Trust me. Once they get the feeling like you no longer believe that the GB is directed by God (whether that is before or DURING your hearing) they will cut off all questions and the focus will turn to getting you to admit you don't believe that this is Jehovah's organization.
outsmartthesystem
JoinedPosts by outsmartthesystem
-
11
A question for active or recent Elders about apostate judicial meetings...
by EndofMysteries inin the shepherd the flock book, i did not really notice a protocol for how they judge and go about w/ apostates or those suspected.
i was wondering if there was a seperate letter or word of mouth instruction on that.
mainly.......are they told to not let the accused talk about their reasons and get into much detail, or at some point to not talk or listen to them at all, etc.
-
-
-
11
A question for active or recent Elders about apostate judicial meetings...
by EndofMysteries inin the shepherd the flock book, i did not really notice a protocol for how they judge and go about w/ apostates or those suspected.
i was wondering if there was a seperate letter or word of mouth instruction on that.
mainly.......are they told to not let the accused talk about their reasons and get into much detail, or at some point to not talk or listen to them at all, etc.
-
-
outsmartthesystem
"Mainly.......are they told to not let the accused talk about their reasons and get into much detail, or at some point to not talk or listen to them at all, etc. "
Bingo. I just went through my JC hearing 3 weeks ago (for "apostasy from the organization"). I had oodles of printed organization literature citing contradictions, lies, quotes out of context, examples of propaganda (that they themselves defined in the June 22, 2000 Awake) etc. I had questions about 607, the disfellowshipping doctrine, definitions of Greek words that are sometimes flip flopped to suit the argument they are trying to make. The point being......I had ZERO apostate literature. All of the literature.....the problems.....and the questions I had were coming straight from society based publications. Well....the ringleader of the group cut me off and told me that they have no intention of listening to "foolish questions".
Let me put it to you this way. If you are a publisher in good standing.....you can ask a few questions. They will hand you some pre-printed drivel and expect that you'll accept it as proper food. If you do not accept it .......or if it doesn't answer your questions....or even if it develops MORE questions......NOW you have a target on your back. Once they form a JC for you for not blindly accepting the GB's direction.....you've already been labeled and they are told by the powers that be that under no circumstances should they listen to or answer your questions. They are told that you are evil and are only trying to shake their faith. Basically they are told to bury their heads in the sand as quickly as possible and get you the hell out of the congregation before you influence others with your brazen conduct of wanting to know real answers.
-
29
The WT proves again that it does not understand Child Psychology
by Christ Alone ini posted this elsewhere, but wanted to create a thread about this specifically.
here is one way that i think the wt is absolutely wrong in it's advice on raising children:.
in the 1/13 awake they talk about mistakes that parents make with their children.
-
-
outsmartthesystem
Trailer Fitter - The love that JC spoke of is ignored in favor of organizational legalism. Once a person like your wife becomes captive to the concept that everything the organization does is truly blessed by God......then IT and ITS rules trump the bible.
JWs raise their kids with such strict legalism and completely conditional love.......and then when those children turn away from teh organization......the JW parents wonder....."why wasn't the truth in little Johnny's heart?". Mentally, they are unable to make the connection that it was the lack of true love.....the strict adherence to man made law....etc that led to this child wanting to "turn away from the organization".
-
5
update
by outsmartthesystem inwell....tonight is when they announce my disfellowshipping for apostasy from "jehovah's organization".
on another note.....i have officially learned that the woman i used to love and that i trusted was a genuinely good, moral person is officially evil.
i have a friend that still goes to the sunday meeting to appease his elderly parents.
-
-
outsmartthesystem
Wha - Yeah we are still married but only because she can't divorce me due to the fact that I didn't commit adultery. She lives with her parentsw. She is saying that we "can get back together".......but the reality is that I would have to beg her to return.....admit that I am 100% to blame......and promise never to say or do anything that would impede the "spiritual progress" of the kids in the JW faith.
Zid - We are "separated". The funny thing is that my FIL has a LOT of enemies in this religion. There are a combined 13 elders in the two congregations in town. 8 of them absolutely despise him. My friend's uncle (who is an elder on the same body as my FIL) HATES him. He called up my friend to say "don't let him do it! Don't let him take away your everlasting life!". That alone tells me one thing. As of now.....it has turned into my friend's family and their cronies vs my wife's family and their cronies. My friend told me if he just can't do it anymore (fake being a witness to appease his parents) he will gladly tell the CO and the elders that he was stumbled out of "the truth" by my FIL. And to a degree......he is being honest. I am not saying it will happen......but this has the potential to ruin my FIL and his "standing" in the congregation.
-
5
update
by outsmartthesystem inwell....tonight is when they announce my disfellowshipping for apostasy from "jehovah's organization".
on another note.....i have officially learned that the woman i used to love and that i trusted was a genuinely good, moral person is officially evil.
i have a friend that still goes to the sunday meeting to appease his elderly parents.
-
-
outsmartthesystem
Well....tonight is when they announce my disfellowshipping for apostasy from "Jehovah's Organization". On another note.....I have officially learned that the woman I used to love and that I trusted was a genuinely good, moral person is officially evil.
