Posts by Oroborus21

171

GAGS I HAVE PROUDLY PULLED ON JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES :)

by Nate Merit in

in 1984 (shudder!

) my bud mark smith and i picketed the kingdom hall in ann arbor, michigan.

our signs had a watchtower drawn on them and said 'this religion is a snare and a racket!

Oroborus21

Dear Nate,

Thank you for your reply which shed some truth to the situation. I was truly baffled by your reply to my post above which I felt was very conciliatory and peaceful. There is nothing in your profile which describes your situation so I did not know that you were homebound or limited in your movement and that certainly would explain the significant amount of posting.

I think this forum is a wonderful place and I hope that you will make many friends and supporters.

I don't believe that any of my posts on this thread were reactive or submitted without deliberation. My first short post was meant to address what I considered to be boasting about illegal behaviour. No one is the police here, not even the moderators, but we all have some duty in being responsible with what we say and the ideas that we advocate here.

There are many sensible and mature persons here but there are also a number who are not, including a number of younger persons that visit, some who post and many who lurk, who might not have fully developed and matured and may feel that such things are ok.

When such ones read about the glorification of what are really hate-crimes towards a religious group, they may not appreciate that that was the "70s" or understand that you are not condoning such activity now. (Actually I am more saddened by the responses by otherwise sensible adults which continue to applaud such conduct and advocate the duplication of it.) Very often what are minor pranks or misdemeanor crimes such as petty theft or vandalism forms a basis in escalation of the activity and can lead to very serious things such as arson, aggravated vandalism, terrorist activity, bombings, and even killing.

Your situation, while sympathetic, does not give you the right to glorify such "pranks" without criticism. I believe that I have been respectful in all of my posts in this thread. Regarding Jeannie, I don't know what to say about that. She is evidently my Inspector Javert. I didn't see her original post in this thread so I can't address it. I do note, and you have the time to look at my post history, that she almost inevitably posts a response to whatever I say attacking me in a very personal way, including accusing me of conduct or spinning what I say in a completely warped sense. It is actually both bizarre and amusing. I am evidently someone that she has judged and she is determined to attack me whenever she has the opportunity. Some people just take a disliking to others automatically and that has been the case on her part. As for me, I don't know her and only base my opinion on how she has treated me. I took issue with your claim of my bullying her which is simply untrue.

I have not had the opportunity but I wish to welcome you to the forum. I have been around on the Net for quite some time, going back to H20 days, and am engaged in developing my own perspective regarding Jehovah's Witnesses with my website, Jehovahs-Witnesses.net

I hope that you will use your experience to help others, inform others, encourage others, and yes make them laugh - but in a responsible way.

sincerely,

Eduardo Leaton Jr., Esq.

171

GAGS I HAVE PROUDLY PULLED ON JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES :)

by Nate Merit in

in 1984 (shudder!

) my bud mark smith and i picketed the kingdom hall in ann arbor, michigan.

our signs had a watchtower drawn on them and said 'this religion is a snare and a racket!

Oroborus21

Wow,

well I will let the public read my post and then your follow-up and judge for themselves.

I find it fascinating that you have amassed so many posts in only one months time. I will reserve my thoughts about the significance of this.

As for the supposed bullying, please point out some of my posts that you consider to be such conduct. I have never bullied anybody, and no, you are seriously mistaken if you think you could take me. You really wouldn't want to get on my bad side in that way.

I forgot to add regarding JeanieB that she has also seemed incapable of recognizing sarcasm, hyperbole or any other similar literary technique where one is seeking to convey an effect through the use of overstatement.

I don't know whether you are capable of pipebombing a Kingdom Hall. But your glorification of vandalism and hate-crimes towards Kingdom Halls is enough to warrant caution. Certainly, if you claim to be mature today, although challenging one to a brawl seems to belie that claim, you should not be giving persons, especially the significant number of teens that lurk here on this forum, ideas.

When someone spray paints a swastika on a synagogue or plants a burning cross in the lawn of a black church are these not hate crimes to be condemned by society? How is spray painting a Kingdom Hall any different? It is not.

-Eduardo Leaton Jr., Esq.

147

WT,DEC 1 2005,PP22-23;IS THIS AN INACCURATE STATEMENT?

by badboy in

jw
friends

.

weeks earlier,jews and proselytes from at least 15 regions of the roman empire had packed jerusalem to celebrate the passover.. on the next page,it seems to show arabia ,media,elam and parthenia as part of the roman empire.. i thought the romans never conquered arabia or persia.

am i right?.

Oroborus21

Oh my Lord.

