Posts by OnTheWayOut

37

ALL LURKING ELDERS PLEASE... PLEASE... READ!!!!!! Make a difference!!

by Lady Liberty in

danny hazzard just posted this..please help!!

!silentlambs alert!

*a cry for help to all men of conscience in the organization of jehovahs witnessesthe recent court rulings in napa california have given authorities the right to access congregation judicial files that contain any information that provides evidence of the crime of child abuse.

OnTheWayOut

I am not a defender of the congregations, nor the WTS, nor individual elders. That said, I must
strongly add that, while very legalistic, the things discussed here are normal precautions.

You have to cooperate with a warrant, but you should have legal counsel available. While the
reading of the warrant and contacting the WT lawyers sounds like delay tactics, I would suggest
that anyone faced by the law should take similar actions. It's not a big deal. There are plenty
of files that would not relate to the search, that would need protection. If the elder refused to
cooperate once clearly served a warrant, he can expect the authorities to tear up the file cabinets
or break down doors, but their search would take longer without cooperation. It is important to get
counsel to make sure they do not go beyond the search allowed by the warrant, and how much
cooperation to give. You should do the same if ever faced with a warrant.

Now, what would be disgusting is to hide or destroy records to protect the molester/criminal.
What would also be disgusting is (as I have read stories) to discourage victims from pursuing
criminal prosecution, or disfellowshipping them for not supporting the forgiveness of said criminals.

I think some people here are thinking about the disgusting actions of the congregation and combining
that feeling with their thoughts on this legal matter. Individual and organizational rights must be
maintained. Separate the horrible action from the legal rights.

21

Finding My Father (help)

by purplesofa in

jw
friends

thanks to everyone that sent links to search for my father.. i have found a man with the same name, born in the same month and year, in a town next to where we lived the last i saw him.

there is an address and phone number connected with the name.

he is in florida.. the telephone number gives the name of the company the phone is listed with.. i can find the address on mapquest but do now know if this is a number for a business or residence.

OnTheWayOut

Google isn't always right, it was just a try to see if it all came up to the same business. Now, try yellowpages type search for the business to see if it truly is at that address.

I would simply call the number, blocking my own or from a payphone, see who answers, say you are looking for the named person- tell the truth. If you aren't ready for the truth, be ready to hang up. If you want to just use the truth, plan what you want to ask before calling.

21

Finding My Father (help)

by purplesofa in

jw
friends

thanks to everyone that sent links to search for my father.. i have found a man with the same name, born in the same month and year, in a town next to where we lived the last i saw him.

there is an address and phone number connected with the name.

he is in florida.. the telephone number gives the name of the company the phone is listed with.. i can find the address on mapquest but do now know if this is a number for a business or residence.

OnTheWayOut

The obvious thing to do besides calling is to google the number and the address to see if anything comes up.

16

What and how would you change/fix?

by XYZ in

so often, i hear people complaining about how the jw beliefs are no longer working and things like that....but so often, the complainers never say what should be done to solve the problem(s).

today i was reading jehovahs-witness.com/6/122349/1.ashx (about "faders"), which had some honest & interesting points but no solutions.

some, even seem to think there's flaws in the whole jw organization.

OnTheWayOut

Your answer must be supported by scriptures

JW's (and others) have proven that the scriptures can be used to support almost any belief, no matter how ridiculous. There is so much in the Bible pro and con on different subjects, there is so much lost in translation from original intent. The Bible contains approval of polygamy, war, incest, prostitution, revolution, etc. and it's principles also condemn these.

You cannot form a "fixed" religious system using the scriptures. The implication shuts out the possibility that the Bible is inaccurate.

19

Homosexuality and the Bible

by lisavegas420 in

in another posting, i wrote that i sent a jw sister this email:.

"then you sent me a man written document with some scriptures added to reinforce his own view point of what jehovah wants.

even if you believe that the scriptures are without error...would you consider your understanding may be in error?

