Another excellent piece of research and analysis - Thanks Blondie!!!!
LUKEWARM
JoinedPosts by LUKEWARM
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Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 10-18-09 WT Study (HOPE)
by blondie inunpublished documents, evidently written by isaac newton, that indicate he believed the world could end in 2060 ad.. (newton also had many other possible dates e.g 2034) [11].
13:43) how did the true knowledge become.
actually, until 1927 or so the wts taught that 1799 was the beginning of the "time of the end" not the 1914 the.
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Lukemia Witness dies due to lack of blood.....the horrific sad story.
by Witness 007 inthe nicest 41 year old brother i have ever met in my life, kind and helpful to all, goes for a routine blood test and finds he has lukemia.
everyone was in shock, he of course refused all blood products advised by doctors.
his blood cell count dropped dramatically and he began to suffer alot.
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LUKEWARM
Thanks 007 - How did you know him? Were you in the same hall?
It's very sad indeed...in the prime of his life (in the process of building a house I understand) leaves behind a wife and 2 children. I got to know him personally after he migrated to Australia - he was indeed a gem of a man - positive about life, a caring loving husband/father and would always make you laugh!
I heard (3rd hand) doctor told him there was nothing he could do for him...No wonder considering the suddenness of the matter and the WTS false indoctrination that blood transfusions are against the law of God.
As Mary says, they are HEARTLESS BASTARDS who arrogantly believe they are the voice of God in all things, but have repeatedly demonstrated "teaching commands of men as doctrines" (Matt. 15:9) and "going beyond what is written" (1 Cor. 4:6) in the Bible.
They talk about Christendom having innocent blood on their hands, but they fail to see their own accountability before God for the unnecessary death of so many people who truly believed their claims to divine appointment and followed to the death the dictates as presented in latest The Watchtower magazine.
To all lurkers out there, please consider the contents of the below references so you are in a position to make an informed decision with a clean conscience on the matter of blood transfusions, namely:
(1) The Jensen blood letters (leaked letters of elder corresponding with the WTS over 5 years on the blood issue) towards the bottom of this page:
http://www.ajwrb.org/watchtower/index.shtml
(2) The chapter Ray Franz wrote on Blood in his second book(3) Also of interest is this information:
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Lukemia Witness dies due to lack of blood.....the horrific sad story.
by Witness 007 inthe nicest 41 year old brother i have ever met in my life, kind and helpful to all, goes for a routine blood test and finds he has lukemia.
everyone was in shock, he of course refused all blood products advised by doctors.
his blood cell count dropped dramatically and he began to suffer alot.
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LUKEWARM
I heard of a case in NSW - identical to the one you mention - died from Lukemia although I am unsure (yet) of the exact details of his stance towards bone marrow or the transplant of white blood cells.
His funeral was held in Sydney early last week - are we talking about the same person?
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Watchtower says Millions Living in 1997 Will Never Die
by LUKEWARM in"in the early 1920's, a featured public talk presented by jehovah's witnesses was entitled 'millions now living will never die.
' this may have reflected over-optimism at that time.
but today that statement can be made with full confidence.
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LUKEWARM
"In the early 1920's, a featured public talk presented by Jehovah's Witnesses was entitled 'Millions Now Living Will Never Die.' This may have reflected over-optimism at that time. But today that statement can be made with full confidence." -- Watchtower 1997 January 1 p.11
Judging by their terrible record of any accuracy, its likely readers years from now will be reading similar back pedalling and spin doctoring. Imagine the Watchtower of January 1, 2086 on p.11 saying:
"In the early 2000's, Jehovah's Witnesses continued to live in expectation of the end and in their ministry zealously proclaimed that many then living would never die. This may have reflected over-optimism at that time. But today that campaign can be carried out with full confidence!" -
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Is the WTS compromising its stand towards preaching? Our kingdom Ministry 2009, Question Box
by LUKEWARM inon page 3 the question box asks: what should you do if directed to stop preaching?.
the answer?
"in some instances, police have approached publishers who were sharing in some form of the ministry, informed them that they were violating the law, and directed them to stop.
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LUKEWARM
On page 3 the Question Box asks: What should you do if directed to stop preaching?
The answer?
"In some instances, police have approached publishers who were sharing in some form of the ministry, informed them that they were violating the law, and directed them to stop. You should promptly and politely leave the territory if directed to do so. (Mat 5:41; Phil 4:5) Do not try to resolve matters on your own or by getting involved in a discussion about our legal rights. If it is possible, tactfully obtain the name and identification number of the police officer and the police station to which he is attached. Thereafter, promptly inform the elders, who will then contact the branch office about the incident. Similarly, if you are asked to leave a shopping centre, car park area, or apartment building or complex by the supervisor or representative, you should comply immediately and inform the elders. A mild and humble manner of dealing with those in authority can do much to prevent unnecessary difficulties. - Prov. 15:1; Rom. 12:18."