I hope, Schizm, that wasn't a real question? You need to do a little research. These cultures such China and the Olmec, Toltec, Aztec, Maya, Inca, not too mention the North American plains and pueblo cultures such as the Anasazi, and the pacific island cultures were all flourishing before the Roman Empire was ever a dream. At the height of the Roman Empire, there still lived vast numbers of tribes and lands and people from the Asiatic tribes, the Norsemen, Rus, Asian Countries, Sub-Saharan cutures of Africa, the Pacific Island nations and of course the Americas that either didn't even know of Rome or didn't care one flip.

The point of the scriptures is from the viewpoint of its writers. Thus in the Bible when it talks about the inhabited nations or when it talks about the 'good news being spread to all the inhabited nations" before the end (presumably the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 C.E.) comes, or even when it speaks about Noah's flood covering all of the Earth or wiping out all of the people and animals, etc. - all of these things should be understood to be limited to specific locality and not in fact to a global dimension. This was the "known" world to and for those Bible writers, they had no knowledge of the unknown parts of it or they would have included or dealt with such in their writing.

-Eduardo Leaton Jr., Esq.

171

GAGS I HAVE PROUDLY PULLED ON JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES :)

by Nate Merit in

in 1984 (shudder!

) my bud mark smith and i picketed the kingdom hall in ann arbor, michigan.

our signs had a watchtower drawn on them and said 'this religion is a snare and a racket!

Oroborus21

Hello Nate,

I certainly did not mean to personally offend you and I apologize if you were hurt in any way.

However, I do take issue with your justification that these things occurred when you were 26. I can understand teenage pranks and am guilty of much illegal activity myself including vandalism when I was a teen, though not on par with what you described. But teenage misbehaviour is something to regret or maybe reminenence (sp?) over not something to be proud about.

These acts of fraud and vandalism, and yes, spraypainting a Kingdom Hall or a parking spot is simply graffiti vandalism, that took place when you are 26 years old are quite a different matter. You are supposed to be an adult and if anything rather than boasting that you are "proud" in the title of your thread to have committed these crimes, you should be ashamed and remorseful for your lack of maturity.

I understand the frustration that many feel and I understand that many believe that payback to the Society is justified, but there are socially appropriate ways to go about it. Criminal activity in any form should never be condoned or commended and in the end only serves to fuel the Society's misrepresentation of the opposition.

To JennieBeanz and all persons who care:

Please look my post history up. You will never see that I have ever said anything to JennieBeanz that could be considered "vile". In fact, to the contrary you will almost always find that after I have posted something often having nothing to do with her or not in one of her threads, Beanz has posted afterwards and often engaged in a personal attack or criticism of me. It is rather amusing really.

I long ago gave up on trying to engage in any kind of rational dialogue with her as I have found her to be completely incapable of respectful argument and holding a point and supporting such with evidence or logic.

I am sorry that I did not see your post which was removed and I had nothing to do with its removal. If you ever have anything that you wish to tell me please feel free to pm me or email me.

Finally, I hope you are enjoying Texas. Being from New Mexico myself I really miss the weather this time of year in that part of the country. California is much cooler since you left. All the hot air has seemingly gone east.

-Eduardo Leaton Jr., Esq.

24

Backward Masking

by bigmouth in

jw
friends

if you're under about 30 this might not mean much to you but during the 80's and 90's there was always a heap of counsel on debasing music.it made you terrified to listen to anything except the brilliant kingdom melodies.

we had a big thing here in nz about music that had been recorded in such a way as to give some sort of demonic message in a subliminal way.we couldn't listen to stairway to heaven,hotel california and a host of other songs.ah hell!, we may as burn everything.but i found devo's whip it is masked and now i couldn't care less,great song.of course you could only check by turning your vinyl backwards.anyone get freaked out back then too?

Oroborus21

Greetings!

This is mostly the stuff of Urban Legend. Most records spun backwards sound pretty scary and that is enough to lead ones to imagine that they hear what they are expecting.

However, there are a few songs where the technique was deliberately introduced. One of Prince's songs off of the Purple Rain album has a section of backward masked sound. You know it when you come to the end of it. I think it is "Darling Nikki". Anyway I don't know if it was Prince's joke but the words as I recall when you play it backward actually are "Hallelujah, Hallelujah, the Lord is Coming Soon" so I always that was probably a shot at the rabid fundy types that were all up in arms about backward masking.

Masking with audio is entirely different than say subliminal imaging in visual mediums and it is impossible to create a song that sounded totally normal but when played backward conveyed a distinct message so such fears about listening to all of these artists' songs was obviously overblown, unless the audio comprising the signal with the message was outside of human hearing while playing forward but within it when played backward. (not too mention that the idea, the why's and reasons for doing such a thing and the potential for actually creating any kind of effect upon the listener with such a technique are all irrational and stupid.)

