Posts by AuldSoul

21

Truth Book from 1974

by Virgogirl in

jw
friends

does anyone remember "the truth that leads to everlasting life" book?

it was blue, and was intended as a six month home study book.

i think it came out in 1974at an assembly with much fanfare and gasping!.

AuldSoul

The Truth that leads to Eternal Life

I have the 1968 edition and the later revision in hard copy.

AuldSoul

28

Internet - Thursdays Service Meeting

by stillajwexelder in

in the service meeting on thursday, there was an item in the kingdom ministry about the dangers of the internet.

in our kingdom hall they discussed the internet and sexual predators at length and mentioned a recent circuit assembly where the district overseer went on and on about the internet without mentioning specific sites.

the circuit assembly and the service meeting discussed that apostate sites and others for jws were used by non-jws to date non-married jw sisters and also by sexual predators.

AuldSoul

Gumby: These people can find takers for their sexual prefrences without looking into JW or ex-JW sites......can they not? ; Do predators have a special fondness for single JW women?

For some reason, when I read this I immediately pictured some sadistic nutjob stalking JW women on the internet to send them pictures of Smurfs. [MUAHHhahahhahahhahaa!]

Sorry, when that image popped into my head I just HAD to share it.

AuldSoul

27

Blatantly deceitful use of secular sources

by AuldSoul in

i am looking good repository of instances where the watchtower or awake!

have quoted secular sources in such a way to make it appear the source supports their argument when it is blatantly obvious that the secular source disagreed with them.

if it doesn't exist, i am about to make one.

AuldSoul

I found out today someone else had a similar idea, we will be collaborating on the project.

Feel free to use this thread to dump 'em into or PM me if you like. Alternately you can email me at watchtowerwhy~at~hotmail.com ( <—— Keeps crawlers from collecting email addresses, just replace ~at~ with @ in your email)

AuldSoul

15

My son asked P.O. wife what she was wearing for halloween today at Walmart!

by PaNiCAtTaCk in

jw
friends

im assuming this is finally it for me and my family.. i havent been to a meeting in probably 2 and a half months but im just considered weak by most i presume.

i had decided to let my son go trick or treating for the first time this year, after all my wife and i decided to raise him as a normal kid.

so last month when he came home from school and said to us "someone asked me at school what i as going to be for halloween and i told them batman", i just said "oh really" and acted excited for him.

AuldSoul

Mary, Loose Conduct is the "catch-all, if all else fails disfellowship for this" gross sin. The 1973 Watchtower Questions From Readers (posted by blondie here: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/101050/1742306/post.ashx#1742306) shows that the elders perception about your attitude is enough to disfellowship you. Basically, my dad (an elder for 42 years now) told me that anything elders give repeated counsel on that you refuse to apply can be considered "loose conduct," repeatedly rejecting appointments with the elders can be considered "loose conduct," almost anything can be considered "loose conduct." He says he uses it sparingly but that some elders don't.

ACK! Ah, well. I am glad you stood up for yourself panickattack. That was excellent, and hearing you talk about that with your wife will be good for your son. Showing him his daddy has a spine can't be a bad thing.

AuldSoul

35

too stupid for words

by peacefulpete in

ok this is one for the books, my wife's great grandmother who is a miraculous 94 year old cervical and ovarian cancer survivor and a 87 year old man from the hall were just counselled on the need for a chaperon!

it seems someone was disturbed that the two were alone in her appartment!

she is practically housebound and his visits to shoot the breeze and talk about the old times were the highlight of her week.

AuldSoul

Now, do we really know all the details? I mean, maybe a pharmicist in town who is a Witness caught the ol' bloke filling a Viagra prescription ...the scoundrel! Oops ! In view of that last post it has come to my attention that this joke was in incredibly poor taste. I will leave it up (no pun intended) but I retract it based on the above post from PeacefulPete. AuldSoul

27

Blatantly deceitful use of secular sources

by AuldSoul in

i am looking good repository of instances where the watchtower or awake!

have quoted secular sources in such a way to make it appear the source supports their argument when it is blatantly obvious that the secular source disagreed with them.

if it doesn't exist, i am about to make one.