So if a JW is engaged in this life saving work, supposedly commissioned by Jesus himself and directed by God, but some human authority directs them to stop, they "should comply immediately" and need to "promptly and politely leave the territory"!
Are they watering down their previous die-hard stand? What happened to following the example of the Apostles?
June 15, 2008, pages 18-22, par3
"As Christians, we take a position different from that of the world. It is not that we blindly do whatever we are told. On the contrary, at times we must refuse to submit to the will of others even if they have positions of authority. This was also true of first century Christians. For instance, when the apostles were ordered to stop preaching, they did not cave in to the high priest and other authority figures who were part of the Sanhedrin. They did not abandon right conduct in order to conform to human authority.-Read Acts 5:27-29." -
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Is there any hope of you coming back to Jehovah?
by LeftBehind inmy brother is a self proclaimed apostate.
i see now that there is a wide variety of posters here.
so to those that have left the witnesses what would it take to get you back?
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LUKEWARM
Marking - Brilliant thread!
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Blondie's Comments You Will Not Hear at the 10-04-09 WT Study (GOD-GIVEN)
by blondie inhttp://exjehovahswitnessforum.yuku.com.
http://www.jwsupportforum.com/index.php.
http://www.jehovahswitnessrecovery.com/.
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LUKEWARM
Thanks Blondie!
607 BCE to 1914 CE = 2,520 years?
So they use a LUNAR 360 day year to get the total amount of years and then use a SOLAR 365 day calendar to get to 1914!
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How Broke Are They?
by metatron inthe october km announces that, starting this year, there will be no theocratic school schedules as an insert in the km.
weekly tms parts will be printed as part of the monthly km.
this follows the experiment of dumping a pile of magazines at the kingdom hall and catch-as-catch can.
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LUKEWARM
Seems to me there is plenty of cash to move around from the UK alone...
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Congregation "Bible Study" Comments - Week Commencing 05 October 2009
by LUKEWARM in*** lv chap.
11 pp.
121-132 "let marriage be honorable" ***.
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LUKEWARM
*** lv chap. 11 pp. 121-132 "Let Marriage Be Honorable" ***
"Rejoice with the wife of your youth."-PROVERBS 5:18.
Q1, 2. What question will we consider, and why?ARE you married? If so, is your marriage a source of happiness, or are you experiencing serious marital problems? Have you and your spouse drifted apart? Are you enduring married life but not enjoying it? If so, you likely feel sad that the warm marital bond you once enjoyed has cooled. As a Christian, you surely would like your marriage to bring glory to Jehovah, the God you love. Hence, your present circumstances may well be a source of concern and heartache to you. Even so, please do not conclude that your situation is hopeless.
Why do they always focus on the negatives - "serious marital problems", "drifted apart" "not enjoying it", "feel sad" - are witness marriages unhappy?
2 Today, there are fine Christian couples who once had marriages that were merely surviving, not thriving. Yet, they found a way to strengthen their relationship. You too can find more contentment in your marriage. How?
DRAWING CLOSER TO GOD AND TO YOUR SPOUSE
Q3, 4. Why will marriage mates draw closer together if they strive to draw closer to God? Illustrate.3 You and your spouse will draw closer together if you strive to draw closer to God. Why? Consider an illustration: Imagine a cone-shaped mountain-wide at the base and narrow at the top. A man is standing at the foot of the northern slope while a woman is standing on the other side, at the foot of the southern slope. Both begin to climb. When both are still near the mountain base, a long distance separates them. Yet, as each climbs higher and higher toward the narrow summit, the distance between them becomes less and less. Do you see the reassuring lesson in this illustration?
Seriously, I wonder which genius concocted this illustration?
4 The effort you put forth to serve Jehovah to the full could be compared with the effort it takes to climb a mountain. Since you love Jehovah, you are already trying hard to climb, so to speak. However, if you and your spouse have grown apart, you may be climbing opposite sides of that mountain. What happens, though, when you continue to climb? Granted, a considerable distance may separate you at first. Nevertheless, the more effort you put into drawing closer to God-into climbing higher-the closer you and your mate become. Indeed, drawing closer to God is the key to drawing closer to your spouse. But how can you actually do that?
What does "serve Jehovah to the full" mean?
"love Jehovah" is demonstrated by following the dictates of the WTS?
"...you are already trying hard" - is the WTS indirectly admitting that their "commands of men" make worshipping God hard?
Why is an illustration about serving God linked to the strenuous effort in climbing a mountain? Didn't Jesus teach that his yoke was light and refreshing and doesn't the Bible say that Gods commands are not burdensome?
Q5. (a) What is one way to draw closer to Jehovah and to one's marriage mate? (b) How does Jehovah view marriage?5 One important way to climb, as it were, is for you and your spouse to heed the counsel on marriage as found in God's Word. (Psalm 25:4; Isaiah 48:17, 18) Consider, therefore, a specific point of counsel stated by the apostle Paul. He said: "Let marriage be honorable among all." (Hebrews 13:4) What does that mean? The word "honorable" implies that something is esteemed and precious. And that is exactly how Jehovah views marriage-he esteems it as precious.
