Posts by Retrovirus

16

An update on my recent developments

by umadevi in

my last visit to kingdom hall was on memorial day.

since then i have decided skip to meetings and preaching.

the co and his wife visited my congo in the last week of april.

Retrovirus

Hi again, Umadevi!

As another single mother, can I suggest that you make sure your son is de-programmed? I mean, it seems you are fading quickly (and I can well understand that!), but maybe he's not at the same place after months or years of meetings, hearing about Armageddon etc. Perhaps it's all taken care of, but some kids are sensitive and it takes much less than that to give them nightmares about being out of Yahweh's shelter etc. My youngest was a sleepwalker.

Good luck with sister A! With my jw ladies when they got a bit heavy about meeting attendance I became unavailable (work) or "sick".

Retro

61

JWs and the Family Unit - Calling Maze to defend assertions

by Retrovirus in

in the thread about the wt in russia, maze made the assertions below.. .

jehovah's witnesses as an organization acts as a protection to the family unit.

andthe lie that jehovah's witnesses ruin families is apostate poison.. to aviod derailing that thread, i ask maze to defend them here.. my experience is that the jw religion destroyed my brothers' marriage.

Retrovirus

In the thread about the WT in Russia, Maze made the assertions below.

Jehovah's Witnesses as an organization acts as a protection to the family unit

.

And

The lie that Jehovah's Witnesses ruin families is apostate poison.

To aviod derailing that thread, I ask Maze to defend them here.

My experience is that the jw religion destroyed my brothers' marriage. Both he and his wife were responsible, compatible people who did everything in their power to preserve a stable relationship for their children.

But when one partner belongs to a religion which claims to be absolutely right, and teaches contempt for the rest of the world, how can you compromise? Can a jw parent allow their child freedom to choose? Can they really respect their partners' right to believe differently?

I cannot address the more direct ruina of families when disfellowshipped members must be shunned as I lack the personal experience, but hope that others will do so.

For the sake of lurkers this must be highlighted.

Maze, your quoted statements are not true. The jw religion does destroy families .

36

45 JW Rules/Teachings that "go beyond" writings of the Bible

by oompa in

(1 corinthians 4:6) .

.that in our case you may learn the [rule]: do not go beyond the things that are written,.

.. 45 jw rules/teaching that "go beyond the things that are written" in the bible.

Retrovirus

Hi Nugget, thaks so much for your additions. Could you please add some more for when a jw wife is married to an UBM?

There was so much we didn't understand when my brother's wife got baptised.

Retro

9

I don't want to go !

by hubert in

jw
friends

i haven't posted in a long, long time, so many of you don't know me.

one of my daughters is involved with them, and will be baptized soon.. anyway, it's my anniversary, 43 years today, (may 11), and my j.w.

daughter calls me and wishes me a "happy anniversary", then invites my wife and i out on sunday to "celebrate" it.

Retrovirus

Hi Hubert,

Like you, I'm not a jw but have family and friends in. I'm so glad you are keeping the door open for your daughter. I find it so hard to offer unconditional friendship and love in return for all the religious hints and manipulation - but then, it's what keeps us from being cult-minded ourselves in the end.

All luck in your situation and hopefully one day she'll see the organisation as it really is.

24

The greatest man?

by Satanus in

he was just a man, according to the wt, albeit, a 'perfect man'.

he wasn't god, he didn't even have a spirit.

he was just a mechano-electrochemical organism.

Retrovirus

Great fractals, thanks!

This thread helped me define another area where the wt "bible study" really turned me off.

Everything has such a mundane, mechanical explanation! Yet this explanation is "the truth" and every scientific dicvovery that supports it is "fact" and all others are "inspired by satan". Until the next "new light".

No room for the unknown, mystical or mind expanding perspective. The gb knows it all.

Don't often see a reference to Psalm 8!

7

Wonder what will happen?

by umadevi in

i wonder what will happen if i just call one of the "sisters" and say that i don't want to attend meetings anymore?

any ideas anyone?.

Retrovirus

Umadevi, I can't be certain as I was never a jw, but believe it will depend on your local congregation and elders. It could be anything from renewed pressure and "encouragement" to being disfellowshipped. It might be best to slowly miss more meetings over time.

Do you have "outside" friends and/or family? Does your son? Build such contacts before taking a decisive step.

Godd luck and keep posting, Retro

36

Everything is "Satan" ... Now what?

by roxanesophia in

firstly, i'm a study who initially believed every word of the jw's.

figured "no other religion takes the time and effort to help people understand the bible by publishing the watchtower and the other literature" not realizing that all it does is pick and choose scriptures to suit whatever sentence they'd just written, which can be done using any book, not just the bible.

i felt foolish, after that.. .

