JeffT

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Posts by JeffT

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  15

  Mormons = Anyone Aware of This?

  by Joe Grundy in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  anyone aware of this?.

  http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/10619538/head-of-mormon-church-thomas-monson-summoned-by-british-magistrates-court-over-adam-and-eve-teaching.html.

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  JeffT

  Are they going to drag in the Queen and ask her about the teachings of the Church of England? I'm no fan of Mormons, but they are entitled to teach what they want.
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  71

  Theism Makes Science Impossible

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  it is not impossible to be a great scientist and a theist - kenneth miller and francis collins are good examples.. however, science depends on methodological naturalism - a working assumption that there are natural causes for observed effects.

  please note that methodological naturalism is not the same as ontological naturalism.

  in other words scientists may believe in a spirit world or not as long as god is never invoked as an answer.. contrast this with theism which, unlike deism, declares god to be immanent and active in the world.. consider a scientist who is also a theist doing research into the efficacy of a new drug that cures heart disease.

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  JeffT

  Now when he collates the results of the trial how does he factor-in the answers to prayers?

  He doesn't. If he's doing real science its a double blind trial and he doesn't know who was treated with what.
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  51

  If You Got a Call or Visit From The Elders How Would You Deal With Them?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  just curious..

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  JeffT

  Can't imagine it happening, I've been out since 1988.

  If they did want to chat, I'd be happy to talk to them. I would start by making it clear they have no authority over any part of my life and I do not consider myself in any way obligated to do anything they say, nor am I obligated to answer questions that I don't regard as their business. And if they say anything in public about our conversation that maligns my character, I'll sue them personally, since they aren't clergy and are not corporate agents, at least that's what they claim when it's convenient to the WTBS.

  Now what did you want to talk about?
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  65

  The yuk factor and others

  by jgnat in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  will you share with me an interesting discussion on what morals we all may have in common?

  my recent reading has resulted in a fundamental shift in my worldview.

  it feels like my house of cards have reshuffled themselves yet again, and everything i see, hear and smell is put in a new context.

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  JeffT

  My standards have evolved considerably in the last few years, not necessarily reltated to being an xjw (I've been out since 1988).

  Sex: I don't care what consenting adults do. I don't necessarily want to see them doing it. In cases of incest I question the ability of at least one person to be capable of giving informed consent.

  Food: I've never eaten horse or dog and don't intend to, that might change if I'm starving. That also applies to rats. My oldest son may yet talk me into at least trying insects. On the other hand I can eat a ton of sushi, which I know many people hate. I've eaten brains and don't care for them, but that's a matter of taste. Ditto for liver.

  People do all sorts of things I may not like or agree with, I pretty much don't care if it doesn't hurt anybody and their aren't in my face about it.
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  61

  How did you tell your spouse you want out of the JW religion?

  by leaving_quietly in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  what did you imagine would happen?

  did they react the way you expected?

  how did you bring it up?.

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  JeffT

  Captain Obvious:

  We were both converts, mostly caught up in the pre 1975 hype. We were both baptized in 1973, a month of so after we met at JW get together, married in 1974. I started having doubts post 1975, but stuffed it down trying, and not succeeding at being a good JW. Wife probably had some doubts all along but gave in to the family influence. My doubts really bubbled to the surface at a CA in early 1988, a talk about the evils of higher education and close we were to the new system. Shortly after that I went to the library and started studying. That led me to CofC.

  Unlike me, wife had been raised in a church and could not square Watchtower doctrine with what she knew about the Bible. Her anti-WT research began before mine, leading her to sneak into a Christian bookstore to buy CofC.
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  61

  How did you tell your spouse you want out of the JW religion?

  by leaving_quietly in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  what did you imagine would happen?

  did they react the way you expected?

  how did you bring it up?.

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  JeffT

  Other way around, she told me. I've told this story before, but it's always worth retelling.

  I was doing some independent research very secretively. I had a copy of CofC stashed out of sight under my side of the bed (I kept all sorts of things under there - she never looked). So one Sunday morning when we're skipping meeting (again) I'm sitting at the dinning room table reading the newspaper and drinking coffee, when she comes out of the bedroom with CofC in her hand. Just as I'm thinking "Oh *^%^( I'm busted," she grins and says "this is MY copy." She'd found my book and realized we were both research TTAT on the sly.
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  29

  JW university?

  by wearewatchingyouman in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  why don't the witnesses have an accredited university?

  almost all other xtian denominations do.

  why not dubs?

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  JeffT

  I don't know, if they run it as a theological seminary I think they can dodge a good many of the issues associated with accreditation. They may also be in a position to get their students governement backed loans. How those loans would be paid back is another issue, unless they move to having a paid clergy. Then the question becomes how are the clergy going to be paid.
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  4

  I should send this question to the Watchtower

  by JeffT in

  1. social
  2. humour

  if 666 is satan's number does that mean that 25.80697580112788 is the root of all evil?.

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  JeffT

  If 666 is Satan's number does that mean that 25.80697580112788 is the root of all evil?
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  11

  Not that old chestnut....

  by quellycatface in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  just come off the phone to my mum.

  she asked me why i da'd from the wtbts, she'd been to the meeting this morning and she'd been at the bottle as well - not a good combo, for her, anyway.. i said i did'nt want to go into it too much, as i may stumble her.

  she kept pushing so i said, last year i was'nt happy about the overlapping generation doctrine and did'nt agree that the org had taken bits out of the nwt.

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  JeffT

  The only use statements like this when they've been caught in an error. All the rest of the time you are expected to take everything they saw as if it came straight from God's mouth.

  They can't have it both ways.
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  24

  World's Greatest Music: Beethoven's Ninth Symphony, voted # 1

  by compound complex in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  now playing at kdfc.com.

  interesting that dvorak's symphony no.

  9 was voted to the number two spot .

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  JeffT

  I got to hear the Ninth at the Seattle Symphony two years ago at Christmas. What a great night.

  I doubt there is a classical tune on earth that can put a scratch let alone a dent in any of these stats.

  If people are still listening to Eminem two hundred years from now, you can have that debate with somebody.