AuldSoul

Thanks for the addition, blondie. It looks like my suspicion is proving correct. I thought if this had been done it would be specifically to address doctrinal points (boring to most people). I want to catch them with their pants down in more casual instances like this: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/100209/1.ashx

This one is so plain a child could see they lied, outrightly, to try to support their point. The Encyclopedia article call their work propaganda but they use one snippet from it to indicate that the encyclopedia supported that they are not propagandizers. This is done so innocuously in this case that I cannot help but imagine it is customary. That means I will be able to find MANY more of these. Lie when the truth will do, but the Internet hasn't been around to force them to be careful about citing/quoting sources in good faith.

Now, they will face the light of the world, the Intenet! It will shine on them and reveal their cowering dark soul. It will prove they lie even to those who they say deserve to know the truth, a lie by any standard (even their own).

If anyone runs across more of these simple lies (if they'll lie in small things...) because I believe these are much more telling about the nature of this "food" the Governing Body has been spewing from their collective rectum.

AuldSoul

27

Blatantly deceitful use of secular sources

by AuldSoul in

i am looking good repository of instances where the watchtower or awake!

have quoted secular sources in such a way to make it appear the source supports their argument when it is blatantly obvious that the secular source disagreed with them.

if it doesn't exist, i am about to make one.

AuldSoul

Thanks all! I am hoping to eventually develop a central repository for their improper citations/out of context quotes similar to Quotes Web site. The obvious exception being I will only cite the reference to their pub where the unsourced or deceitful out-of-context application appears and print the portion they quoted, then print the context (properly sourced).

I am hoping to have it ready in time to be a useful resource for Quotes' lawsuit. The WT accusation against him is absurd in light of their history with unsourced out of context quotes. At least Quotes gives the complete source for the reader to verify context if they so desire.

AuldSoul

14

Can anyone tell me about the UN

by PoppyR in

i'm so sorry that i'm sure everytime somone new joins you're going over the same thing again, but all this is very new to me, in fact i've done very little this past week except read articles and cross reference the wt cd rom..lol, everyone thinks i'm getting spiritual again, anyway!

i have read several references to the jws and the un.. can anyone shed some light on the matter, ie point me in the direction of good posts or articles about it, as i'm still unclear what has been going on.

i'm most interested in the facts of the case which is what i think this board is best at!.

AuldSoul

PoppyR, the Christian Congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses does not outrightly state that they had no knowledge of the Criteria for Association, but they couch it deeply enough that the average publisher and elder are going to look at that point and go, "So what?"

The really big issue here is that it violated the Governing Body's own judgments even if the Criteria for Association did not exist. They JOINED the UN/DPI.

The CCoJW couldn't be more pleased at apostates chasing down what agreeing to the Criteria meant. They have already stopped the relationship (which they CALL a "registration") and those who would accuse of apostasy on that basis forget that as long as they cannot concretely prove the WTS knew about the Criteria prior to their request for disassociation, no case could be judged under the Governing Body's published standards.

However, there is still this issue of what the actual nature of the relationship was. They say it was a registration, but it is easily proven that they knew it was an association (i.e. a membership). 1) they applied for it, you don't apply for registration you just sign up, 2) there was a review and approval process of three to six weeks, I know of no registration with similar constraints, 3) they became Accredited to the UN/DPI, when do you get credentials for registering for something, 4) there was a yearly review process for determining whether to retain an organization as an Accredited Associate through the year 2000 (this changed to a every four years review in 2002), what kind of registration requires that level of continued interaction?

So, it is easy to prove that they knew they were an Accredited NGO Associated to the UN/DPI (i.e. the mouthpiece of the UN, its voice). Why is that important? Because Organized to Accomplish Our Ministry (published 1983, 1989 p. 151) says:

Concerning those who renounced their Christian faith in his day, the apostle John wrote: “They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us.” (1 John 2:19) Also, a person might renounce his place in the Christian congregation by his actions, such as by becoming part of a secular organization the objective of which is contrary to the Bible and, hence, is under judgment by Jehovah God. (Compare Revelation 19:17-21; Isaiah 2:4) So if a person who is a Christian chooses to join those who are disapproved by God, it would be fitting for the congregation to acknowledge by a brief announcement that he has disassociated himself and is no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses. Such a person would be viewed in the same way as a disfellowshipped person.

