Posts by Faraon

32

Smoking and JWS

by gringojj in

Faraon

I really don't think that smoking is too bad since Jehovah likes the smell of smoke. It has a soothing effect on him.

http://www.blueletterbible.org/tmp_dir/words/7/1117072341-9621.html

Faraon

21

WTBTS and the Cross

by Honesty in

.

does anyone have any idea why the cross is such a stumbling block to the wtbs and the jehovah's witnesses?

1 corinthians 1:18 describes their belief system to a "t".

Faraon

I just had a wicked thought. You know the torture stake picture that the WT publishes?

What if instead of the INRI sign above his head you could see the top of a watchtower?

Too bad I don´t have photoshop,

Faraon

15

Beduhn's "Truth in Translation" quotes Part 1: proskuneo

by M.J. in

as you may know, a relatively new book by assoc.

professor jason beduhn rates the nwt among the most accurate of the available translations, based on selected nt passages.

here are a few quotes on his treatment of one of them, on the subject of translating proskuneo as obeisance vs. worship:.

I do think that BeDuhn has a valid point, but he forgets that the concept of worshipping has evolved through the ages. We now think of worshipping as something that emanates from the mind in a loving way. However, the way that I read the bible (mostly in the Hebrew Scriptures, but also to a lesser quantity in the Greek translations), the act of worshipping seems to me to have started as a gesture of submission. This gesture basically comes out of fear, not out of love.

From there, we see the idea of giving honors being developed, which basically, again, is a recognition of having a higher form of status in the chain of command but it now implies a group.

Finally we end with the modern English definition of to worship as: giving love and devotion to a deity. This, of course, is not all-inclusive, as we still see British magistrates being called "Your Worship", and as we well know, not all Britons worship their magistrates. Yet this understanding of the word is a far cry from the primitive Hebrews who functioned, not out of love, but out of fear of an angry god.

In Spanish the word "adorar" (to worship) has a wider range of meanings. As I see it, it was probably what Jason BeDuhn had in mind when he suggested that a word that covers a meaning closer to the original Greek should be uniformly used. In Spanish, for instance, is not uncommon for someone to say something like "adoro tus pantalones" (It literally would mean: I worship your pants) when someone is trying to say that they love your pants.

I do agree that he seems too naïve. On his examination of Matt. 28:16-17, for example, he states: "This contradiction seems to be missed by all translators except those who prepared the NW".

Right! Like they did not look at the bible with a fine toothcomb to back up their doctrine! (p.48)

I do strongly concur with him that the "debate of interpretation is the right of the readers, and should not be decided for them by the translators" and also that "Modern translators undermine that cause when they publish interpretations rather than translations, still trying to direct readers to the understanding acceptable to the beliefs and biases of the translators themselves." (p.49)

Curiously enough, BeDuhn has backed my position that the NWT should be called an interpretation, and not a translation. Why? Because it is not uniform. When it comes to be neutral about its doctrine all rules change in their favor. And I have been saying for years, even before BeDuhn´s book came out. But to be fair, most bibles do deserve to be acknowledged as biased, although they don?t call themselves a "translation".

I have actually recommended this book to JWs. I think that they will get a few surprises when they read it. I have seen in it some things that I know that the WT will definitely not like.

Faraon

10

Question from Reader July 1 2005

by skyman in

read the questions from readers page 27 of the july 1 watchtower.

it talks about blood.. dueteronomy 14:21 reads: "you must not eat any body already dead" does that contradict leviticus 11:40, which reads: "he who eats any of its body will wash his garments, and he must be un-clean until the eveing"?

that is how the article starts out.

Faraon

PP,

By accepting this logic I could have been a JW pimp. I sold the product but was not responsible for the decision of my clients to accept it. They have been dancing a legal and ethical tango for so long.

I couldn´t stop laughing out loud for over 10 minutes when I read this. ... and yet so serious and true...

Faraón

15

Tape recorder ? for ex or current elders

by loosie in

ok all you guys out there in the know.

i've always wondered why in jc's elders worry about tape recorders being on.

i mean this is a jc not the fbi.

Faraon

Hi, Denny,

As an anti-watchtower activist I need this protection from the jehovah's witnesses 'goons for God' stalkers and i've been out for 14 years.
Real Video clip on the street with a JW
Come and get it....

I couldn´t open it. It had a .ram extension for which I obviously have no program.

How may I see it?

55

Did you ever experience Holy Spirit?

by Ring Wielder in

i was a jw for 40 years.

although as an individual/cong/body of elders holy spirirt was prayed for, i cannot think of one moment when i thought..right now i have gods spirit acting upon me.

it was never described adequately for me to completely understand and i suspect that others felt the same, yet everyone talked as though they knew exactly how it worked.

Faraon

I really cannot tell you if I have experienced her, or how to tell if the emotions and feelings of being at peace come from my mind, or I am helped by her in order to attain this state of inner peace.