OnTheWayOut

I would make her stick to just the Bible. If she wants to say that the Revelation Book uses the Bible to explain or prove itself, ask her if there have ever been any changes made to the book that is not man's thinking. (like a recent Kingdom Ministry)

21

Can you be Objective about the Watchtower Society's Literature?

by The wanderer in

jw
friends

can you be objective about the watchtower society's literature?

controversy is what this topic of discussion will attract.

by know means meant to offend, support, or defend the.

OnTheWayOut

Can you separate yourself momentarily from the Watch-
tower Society to comment objectively about the literature?

I guess zero and me cannot do this. To be fair, the WTS cannot momentarily separate themselves
from their own beliefs to give us much objective material. It is rare that they give practical advice
w/o talking about the Bible's promises.

7

Anybody notice

by Champion in

maybe someone already posted this and if so sorry.

my jw 86yr old dad spoke to me today and began telling me about the wonderful tract!!

i tried not to say much(but of course i had to) and tried to just listen.

OnTheWayOut

I have noticed that much distributed literature avoids using "Jehovah" at least in the introduction sections that are used in field service. No sense turning the householder off from your goofy religion from the first mention of the name.

I agree that the average JW will expect more from these tracts than reality suggests. I have heard the buzz, "It's so clear, hard hitting." It's just a cheap looking folded paper with some ambiguous religious stuff on it. Even if a person agreed with most of it, they would be more likely to avoid all religion, than join the one that printed the information.

It's just cheap literature made by a publishing company in financial trouble, designed to make JW's feel good about the work. Expect more cheap campaigns in the future.

21

Can you be Objective about the Watchtower Society's Literature?

by The wanderer in

jw
friends

can you be objective about the watchtower society's literature?

controversy is what this topic of discussion will attract.

by know means meant to offend, support, or defend the.

OnTheWayOut

You know that WT analogy with the drop of poison? "Would you drink a glass of water if it only had a small drop of poison in it?"

They use that to discuss Babylon the Great. I enjoy the Awake articles from a purely educational or recreational point of view.
The problem is that they can't write too many articles w/o putting the bizarro JW slant in them. Unless a person clearly
undertands that the publications are written by cult members who want your membership, they should be avoided by
the average person.

I, as a fader, still read the mags, but I know the dangers involved. Most people here would be the same. We are able to
see where the JW beliefs start creeping in. These mags are dangerous to children and unsuspecting people.

That is my opinion.

14

Inactive/Faded JWs

by Chameleon in

jw
friends

when the active jws come to your door, do you listen and take whatever they're offering, or do you not open the door?

when i move out (which i hope is soon), i'm planning to fade, but i am sure that my father (elder) will insist on knowing which cong.

i'm attending.

OnTheWayOut

Unless you plan on telling [your father] of your intention to fade you'll have to have your records sent to another congregation. Plus, he'll probably be checking in with the elders of that congregation and may even pay a visit to see how you're settling in. (This is all a guess not knowing your family's dsyfuctional level.)
brzfst

I agree. A fade is slow. You can leave suddenly if you are prepared to tell Dad what's up. You have to decide if family would cut you off if you told them the truth all at once, we wouldn't know. We will guess that it is probable that loyalty to the WTS will win the day for them.

If you want to fade with a move, you either become inactive in your old congregation then move away with no forwarding information for the BOE or inactive in the old cong. with a move, then forwarding your records, but never really going to the meetings. If you do either of these, you have to say something to Dad. OR you move, slowly become inactive in a new congregation away from Dad's influence.
I know in your last thread, you talked about a slow fade with your current living situation. Whatever you do, take your time deciding how to best acheive your goals. Don't rush to get out, unless that's your decision and you are prepared to face any consequences.

26

Would You/Do You Remain As A JW "Technically"???

by minimus in

jw
friends

technically, since i am not df'd or dissasociated, i am considered by witnesses as an inactive jw.

i do not actively look to get df'd as i have family that are witnesses.

if i were ever df'd, then i'd deal.

OnTheWayOut

I am early in a fade to inactivity. This month will be the first one I don't report any field service. I go to meetings, but miss as many as I can for work. I only stay for 2 family members. If I could get them out (maybe even just one) I would DA and have more peace. I suppose in the long run inactivity is better for many, but I hate "playing the game."