Earnest

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Posts by Earnest

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  3

  Old Awake! publications for download (1957-1969)

  by Sternfahrer in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  hello guysim searching a longer time for old awake!

  publications from 1957-1969.i found here an older topic with (awake!

  pdfs from 1957-1969)unfortunately none of the links is working anymore and i thought instead of answer on a 10+ year old topic i create a new one.

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  Earnest

  Select English - Magazines - Awake here.
  
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  26

  Greenlees, Chapman and Chitty

  by Libby in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  so after being rudely awakened by a cat fight outside (it's 3am here in the uk) and then proceeding to go outside to rescue my cats from the neighbourhood tom....... i'm now laying wide awake trying to make sense of jw "truth".

  (it's all my mind does these days, the lights gone on and won't turn off).

  anyway i found myself reading about the gb and came across these fellows , greenlees, chapman and chitty.

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  Earnest

  The most accurate account about Greenlees and Chitty can be found on a thread by AlanF. He describes the evidence as third-hand or circumstantial, but says :

  For those inclined to discount the following information, keep in mind that the evidence, while third-hand or circumstantial, is from a number of independent sources, and to an objective observer has the ring of truth. Also keep in mind that GB members don’t just up and resign – they have to be forced out.

  "Disgraced GB member [Theodore (Ted) Jaracz]" remained a member of the Governing Body until his death (Watchtower, 11/15/2010). There were accusations made against him in 2002 but these were not substantiated.
  
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  36

  New Zealand - JWs head to court on Abuse in Care Inquiry - RNZ news story

  by EasyPrompt in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/jehovahs-witnesses-head-to-court-on-abuse-in-care-inquiry-victims-feel-a-kick-in-the-guts/hwjsnshi5vfv7ghjztr63goseu/.

  "by bill hickman of rnz.

  the new zealand branch of the jehovah’s witnesses is going to court in an attempt to have the church made exempt from the abuse in care inquiry today.. in the high court at wellington, lawyers for the church are seeking a declaration that the church is not responsible for the care of children or vulnerable people in new zealand.. abuse survivor advocate and former church elder shayne mechen said the church was trying to use a technicality to side-step its inclusion in the inquiry.. .

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  Earnest

  Vidiot : “…Jehovah’s Witnesses’ policy was that parents should not leave their children with elders…”

  Reading through the various reports, my impression is that this was said in the context of "the faith did not run schools, camps or assume responsibility for care in any other way".
  
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  Abuser/Fugitive JW Pedro Matías Vargas Caught

  by EasyPrompt in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  https://www.apfdigital.com.ar/despachos.asp?cod_des=392562.

  "jehovah's witness of st. helena convicted of abuse was captured .

  paraná, oct 13 (apfdigital) .

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  Earnest

  Diogenesister : St. Helena is crawling with JWs.

  St Helena (the island in the Atlantic) is crawling with JWs. But this is referring to Santa Elena (St. Helena) in Argentina. Note the reference to Entre Ríos (the province where Santa Elena is located) and the 'ar' suffix to the websites.
  
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  13

  JWs and Conscription/ Military Service

  by NotFormer in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  matthew 5:41 (nwt) "...and if someone in authority compels you into service for a mile,* go with him two miles.".

  a member of the roman occupying forces could command a local to carry their pack for a mile.

  the local was thus pressed into a form of military service.

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  Earnest

  Anony Mous, I was not suggesting your claim (that someone with a criminal record due to refusing military service was barred from serving in certain capacities) was anal, but that doing so was perverse. I would appreciate a reference in the Elders book if you happen to know it.
  

  I also lived in a country that had mandatory service, and agree it was expected you would refuse any demanded service unless a court sentenced you to it. I remember arguing that I could pay a fine instead of imprisonment as I was guilty of the charge (refusing military service) but was told we (JWs) needed to present a united front. However, although it is now treated as a matter of conscience whether one accepts civilian service, the principle that a Christian cannot support the armed services (or any nonneutral organization) has not changed. The principle is not that you cannot do demanded service for government in civilian duties, that is what Matthew 5:41 is about. The implementation of the principle was that you could not do civilian duties in lieu of joining the armed services. It is an important distinction. What has changed? I suggested that since the '70s and '80s the variety of government responses to conscientious objectors has clouded whether compulsory civilian duties are in lieu of military service, and so it becomes a matter of conscience.
  
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  JWs and Conscription/ Military Service

  by NotFormer in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  matthew 5:41 (nwt) "...and if someone in authority compels you into service for a mile,* go with him two miles.".

  a member of the roman occupying forces could command a local to carry their pack for a mile.

  the local was thus pressed into a form of military service.

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  Earnest

  NotFormer : How do the JWs get around this?