One thing is clear. I felt more in touch with humanity and with myself when I either believed in God, as a catholic, or now as an agnostic, doubts and all.

My life as a JW, except for the first few years seemed to be filled with stress, especially filling the 60 hours of required time promised when I volunteered, and the "spiritual activities" such as personal and family study, preaching, going to meetings, dressing up, and traveling to and from those activities. I felt guilty about filling the monthly record, and wound up writing on them "Matthew 6:3". I began to see things as black or white. No middle ground, and started to realize that I was becoming insensitive.

I guess I never have fully understood the concept of Holy Spirit, either as God, part of the trinity or as a force, but I feel closer to her as a person that can be an advisor or counselor and she can be a source of comfort.

Jehovah is clearly a mythical god who was only interested in the tribal genetic descendents from Abraham, and therefore he is out by default. Jesus did not come to break the Jewish Laws, inhuman as they are, so he is out since he recognizes as true the myths of the bible. His apostles were not interested in the rest of humanity until Cornelius. This means that the last parts of the gospels were inserted later.

That would only leave the Holy Spirit, but she is not acceptable by me as part of a trinity because Jehovah and Jesus are myths. To top it all, part of my still JW mind controlled mind views her as a mindless force, so she is out.

Thank you Watchtower for driving someone to have a strong inclination to atheism!

14

Child abuse - school officials reccommended - do NOT call police

by wanderlustguy in

witnesses: teen punched in face, forced to perform sex act

alleged assault videotaped

posted: 11:16 am edt april 12, 2005

Faraon

I would like to imagine 2 scenarios.

In a JW inquisition, she would probably be disfellowshipped because she did not scream, and there were not 2 baptised JWs present.

I a court of "the chosen people," -Israel, she would've been forced to marry his raper, but since there were more than one, Would they choose lots?

All teachers, doctors, nurses, policemen, etc. will lose their jobs and licence. I don't think that the law goes far enough and the school system must also compensate the victim since they were stupid enough to hire such an animal as an assistant principal and for leaving students unsupervised on school grounds He should also be gang raped and beaten in a jail, so that maybe he will have a little empathy for victims of sexual abuse in the future.

The boys who forced her should spend a minimum of five years in jail where they more likely than not will be raped and get a taste of their own medicine.

The onlookers who silently watched should be made to repeat their grade level.

Faraon

31

Evil Lives Monday, April 11, 2005

by apocalypse in

evil lives

monday, april 11, 2005

-if ever in your mind you wonder as to whether the leadership at watchtower has some level of sincerity, or perhaps as you move deeper into your pursuit of the real truth, you find yourself having doubts that you are doing the right thing in "doubting" the watchtower ?then read on.

Faraon

Good thread, Apocalypse!

Peaceful Pete,

Nice work Apocalypse. yes, the not too subtle association of modern doubters of the WT with evil hard hearted Pharoah, for whom no amount of evidence would satisfy!

I take issue with your words since my pen name means Pharaoh in English. (just kidding)

In the Exodus myth the evil one was not the unnamed Pharaoh, but Jehovah.

In this myth Jehovah controls the mind of Pharaoh, so he is like a puppet, unable to make decisions and therefore not responsible for his actions.

This episode reminds me somehow about how the Watchtower controls the minds of the Jehovah's Witnesses. Seeing it from this point of view, Pharaoh represents the JWs and Jehovah truly represents the bOrganization.

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/contra/hardened.html

Faraon

43

SO WHAT'S YOUR PHOBIA

by tijkmo in

couple of days ago posters were chatting about someones clown avatar being scary....seems some people do really suffer from coulrophobia.

so whats your phobia...are you ablutophobic-fear of washing.....arachnaphobic-spiders...cenophobic-new ideas(wts??

look up the phobia list on google and tell us....its good to share.

Faraon

speculaphobia

fear or aversion of/to the watchtower

http://www.archives.nd.edu/cgi-bin/lookdown.pl?watchtower

7

JW's + child sacrifice

by Noumenon in

interesting article here by the provocative david icke (of the 'we are ruled by alien lizards' persuasion).. there is a comment in the article about child sacrifice rituals, etc.

this brings to mind the fact that most jw parents are of course quite prepared to allow their little baby or child to be sacrificed to jehovah out of blind obedience to the organisation's blood policy.

also, the jw policy on insisting that 2 witnesses testify to any child abuse/molestation, thus making the religion a haven for paedophiles, can also be said to be a form of child sacrifice.

Faraon

I also dont know any witness who treat there child as dead because of being disfellowshiped after all how harsh can it be. why was they disfellowshiped to began with was it for doing something good. Usually when your child is bad you give some form of punishment i.e. grounding, taken away allowances and such

.. as beating the sh*t out of him in the toilet during the talks ... Yes. I personally have seen parents shun their children. My cousinin told me that she would not talk to me until I became a JW again. Do not try to lie here. We lived those experiences. Faraon