Retrovirus

It's a horrid feeling, isn't it? I'll let the jw's give the details, but depending on the number of hours per month, jws are classified as "publishers", "auxiliary pioneers" and "pioneers". Pioneers have the highest status, and being a pioneer is the only way a jw woman can have any rank in the org, as the little tassel is all-important. Any other rank is a reflection of her husbands'.

So why would rank matter in an organisation full of love? You've been there, and probably know better than I

36

Everything is "Satan" ... Now what?

by roxanesophia in

firstly, i'm a study who initially believed every word of the jw's.

figured "no other religion takes the time and effort to help people understand the bible by publishing the watchtower and the other literature" not realizing that all it does is pick and choose scriptures to suit whatever sentence they'd just written, which can be done using any book, not just the bible.

i felt foolish, after that.. .

Retrovirus

Welcome, roxanesophia!

Like you I was a "bible study" but have now been promoted to "bad association" because I "failed to progress"

Ah well.

My question is how do i tell a zealous study conductor that I want to stop studying if "Satan" is the answer to everything

I'd bear in mind that the apparent affection and kindness they show, and the time they've given you is all recorded as "service" for which they get credit; it's hardly a personal favour of any kind. Your study conductor is zealous because of her beliefs and position in the cong, rather than because of any bond between you.

So, either of two ways - politely say that this will be the last study because you need to "consider prayerfully" on your own for now, or

Ask enough difficult questions that she will want to terminate. There is plenty of material here and on jwfacts if you prefer this course.

If she overplays the "Satan" card - just play along until it gets ridiculous even to her. Did satan make the wt redefine "generation" 5 times? Where was Jesus at the time? Did satan create so many animal and insect species that there's no way at all they could fit on the Ark? Can satan keep God from getting through to you?

Good luck, and kudos for being too honest to go out in "service" - because that's what it really was. Do your own research, and keep in touch!

Retro

25

Perhaps some helpful advice. My rant on the JW mindset.

by garyneal in

jw
friends

pride and prejudice abound in the watchtower religion.. i go to the assemblies and it becomes very clear that the speakers are so proud of the fact that their religion is the one true religion and that they are so much better than the other churches out there.

the amount of pride i heard coming from the platform is astounding.

astounding still is the fact that they cannot see it themselves and at one point in time, i could not see it either.

Retrovirus

Sometimes, I think we go through life seeking the approval of others

There's a lot in that. Often in the "bible studies" I was tempted to please my jw ladies by giving the "right" answers, and felt guilty when I objected yet again. They were after all, two polite and friendly ladies giving me their time. I was in a low spot then due to family difficulties and it really seemed to matter that I didn't alienate them.

Yet as my mood lifted over time I realised that they were, deliberately or not, working on the guilt and insecurity. Particularly they invited confidences about things I'd handled badly, sure that their religion would "help".

Something must be wrong with you to learn the truth and then deny it

That happened a lot. Whatever objections I raised with their primitive creationism were put down at once with "Darwinists just want to deny Jehovah so they can do as they please" - even when minutes earlier we'd agreed that we believe in the same God! Sheesh!

Seems crazy but I know that there is a saying that says, "It is not what we think of ourselves but what others think of us that defines our character

."

In the sense of "perception is reality" - perhaps. But still it's only their reality, not yours.

Hang in there. Retro

71

Sex at 14?

by headisspinning in

jw
friends

hello all.... some of you have been following our story from the beginning - and even those of you who haven't should be able to relate to my quandary.... last week my 14 year old son told me he no longer wants to be a jw.

we laboured over telling his jw dad all week.

well, on friday night he finally came clean.. but in a bizarre and unexpected twist, after having sex with his girlfriend for the very first time - in his father's home that very afternoon.

Retrovirus

Hi headisspinning,

Wow, such a lot is happening to you!

To recap, it seems that in the space of about a month, you son became a publisher, then told you he didn't want to be a jw, then told you he is sexually active with his gf? Have I followed correectly?

Teens are a volatile time, but I'd suggest the family problems may also be involved here. Certainly it's great and important that he can talk to you. Can I suggest that counselling might help him? (not elders, of course, but perhaps you could find someone appropriately qualified and experienced).

Failing that, check the library and the net for helpful books and articles for both of you. Coping with change, growing up; other peoples' accounts of transitional experiences. He has had a lot to deal with.

Also don't forget the sibling(sister?) - in my experience it's the quiet ones you need to watch!

And. . . in your place, I might leave Ray Franz' book somewhere he could see it.

Best of luck and hope you had a good Mothers Day, Retro