A person listening to a normal record that contained something backward masked would certainly detect atonality and other "garbage" and the songs would no doubt sound terrible which is why it is easy to know which part of a song has some backward masking such as the Prince song I mention above.

-Eduardo Leaton Jr., Esq.

171

GAGS I HAVE PROUDLY PULLED ON JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES :)

by Nate Merit in

in 1984 (shudder!

) my bud mark smith and i picketed the kingdom hall in ann arbor, michigan.

our signs had a watchtower drawn on them and said 'this religion is a snare and a racket!

Oroborus21

Greetings!

Shame on you and shame on anyone in this thread that gave you a "thumbs up" for your activity.

Vandalism, mail fraud, telephone fraud, telephone harrassment, theft from a Red Cross Center no less, trespass, etc. oh yes these are all things to be so very proud of.

I am surprised that you haven't moved on to pipe bombs and arson but maybe you "grew up"??

-Eduardo Leaton Jr., Esq.

126

Let's play a game - Follow the WTS $$ trail

by watch the tower in

a huge question that i have in the back of my mind regarding the wts is where all of the money ends up.

no one really has a conclusive answer to that.

i think it would reveal a lot if we were able to find out.. i know there have been various threads in the past where it revealed a clue here and a clue there.

Oroborus21

where's my post!!!

How come I write this whole big post and when I submit it, the whole thing gets truncated into three lines.

there goes an hour wasted. Great, I am done. I have a USC football game to get to now and don't have time to rewrite.

Frustrated!!!! Ed

126

Let's play a game - Follow the WTS $$ trail

by watch the tower in

a huge question that i have in the back of my mind regarding the wts is where all of the money ends up.

no one really has a conclusive answer to that.

i think it would reveal a lot if we were able to find out.. i know there have been various threads in the past where it revealed a clue here and a clue there.

Oroborus21

lady lee and scully,

Once Again for emphasis: it is not the WTS that OWNS the stock.

Further the WTS doesn't even CONTROL the Trust or have any management authority over the Trust Administrator.

It would be an entirely different matter if the Society actually owned the stock or could say what the underlying trust assets should be.

Additionally, for all we know the Rileys told their lawyer or banker or whoever to set up the trust and are not even involved themselves in selecting the stocks. VERY FEW investors are, especially ones that are large investors. They intrust the job to professionals. As far as I have ever seen no one has ever stepped forward to provide evidence of the Riley's JWishness. Who are these people? WE only assume that they are JWs but they might not be. And again even if they were, we can't assume that they are paying attention to the actual holdings of the trust or considering the implications for others.

Finally, it is a small point but the stock that is held is actually of the parent company which has numerous nonobjectionable subsidiary companies such as Nabisco.

Bottom line: All of this is just a lot of hot air and smoke that opposers of the WTS are trying to sensationalize to no end.

-Eduardo

126

Let's play a game - Follow the WTS $$ trail

by watch the tower in

a huge question that i have in the back of my mind regarding the wts is where all of the money ends up.

no one really has a conclusive answer to that.

i think it would reveal a lot if we were able to find out.. i know there have been various threads in the past where it revealed a clue here and a clue there.

Oroborus21

Not this nonsense again.

re: Phillip Morris stock.

It is NOT OWNED OR EVEN CONTROLLED BY THE WTS!!!!

The WTS is only a 3rd Party beneficiary of the Trust controlled by the administrators of the Henrietta Trust. There has never ever been any proof that that the Administrator who has the responsibility of managing the trust assets is a JW or under WT control. Most trust administrators are banks and other such professional personnel. Most likely the persons who establised the trust, the Rileys, wanted to benefit the Society created the trust and have the actual administration being performed by professionals.

There is no evidence whatsoever that either the WTS has actual knowledge of the trust assets and even if it did, it would have no power to say to the adminstrator to change or divest itself of the objectionable portions of the trust.

the Society's only option would be to reject the gift entirely which seems entirely unreasonable.

re: JP MOrgan, et al.

This is even sillier. The Society like anyone has the right to hold stock in such common funds and has no control over the underlying holdings or management. The Society said long ago that investing was not objectionable for a Christian. And given that millions of dollars are entrusted to it and that it is a nonprofit corporation, it actually has a duty to the public to make prudent investments with its capital and attempt to increase its capital if possible.

-Eduardo Leaton Jr., Esq.

20

I Called the FBI Today

by Gerard in

yep.

never thought i'd do a thing like this.

it started with a search for a spooky avtar for this forum, so i downloaded a photo from the "10 most wanted criminals" fbi site.

Oroborus21

Hope it is the right guy and not just some innocent man who looks like the bad-guy. keep us apprised if you can.

-Eduardo Leaton Jr., Esq.