Retrovirus

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Posts by Retrovirus

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  8

  Elders Approaching . . . What angle is best?

  by Murray Smith in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hiyall .

  i've been out for over 6 years now, and moved back to my old "home town" a couple of years ago.

  i've had a couple of visits from an old associate.

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  Retrovirus

  Hi Murray Smith,

  Maybe have the BBQ, but then ask him to meet just with you, and confide to him, as a friend, that you have "doubts" and would like his help. Pick your doubt carefully, and have it really well researched. My personal favorite is asking for proof that the WT was chosen by Jesus in 1919; would it be reasonable for J to do this and provide no scrap of evidence for "honest-hearted" ( ) non-jws ?

  Then use Black Sheep's methods. Don't let him shift the goalposts or answer a related question; act hurt and disappointed if he tries anything like that. Mention being stumbled.

  From my experience he'll avoid you like the plague after one meeting; two at the most (he might try to research and/or bring backup, but of course you will only confide in him alone, and his research won't help him).

  But when he runs, his doubts will run with him.
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  39

  Went round and round last night

  by sinis in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  so, my mother is still in.

  last night at my parents home she starts in with me on how she is going to ask my sig other to the memorial (puke), and that i should not forbid her to go.

  we went round and round about how the jw's are bs, gave many examples and it always came back to some twisted circular reasoning, that i still do not fully understand.

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  Retrovirus

  Just wanted to underline the difference between asking and pressuring. My take is that Sinis could always be OK with the mother asking his wife, an adult, to the memorial or anywhaere else. He would also be right and justified in preventing his mother from pressuring for it. It is entirely reasonable for any head of household, man or woman, to forbid hard sell tactics and guilt trips in their own home.

  And if a simple "no" isn't enough, Blacksheep's questioning approach works well; I've tried it!
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  317

  Inviting djeggnog to discuss the blood doctrine

  by jgnat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  djeggnog invited me to start a new thread about the blood doctrine, which i am happy to do here.

  his objection was my statement,.

  "i've seen the blood video, a deceiving mix of scripture, fearmongering and pseudoscience, with plenty of lab coats in view.

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  Retrovirus

  I personally think that @Djeggnog's intent in posting is to bolster the faith of any lurkers who are still (mostly) in the "truth". I hope any such can see the evasions, name-calling, and stubborn, unfounded insistence on calling blood fractions "nutrients".

  At least his final post is an obvious retreat from an untenable position.
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  124

  Are JWs the worst restaurant customers?

  by Alfred in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  (a little background info before i ask my question...).

  my sister-in-law (non-jw), who manages a popular chain restaurant near a kingdom hall, just found out that my wife and i have recently faded, so she decided to get something off her chest the other day... you guessed it: she wanted us to know that jws are the worst customers ever!

  she then told us some really embarrassing stories about how jws would request a table for 15 to 20 people (after a sunday meeting) and then (when the bill came) some of the jws would start deliberating amongst themselves on whether or not the waiter was diligent or not (to justify the low tip he was getting anyway).

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  Retrovirus

  This thread is heading downhill, but I'll try a different perspective.

  How unreasonable is it for the wt to

  1. tell jws not to get an education

  2. expect them to pioneer and put meetings etc ahead of work

  3. demand that they dress smartly (in an old-fashioned and non-provocative way)

  4. expect them to tip freely - with what?

  Yes, I know there are well-to-do jw's, but this strikes me as the height of hypocrisy.

  I've had to watch the small change several times in my life (we just didn't eat out), but I know how hard it is to hand out the money

  Retro
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  25

  My Story....Long and Im sorry

  by itsbeenalongtime in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ok...so this is my story.. i'm not sure why i have to post this..maybe more for myself than others.... .

  back 2002 i had a my daughter.

  i was 18. her father was was pretty much an awful mate and never worked....the same old story.... anyway a long story short we ended up moving in with his aunt, who at the time, was a sister.

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  Retrovirus

  Thank you for sharing. I've never been a jw, but have been through a painful divorce and "shunned" by family members, so I feel your pain.

  I'm sure it was because of those things that I "studied" with jw's; guess I would have done anything for a bit of encouragement and affection then!

  What pulled me through was the need to be a strong single parent for my two.

  Whatever the rest of your story, and whatever the future brings, I devoutly hope that you and your kids make it through to a happy and free adulthood.

  Warmest wishes, Retro
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  96

  April 15th WT - WT Society says " Obeying Us is Same as Obeying God "

  by flipper in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  this is a non-study article in the witness only version of the april 15th titled " do you discern the evidence of god's guidance ?

  " essentially in this article the alleged " faithful slave " is telling witnesses that to be approved to survive armageddon- they will have to recognize the " faithful & discreet slave's " authority in their lives.. notice these direct quotes from pg.

  4 , " jesus christ is the assigned leader of the congregation.

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  Retrovirus

  From the OP, quoting the jw watchtower, non-study article

  He HAS DELEGATED some authority to a faithful slave class, made up of faithful spirit - anointed Christians

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  I seem to have lost track of the "current light" on "spirit anointed ones". Do the GB all claim this status? Wasn't there a recent article saying in effect that even those claiming to be spirit-anointed should be obedient to "God's organisation"?

  So what authoriy or priveleges does "spirit anointing" give the individual these days? And if none, why is it still something to claim?

  Just wondering, Retro
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  3

  untitled

  by itsbeenalongtime in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i have been thinking a lot about how once someone is appointed in the in hall....such as a ms or elder...how many people always make such comments as: "well jehovah has appointed him so we have to deal with it" or "even jehovah uses wicked people in his organization"..how can people believe this??

  i do not understand how holy spirit can be apart of such beliefs.

  i know of a brother in our hall right now that has committed fornication, never telling anyone about it.

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  Retrovirus

  Having read "Crisis of Conscience", I'd say that if the Holy Spirit can't straighten out the governing body, what hope does it have with all the elders and MS's?

  Hope you are enjoying posting and I look forward to your story.

  Retro
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  39

  using the name "jehovah"

  by finallyfree! in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i find it to be frankly disrespectful.

  im a father, if my kids were to call me by my first name id find that wierd.

  we address judges with "your honor" and various other titles, so why on earth would we call the almighty god by his first name?

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  Retrovirus

  Thank all, it's very educational on this site (well, sometimes )

  My rather simple thought was that when my jw friends kept saying "Jehovah God", it sounded like God needed them to remind him of his name!

  It was one of the 2 reasons why they discontinued the "Bible" study, that I wouldn't use it. They told me it must please God as it was the most commonly accepted pronounciation in the world. . . Yet who did they say ruled the world ?

  Retro
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  15

  Time to stop obsessing

  by Qcmbr in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i think i may have reached another crossroads.

  the most tolerant woman in the world and i were discussing it last night.

  i've seen my loss of faith like a relationship breakup, i've done the gut wrenching fear bit and i've been heavily invested in the anger and angst phase where i've sought out people who believed as strongly as i once did and challenged them (like an ex-lover calling up for a shouting match.

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  Retrovirus

  Qcmbr, I'll miss you, but dree your own wierd! It matters less what we believe than what we do.

  Keep evolving, Retro
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  21

  Carpenters - Yesterday Once More

  by possible-san in

  1. social
  2. entertainment

  carpenters - yesterday once more.

  i love this song.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0orogjusbg.

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  Retrovirus

  All the Japanese people have my prayers, Possible-san.

  Stay well!

  Retro