I have a friend that still goes to the Sunday meeting to appease his elderly parents. But he is mentally out and I've been hanging out with him often. This friend let me in on a "business deal" that he entered into with my wife's father 8 years ago. My friend ended up getting financially shafted by my FIL and then my FIL.....being the gossiping, coniving and manipulating man that he is....made sure to warn the congregation of the "downward spiritual spiral" that my friend is in......thus getting everyone in the congregation to have an automatic distrust for my friend. This isn't the only shady financial deal my FIL has been a part of. There are many others. In fact.....let me give you a little background. My FIL has been on an insurance company issued disability policy for almost 20 years. My FIL is a pencil pusher......so the work he used to do was not strenuous. But it was "stressful" and he managed to convince the insurance company that he could not handle the mental rigors of his job anymore and thus needed to be on long term (permanent) disability. This would allow him to collect 66% of his previous year's salary until he turns 65. And that is what he's been doing for 20 years. The catch is.....in order to collect that $, he must "prove" that he is not of sound mind.......at least.....not sound enough to handle the rigors of his job. He does this by visiting a psychiatrist each week. Yet he is a congregation elder. And in order to hold that position.....he must prove that he IS of sound mind. Sound enough to handle meeting parts, give talks, be on the hospital visitation committee etc.
So I am talking to my wife about splitting our $ last week. Out of the kindness of my heart.....I simply said "look....your dad has been involved in a number of financial messes (including his own filing of bankruptcy) and many of them have hurt other people. I am not saying that he enters such deals seeking to harm others.....but....that has been the final result. Others have been hurt and that is what happens when you get friends involved in risky deals. Just.....be careful with your $ because I fear that in the future he is going to have a business proposition for you." My wife acted very concerned and asked for more info. Because I still trusted her somewhat.....I gave her the info regarding my friend. She proceeded to angrily accuse my friend of lying about her father (even though I have SEEN the business deal paperwork that they both signed WITH MY OWN EYES) and demanded that I stop "slandering" her dad. Of course she went straight to her dad to tell him that my friend and I are slandering him. He went to the elders. Why, you ask? Not because of slander.......because he KNOWS it is true! But to get my friend disfellowshipped for associating with ME! Granted....I haven't been DF'd quite yet.....but around here the witnesses know of my "apostate" thinking. So......the witch hunt has begun. My friend is now being called up by the elders to set up a "time to talk". They want to know if my thinking has rubbed off on him at all. It is an official witch hunt
So....what my wife did....is feign concern so that she could gather information and then viciously defend her father all while eliminating the source of the sore spot for she and her dad.
What a bitch
-
14
Has this thought from the Jan awake page 7 always been?
by therevealer inher church teaches that god.
never forgives suicide.
i showed her how the bible.
-
-
outsmartthesystem
DOC - Sadly that could easily be refuted. A good jw would just say "yeah....but Jehovah TOLD him to". Remember....if the great Jah tells you to do something that violates His own laws (suicide is murder of oneself)....it is all ok!
-
29
Any idea when "New Light" offically in print or explained 2 RnF???
by mind blown inhello, would anyone know or a guesstimate??.
also, will they have assemblies to discuss .
~mb.
-
-
outsmartthesystem
Black Sheep - you are so right. But ya know what is so convenient for JWs? If you bring up a gross contradiction in a talk or symposium you've heard.....they'll say...."well that was just one brother who got off topic.....it wasn't in print so it didn't come from the FDS". Yet....if the JW hears something he likes from the stage....well now THAT is to be taken as gospel! I don't recall the topic now....but many years ago new light was revealed at a CA. I brought out afterward that it isn't in print. I was looked at like I had a 3rd eyeball. You could see the thought bubbles above everyone's heads saying "but the brother just said it from the STAGE at an assembly that is being directed by Jehovah!"
-
34
Did you ever shun people when you were a dub? How did it feel?
by oldlightnewshite inokay, i don't know lots of people that were df'd, but of all the times i've encountered df people when i was a dub, they actually blanked me!
it was always something that i had fixed in my mind that the jws had dead wrong, even when i was an uber dub.
i remember several times when i used to arrive late at meetings, and i'd make a point of getting eye contact with the poor dub at the back sitting on the naughty step.
-
-
outsmartthesystem
I shunned. I shunned my own brother for the better part of 10 years. It felt awful.....unnatural.....inhumane......yet I did it because I thought that is what God wanted me to do. The power that religion has over people is sickening.
-
39
My first own thread on here. Woken up and still in :(
by Gefangene ini have been around in this forum a lot but haven't written much yet.. also i had a more or less rude awakening when i realized that the religion i grew up with, the religion i sacrificed a lot for and considered to be the 'truth' is nothing but mere bs.
it's quite a brick to digest.. my parents both are jws, elder and pioneer.
very good people but also very brainwashed.
-
-
outsmartthesystem
Welcome! Though you are still "in" for now......remember....you can use that to your advantage (and those on this board). If you are willing....you can post cliffs notes versions of assemblies and conventions to let teh rest of us know what is going on from the platform. And you can still try to reach close friends of yours discreetly simply by asking them questions that will make them think.
-
32
JAN 2013 SHUNNING ARTICLE COULD MEAN JWS NOT AS OBEDIENT
by steve2 inin a separate thread, there's been intense discussion about how the gb is still seeking to tighten its grip on the rank and file.
the latest evidence is the january 2013 watchtower which rolls out hugely predictable statements about not doing anything to upset one's (jw) family by, for example, being in email contact with a disfellowshipped witness.
it's hard to stifle the yawns.
-
-
outsmartthesystem
I think the GB is definitely trying to tighten the grip. The problem is that if 6,999,999 respond by shunning their family.....that's not good enough for them. They want 7,000,000 to respond. So until they get full cooperation from the rank and file.....they will keep pounding away.