 1914 was wrong and tried to change it to 1957 when sputnik was launched. The rest of Gov Body argued the idea down. At least it shows even the gov body doesnt believe anything special happened in 1914, but dare not change this for fear of how many would leave.

56

Will the WTS Org change or Die Out?

by doinmypart in

jw
friends

the wts org has:.

a formidable enemy (ex/former members),.

an enemy with an excellent communication tool unavailable in the past (the internet),.

jaffacake

Sean, welcome.

Doinmy part, you said

I still go in fld svc once or twice every two months. I think I'll put a Post-It note with JW URLs inside tracts and leave the tracts at Not at Homes.

Yes, please start a thread,

I would love to organise a fair minded tract, or even a business card to tell anyone contacted by JWs to check out a couple of websites, to get both sides of the story. It would be good to beat the JWs at their own game.

Perhaps this could be better targeted by following cars from the KH and discreetly following up their door to door work with anti-JW contacts

39

New here.....kinda

by lola28 in

jw
friends

hey everyone, this is my first post and i'am terrefied.

i have been lurking for over a year and finally decided that it was time to post.

i feel like i know all of you and feel more at home here than at the kingdom hall.

jaffacake

I'm free I'm free, (David)

In case I missed you, welcome if you are new to the site.

Just to tell you I enjoy reading your posts

12

Converting

by xjustxanotherxstarx in

jw
friends

hey, my friends is a jehovah's witness, and his parents are strict about who he can and cannot see, we are very close, and i wish we could see more of each other!

i know we would be allowed to if i was his religion!

how could i convert and what would i have to do, and how long would it take?

jaffacake

adonijah,

Welcome, you are no doubt sincere in what you believe. If there several people willing to make statements about the truth of a matter, which should we listen to? I say listen to all and weigh up the evidence. JWs say listen only to me, and do not listen to anyone else, for no one else can be trusted. Yet the Bible commands us to rest everything, and keep testing that we are in the faith. Do you follow this command?

The truth can withstand scrutiny. With the greatest respect, truth does not have to hide behind censorship. Anyone with any intelligence knows that it is the false witness who cannot stand to have read the testiminies of others. The witness who says everyone but me is a liar, without hearing the other side of the story, clearly has much to hide.

I have read a dozen books recently, half of which were published by the watchtower society, and half by non or former JWs. You are not allowed to read these because your god is 12 old men in new york. You put your trust in a hiuman organisation, contrary to scripture. You have surrendered your conscience men, who are your pope. If you had access to the information I have, your conscience would not permit you to remain a JW. To quote an elder who was tasked with researching watchtower history, when I read what was published around the time the organisation was supposedly appointed in 1919, I came to realise that there was not one chance in a thousand that God was directing this organisation.

Every time I study with my local elder, I catch him out in a lie. He has no answer, so tries to change the subject, and refuses to look at the Bible text in context with me. Why? What truths might the Bible and Watchtower publications contain that could threaten JW beliefs? The truth will make you free, what are you afraid of friend?

Christian (unconditional) love

100

A Christian question, but applies to all thinking Christian too!

by free2beme in

jw
friends

no longer being a christian, it has become a mind opening experience to look back and see certian things i once ignored or just brushed off.

yet now i can not help but see these things and wonder why other christians do not.. if you have ever studied greek, roman or any other cultures religions in history.

then you have no doubt read their legends, about gods and how things came to be, and no doubt you have enjoyed these and at the same time you must have wondered how people actually bought this enough to make it a religion.

jaffacake

Free, thanks for responding to my post. You said

I think I gather what you are trying to say, but I know from being a Witness, that the Bible is the text book of Christianity and to say it is in error is to develop a religion that would not really be true Christian.

I do not believe the Bible is in error in the important teachings it contains, but I can very easily prove there are many minor errors in it. One of its strengths is that these have not been corrected or deleted. In other words even the clear inconsistencies teach us something. The Bible itself does not clearly teach its own verbal inerrancy. The apostles often failed to understand the teachings of Christ, Paul made mistakes in his earlier letters that he corrected in later ones.

We must discern which parts of the Bible sublate other parts. All the Old Testament is both negated and fulfilled at the same time by the teaching to love our neighbour. I was once a fundamentalist adventist, but last month I opened my mind and read a Christian challenge to fundamentalism. Only read it if you have an open mind.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0281056803/qid=1119912087/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_10_1/026-1645485-9290029

24

I was wrong, CT Russell was something of a prophet after all...

by jaffacake in

jw
friends

i am reading studies in the scriptures (1911) thy kingdom come..on page 145 ct russell describes what is wrong with religions of his day and their sunday schools & bible studies, ie people belong to earthly religions or organisations.

was he describing other sects of his day, or did he forsee what his bible students would eventually become?

methods hinder real growth in knowledge of truth...guarded, pointed questions, with prepared answers and no time left for the bible hungry student...bible study, skilfully directed, so that he may get no new ideas...brief sessions [one hour] more agreeable than bible study...they are led to feel they have performed a duty, and a sacrifice.

jaffacake

http://www.bibletoday.com/booklets/litlist.htm

zagor, here is Nathan's link. look at studies in the scriptures vol 3 - thy kingdom come. chapter 7 I think - harvest.

24

I was wrong, CT Russell was something of a prophet after all...

by jaffacake in

jw
friends

i am reading studies in the scriptures (1911) thy kingdom come..on page 145 ct russell describes what is wrong with religions of his day and their sunday schools & bible studies, ie people belong to earthly religions or organisations.

was he describing other sects of his day, or did he forsee what his bible students would eventually become?

methods hinder real growth in knowledge of truth...guarded, pointed questions, with prepared answers and no time left for the bible hungry student...bible study, skilfully directed, so that he may get no new ideas...brief sessions [one hour] more agreeable than bible study...they are led to feel they have performed a duty, and a sacrifice.

jaffacake

zagor,

I just bought these old books, but nathan (earlier in this very thread) posted a link to a site that has the old russell publications available on line. I just pasted some into word docs.

This is the stuff the watchtower criticised the clergy for trying to burn and destroy. Its the watchtower that wants to destroy them now. The elder I study with says they let the stuff go out of print - yeah, I bet they did.

These studies in the scriptures were claimed to be more important than the Bible. Watchtower said if Christians took the Bible alone they would go into spiritual darkness, but if they took only these studies in the Scriptures, they would remain in spiritual enlightenment.

So remember folks, the Bible leads to apostasy, unlike the good old Watchtower. The choice is yours!

7

I felt more love tonight than at memorial service...

by jaffacake in

jw
friends

i was brought up a catholic, then learned as a baptised adventist in my teens that the pope was the anti-christ, and that only we were the one true remnant church etc.

the adventists did have true christian love, even if they were somewhat misguided.

when i drifted away from religion, i still refused to marry in my wife's catholic church.

jaffacake

I was brought up a catholic, then learned as a baptised adventist in my teens that the Pope was the anti-christ, and that only we were the one true remnant church etc. The adventists did have true Christian love, even if they were somewhat misguided. When I drifted away from religion, I still refused to marry in my wife's catholic church. I am still indoctrinated as anti-catholic. However, partly thanks to you folks, I look at all beliefs differently now. Tonight I went to a wonderful meeting at the Catholic school my daughter will start in September. I like the school prayer:

This is our school,

Let peace dwell here.

Let the rooms be full of joy.

Let love abide here:

Love of learning,

Love of one-another,

Love of all people,

Love of life itself

and love of God

Let us remember that

As many hands build a house

So many Hearts make a school.