  Earnest responds.

  NotFormer : Stop defending your evil organisation!
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  13

  JWs and Conscription/ Military Service

  by NotFormer in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  matthew 5:41 (nwt) "...and if someone in authority compels you into service for a mile,* go with him two miles.".

  a member of the roman occupying forces could command a local to carry their pack for a mile.

  the local was thus pressed into a form of military service.

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  Earnest

  Anony Mous : the idea that somehow it’s okay to pay your taxes but not aid in the military is backwards.

  AM, I accept most of what you say, although it is new to me that a criminal record due to "neutrality" would bar one from having certain responsibilities. That's anal. But on the matter of taxes, some conscientious objectors (not JWs) have refused to pay the proportion of their taxes they believed went towards the military. I considered that but concluded that Jesus' statement on tax (Matthew 22:17-21) settled any reservations about what the tax might be spent on.

  NotFormer : In most countries, civilian service in lieu [of military service] can be things like building roads, etc.

  Jesus was not talking about doing something in lieu of military service. I gave the example of Simon of Cyrene who was compelled (ἠγγάρευσαν) to carry Jesus' stauron, the same word (ἀγγαρεύσει) Jesus used at Matthew 5:41. This was not in lieu of an alternative. If you do some work in lieu of military service, you are recognising your obligation to perform military service and substituting some other work. As Anony Mous points out, this is the viewpoint the Watchtower held and nothing was acceptable in lieu of military service, including paying a fine. In 1996 it was made clear that it is a matter of conscience whether or not one accepts work instead of military service. The conscience of the great majority has since allowed them to perform alternative service, but that is human nature for you. The principles have not changed, but with the variety of governmental responses to conscientious objectors and the fact that many young men didn't understand the nuances of refusing alternative service, the issue is more that of conscience than a clear scriptural mandate.
  
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  13

  JWs and Conscription/ Military Service

  by NotFormer in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  matthew 5:41 (nwt) "...and if someone in authority compels you into service for a mile,* go with him two miles.".

  a member of the roman occupying forces could command a local to carry their pack for a mile.

  the local was thus pressed into a form of military service.

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  Earnest

  NotFormer : The WT hypocrisy in this matter is that they concede "legitimate service" and yet they sent thousands of people to prison by refusing "civilian service in lieu".

  There is a difference between "legitimate service" as a form of tax, and civilian service in lieu of military service. Not everyone feels about it the same way, but some (including myself) feel that accepting alternative service in lieu of military service recognises an obligation to the military. Some conscientious objectors during the second world war were willing to work as stretcher-bearers, ambulance drivers etc. Others held the view that doing so was effectively enabling those in the armed forces to be soldiers instead of attending to the wounded and dead. Essentially, it is a matter of conscience and each must carry his own load.
  
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  36

  New Zealand - JWs head to court on Abuse in Care Inquiry - RNZ news story

  by EasyPrompt in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/jehovahs-witnesses-head-to-court-on-abuse-in-care-inquiry-victims-feel-a-kick-in-the-guts/hwjsnshi5vfv7ghjztr63goseu/.

  "by bill hickman of rnz.

  the new zealand branch of the jehovah’s witnesses is going to court in an attempt to have the church made exempt from the abuse in care inquiry today.. in the high court at wellington, lawyers for the church are seeking a declaration that the church is not responsible for the care of children or vulnerable people in new zealand.. abuse survivor advocate and former church elder shayne mechen said the church was trying to use a technicality to side-step its inclusion in the inquiry.. .

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  Earnest

  Section 17.4 of the New Zealand Royal Commission of Inquiry gives the definition of what "in the care of faith-based institutions" means. It refers to where a faith-based institution assumed responsibility for the care of an individual and ...

  Subsection (ba) for the avoidance of doubt, a faith-based institution may assume responsibility for the care of an individual through an informal or pastoral care relationship. An informal or pastoral care relationship includes a trust-based relationship between an individual and a person with power or authority conferred by the faith-based institution, where such a relationship is related to the institution’s work or is enabled by the institution’s conferral of authority or power on the person:

  As the "authority or power" of all elders is conferred either directly or indirectly by the faith-based institution of Jehovah's Witnesses, I cannot see that exemption from the Inquiry will be granted.
  
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  4

  Current outline for funeral talk or memorial meeting for deceased jw.

  by Holey_Cheeses*King_of_the juice. in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  could a member please direct me to the current jw funeral talk or outline for a deceased jw.

  members of my wife's family will be attending such meeting for their deceased piece of shit father and i would like them to be prepared for what they can expect.

  nothing good, or what they would be hoping for i would surmise.. for the love of cheeses..

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  Earnest

  Here is the March 2021 Funeral Discourse.