raymond franz was a member of the governing body and was a jw for many years till he left.. he wrote a book which provides a great insight into jw's but what is really good about it is he isn't bitter when he comes across and so far i am really enjoying the read.. also in there are copies of letters sent from him to the society or the other way around and i recommend anyone who can find it should read it!.
http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/cocbr.htm.
i am only just into it and i am hooked.
that's funny, I didn't get that angle, In fact RF said himself that he felt most of them genuinely believed that they were in the truth.
I just felt that when Ray started asking questions, they were clutching at straws to protect their org.
Best wishes
D
yes i'm new to this forum and i have been searching the net and reading with interest peoples comments here and on other sites.
as most know reaching out as a faithfull jw to others outside of the congregation is difficult at first ,as i guess we think anyone outside the congregation is wordly etc.
and we can't open up easily to "strangers" as jehovah would not approve.
Woz
It's the topic of another active thread at the moment, but I'd encourage you to read Crisis of Conscience by Ray Franz, an eyeopening expose written in a truly loving and non bitter manner.
best wishes
D
raymond franz was a member of the governing body and was a jw for many years till he left.. he wrote a book which provides a great insight into jw's but what is really good about it is he isn't bitter when he comes across and so far i am really enjoying the read.. also in there are copies of letters sent from him to the society or the other way around and i recommend anyone who can find it should read it!.
http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/cocbr.htm.
i am only just into it and i am hooked.
I think something like this transcends borders. It's not just an American thing. He's pretty "up there" for me too.
best wishes
D
raymond franz was a member of the governing body and was a jw for many years till he left.. he wrote a book which provides a great insight into jw's but what is really good about it is he isn't bitter when he comes across and so far i am really enjoying the read.. also in there are copies of letters sent from him to the society or the other way around and i recommend anyone who can find it should read it!.
http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/cocbr.htm.
i am only just into it and i am hooked.
I read COC last week whilst away on holiday with the family. They've been whinging about the amount of time I've spent online at this site so I had to ration the time I spent reading it.
it was hard to put down, I laughed, and cried. I feel it is a must for anyone who is looking for information on the WTS, anyone who is on this site.
Best wishes
D
yes i'm new to this forum and i have been searching the net and reading with interest peoples comments here and on other sites.
as most know reaching out as a faithfull jw to others outside of the congregation is difficult at first ,as i guess we think anyone outside the congregation is wordly etc.
and we can't open up easily to "strangers" as jehovah would not approve.
Welcome Woz, you've come to a good place to get some support and find information. You're story unsettles yet facinates me and I'm keen to find out how you progressed with these paranormal experiences, and how you view them now. please stick around and share some more. Best wishes D
Feb would be good for me. I've been away for a couple of week to. Just catching up........
Ozzie, i've sent you a PM.
Best wishes
D
i was df'd in 1985 and have not been back since.
of course disowned by my family.
at that time they rarely called or came over because i had small children and they called just enough to semi maintain a relationship with them.
Facts.......so you were expecting it......how'r u feeling. I'll look out for your thread, but I'm away for two weeks.......
I've become addicted to this site. never been on chat sites before, but this is different!
myself and other family members have been shunned by our family even though not disfellowshipped. I think they thought that the "tough love" approach might work. I'm not shunned now, but other branches of my family are.
you know I wouldn't care now if I was, gone too far, seen to much, have more in my life to compensate.
I'm looking out for a Sydney meet up. I saw the last one was beginning of Dec, but I was still lurking then! I live a few hours south of Sydney, don't get up too often, but can try if the timing is right.
Ozzie, put me on the list!
Best wishes
D
according to wts, the first prophecy in the bible (gen 3:15) applies to jesus and was partially fulfilled when the he died on the cross stake.
so how did jesus or anyone that had anything to do with his death have any freewill if he was predestined to die?
say the jews had decided they kinda liked him or thought he was at least entertaining and decided to let him hang around?
I remember having a similar conversation with my dad years ago. at that time he was out, but he's back in again
I told him that in a way I felt sorry for Judas because he was the fall guy, I mean if he was set up to be the bad guy, then we almost owe him some thanks (if you believe any of it?) he still believing said that of course Judas had a choice, but imperfect human nature would mean that somebody would do it.
then I took it back to Adam and Eve. I mean any parent can relate to telling your young child "Don't touch that", it's like a red rag to a bull. I'm not saying Adam and Eve were children, but they were totally innocent, and if your innocent child, that you truly love does something disobedient (what child doesnt?) then you might punish them, teach them a lesson.
So anyway, if God didn't like their actions why blame and punish all of mankind. Why not just get rid of Adam and Eve, and start again? Wh did it have to be a perfect life, for a perfect life. He makes up the rulz, he made them in his image, he was behaving like a spoilt brat....(ok I didn't say that one to my father!)
Dad said I was being silly, I still don't see why. It seems logical to me.......
i've commented before that the watchtower goes out of its way to label groups of people it doesn't want you to like -- "worldly people", "apostates", "christendom".
there are scores of these labels.. people in general use them too: "spick", "n*gger", "trailer trash".
once we allow ourselves to refer to people by a label, we automatically change them from an individual to a member of a group.
I think that you can despise the way the society has described apostates, or "people of this system" without using derogatory terms when speaking about them. then you're stooping to their level. I also agree with the comments about newbies, or lurkers who may feel intimidated or insulted by some terms.
I think this is a fantastic site to learn, be supported, and support others, and I don't think that being antagonistic is positive. Yes I can ROFLMAO at times, but I've been out for over 20 years.
Whether we believe in the bible or not, I feel that the edict "do unto others, as you would have done to you" is a good living standard.
Best wishes to all
D
Slugga, you're pretty involved in this conversation. Would you be scottish perhaps??
I know that my dad became much more "scottish" after we left Scotland. When we go round now he's always playing scottish music.
I had a piper at my wedding, and one of my sisters went the whole hog, her NZ husband and all the wedding party in kilts. my little four year old page boy looked sooo cute! the wedding video has proof at how authentic they were in their costuming, except for my husband who wussed out and wore a red G String!
But back to the thread..........I don't remember kilts at the meetings or assemblies, except for weddings!