Can "...heed the counsel on marriage as found in God's Word" be done independently of the WTS and via the exercise of personal conscience?
YOUR MOTIVATION-HEARTFELT LOVE FOR JEHOVAH
Q6. What does the context of Paul's counsel about marriage show, and why is that important to keep in mind?6 Of course, as servants of God, you and your spouse already know that marriage is precious, even sacred. Jehovah himself instituted the marriage arrangement. (Matthew 19:4-6) However, if you are currently experiencing marital problems, just knowing that marriage is honorable may not be enough to motivate you and your mate to treat each other with love and respect. What, then, will move you to do so? Note carefully how Paul addressed the subject of showing honor. He did not say, "marriage is honorable"; rather, he said, "let marriage be honorable." Paul was not merely making an observation; he was giving an exhortation. Keeping that distinction in mind may help you find added motivation for rekindling esteem for your spouse. Why is that the case?
Are "...servants of God" only JW's?
Why did Jesus not use the name "Jehovah" in Matthew 19:4-6?
Q 7. (a) What Scriptural commands do we carry out, and why? (b) What good results come from obedience?7 Consider for a moment how you regard other Scriptural commands, such as the commission to make disciples or the admonition to meet together for worship. (Matthew 28:19; Hebrews 10:24, 25) Granted, carrying out those commands may at times be a challenge. The people to whom you preach may respond negatively, or the secular work you do may leave you so exhausted that attending Christian meetings is a struggle. Even so, you keep on preaching the Kingdom message, and you keep on attending Christian meetings. No one can stop you-not even Satan! Why not?ecause your heartfelt love for Jehovah moves you to obey his commandments. (1 John 5:3) With what good results? Sharing in the preaching work and attending meetings gives you inner peace and heartfelt joy because you know that you are doing God's will. And those feelings, in turn, renew your strength. (Nehemiah 8:10) What is the lesson here?
How is the WTS following "the commission to make disciples" teaching them "all that I have commanded you" (all that Jesus taught as outlined in the gospels)? Why are they preaching 1914, last days, paradise earth, 144,000 etc which Jesus did not teach?
Why is the scriptural "admonition to meet together for worship" perverted, from meeting in private homes and breaking bread to the WTS imposed 2 meetings a week in kingdom halls?
"Granted, carrying out those commands may at times be a challenge" - no kidding! Their man made rules are passed on as Gods commands, just the Pharisees of old!
"No one can stop you-not even Satan! Why not? Because your heartfelt love for Jehovah moves you to obey his commandments" So when the membership cannot keep pace with your useless rules either its Satan has won or your love for God is waning. Guilting the masses again sub-consciously!
"the preaching work and attending meetings gives you inner peace and heartfelt joy because you know that you are doing God's will" is another message to pass on their man made rules as "Gods will".
Q8, 9. (a) What may move us to obey the exhortation to honor marriage, and why? (b) What two points will we now consider?8 Just as your deep love for God moves you to obey the commands to preach and to meet together despite obstacles, so your love for Jehovah can move you to obey the Scriptural exhortation to "let [your] marriage be honorable," even when that appears to be difficult. (Hebrews 13:4; Psalm 18:29; Ecclesiastes 5:4) Additionally, just as your efforts to share in preaching and in meeting together bring rich blessings from God, so your efforts to honor your marriage will be noticed and blessed by Jehovah.-1 Thessalonians 1:3; Hebrews 6:10.
More guilting by implying lack of love for God if one does not "obey the commands to preach and to meet together despite obstacles"
Reinforcing the benefits message and Gods approval sub-consciously by saying: "efforts to share in preaching and in meeting together bring rich blessings from God".
9 How, then, can you make your marriage honorable? You need to avoid behavior that will damage the marital arrangement. In addition, you need to take steps that will strengthen the marital bond. -
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I'm Still Torn About the Blood Issue
by palmtree67 inwhen i left the org.
the blood issue wasn't an issue for me.
my best friend was on the blood committee for years and i could see many cases where either blood wouldn't have saved the person anyways (like when a person is in a serious car accident and their liver is in pieces), or blood actually killed the person and/or hindered recovery.. then my little nephew got leukemia.
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LUKEWARM
Hi Palm,
Read the Jensen blood letters (leaked letters of elder corresponding with the WTS over 5 years on the blood issue) towards the bottom of this page: http://www.ajwrb.org/watchtower/index.shtml
I have printed his letters out and given to a few witnesses so far with excellent results!
Thought this link may be of interest to you: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/bible/136144/1/Question-Why-was-it-ok-to-sell-unbled-meat-to-a-foriegner-for-them-to-eatAlso, the chapter Ray Franz wrote in his second book about the blood doctrine can be accessed here: http://www.commentarypress.net/cpn-essays/English/4C648686-695D-48C7-ACA8-A52794ED6128_files/Search-Eng-Chap%209.2006.pdf
Lukewarm