The view has not changed a bit. Organized to Do Jehovah's Will (published 2005 p. 155) says:

Concerning those who renounced their Christian faith in his day, the apostle John wrote: “They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us.” (1 John 2:19) For example, a person might renounce his place in the Christian congregation by his actions, such as by becoming part of a secular organization that has objectives contrary to the Bible and, hence, is under judgment by Jehovah God. (Isa. 2:4; Rev. 19:17-21) If a person who is a Christian chooses to join those who are disapproved by God, a brief announcement is made to the congregation, stating: “[Name of person] is no longer one of Jehovah’s Witnesses.” Such a person is treated in the same way as a disfellowshipped person. The presiding overseer should approve this announcement.

While accusations relative to the Criteria for Association can be lost in a game of semantics, this one is rock solid and inescapable:

1) Is the UN/DPI an organization?

2) Does the UN/DPI have objectives contrary to the Bible?

3) While the WTS could not become part of the UN, did they become part of the UN/DPI?

4) Did they do so by their own choice?

Once you answer these honestly, all that is left is to read the judgment they pronounce on themselves.

AuldSoul

27

Blatantly deceitful use of secular sources

by AuldSoul in

i am looking good repository of instances where the watchtower or awake!

have quoted secular sources in such a way to make it appear the source supports their argument when it is blatantly obvious that the secular source disagreed with them.

if it doesn't exist, i am about to make one.

AuldSoul

I am looking good repository of instances where the Watchtower or Awake! have quoted secular sources in such a way to make it appear the source supports their argument when it is blatantly obvious that the secular source disagreed with them. Does anyone know of one?

If it doesn't exist, I am about to make one. If no one already knows of one, please start posting them here when you find them.

Thanks!

AuldSoul

30

NGO/WTS scandal info sought

by yaddayadda in

some questions for someone really clued up on the ngo scandal:

who was the pr when the society first applied to be an ngo in 1992....milton henschel?

when did don adams become the president of the wts?

AuldSoul

yaddayadda, I don't know how I can throw you a bigger bone: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/8/99993/1725946/post.ashx#1725946

The link you found that shows a form for the year 2000 is not showing the entire Accreditation packet that would have been sent out (mailed, in 1999). The link above shows all the sheets that would have had similar corresponding sheets in all years. I have been assured by the UN/DPI NGO section that NGOs are frequently reminded of the Criteria for Association, at a minimum on a yearly basis with the Annual Accreditation packet.

* 2005 Annual Accreditation Form (PDF format)

* 2006 Annual Accreditation Form (PDF format)

The form you found was a one-page, front and back. The UN/DPI NGO section doesn't need to have the Criteria for Association mailed back to it. So, the text I indicated isn't included on the form itself. Even in the 2005 form it isn't included on the portion that would be mailed back. I don't know why the standard information was changed on the 2006 form, the 2006 form was published within the last week. But the links above will still take you to the 2005 and 2006 forms, respectively.

I am not sure exactly what it is you are looking for, or what your "smoking gun" would be. I can tell you, the Criteria for Association made the relationship worse, but that isn't what made the relationship a violation of the Governing Body's own standards.

An association is a membership, which means they joined the UN/DPI. They applied to do so, demonstrating desire. From Organized to Do Jehovah's Will (p. 155):

Concerning those who renounced their Christian faith in his day, the apostle John wrote: “They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us.” (1 John 2:19) For example, a person might renounce his place in the Christian congregation by his actions, such as by becoming part of a secular organization that has objectives contrary to the Bible and, hence, is under judgment by Jehovah God. (Isa. 2:4; Rev. 19:17-21) If a person who is a Christian chooses to join those who are disapproved by God, a brief announcement is made to the congregation, stating: “[Name of person] is no longer one of Jehovah’s Witnesses.” Such a person is treated in the same way as a disfellowshipped person. The presiding overseer should approve this announcement.

You can find nearly identical text in Organized to Accomplish Our Ministry (p. 151). The only real difference in wording is in the announcement read at the meeting. Their pretense they did not know in 1991 that this relationship was a direct and flagrant violation of their own judgment is pathetic. They have disfellowshipped people for becoming members of the YMCA or political activism groups. They knew better. Now they pretend they didn't know better.

But, once you know they don't mind stretching truth and outright lying to "support" their statements, nothing they say can be trusted: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/100209/1.ashx

AuldSoul