Norm

Joined

• started 158 topics
• posted 659 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by Norm

• 
  24

  The thoughts of real True Believers

  by Norm in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the friday 28 issue of washington post had some very interesting information about documents found in one of the terrorist hijackers luggage.

  these documents give us a good insight into the minds of religious fanatics and their thinking.

  all of you other true believers, christians and otherwise, can learn a lot of true faith from those documents.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Norm

  Hi Nathan,

  You said:

  Where else can cruel unenlightened medieval mentality be found?

  Well, you find a lot of it in the Bible, and you find a lot of people who think we should go back to those medieval "values"

  Norm.
• 
  24

  The thoughts of real True Believers

  by Norm in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the friday 28 issue of washington post had some very interesting information about documents found in one of the terrorist hijackers luggage.

  these documents give us a good insight into the minds of religious fanatics and their thinking.

  all of you other true believers, christians and otherwise, can learn a lot of true faith from those documents.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Norm

  The Friday 28 issue of Washington Post had some very interesting information about documents found in one of the terrorist Hijackers luggage.

  These documents give us a good insight into the minds of religious fanatics and their “thinking”. All of you other true believers, Christians and otherwise, can learn a lot of true faith from those documents. Not that I think you will learn anything though but one can always hope.

  The similarities in language, the choice of words seem universal but of course the relation between the Bible and the Koran isn’t coincidental. Both books hold out the ultimate reward, life after death in a “paradise”. Though the concept of paradise differs, they basically sell the same product. If you believe hard enough and are faithful you will be “rewarded” by God. It has proved to be a great concept for a long time; no one has come back and complained yet.

  From the “suicide” document:
  

  "Everybody hates death, fears death," according to a translation of highlights of the document obtained by The Washington Post. "But only those, the believers who know the life after death and the reward after death, would be the ones who will be seeking death."

  A recurring theme is the promise of eternal life.

  "Keep a very open mind, keep a very open heart of what you are to face," the document says. "You will be entering paradise. You will be entering the happiest life, everlasting life."

  From the Watchtower and the Bible:

  *** w99 3/1 21 Jehovah's Blessing on Our "Land" ***
  After the 144,000 have all received their heavenly reward, the benefits stemming from their priestly service as corulers with Christ will extend into the future, ultimately leading to the complete conquest of Adamic death.—Revelation 5:9, 10; 21:2-4.

  *** w98 7/1 11 How Strong Is Your Belief in the Resurrection? ***
  17 After all, how could God reward those who proved to be “faithful even to death” if he did not bring them back to life?

  The Watchtower and many other Christians have a very high regard for Abraham who was willing to obey God to the point that he would kill his precious son Isaac. The hijackers proved themselves to be worthy of Abrahams example, they didn’t kill their son but they killed themselves and many “enemies” in obedience to what they saw as God’s command. Being faithful is the name of the game for a true believer.

  From the “suicide” document:

  "Remind yourself that in this night you will face many challenges. But you have to face them and understand it 100 percent. . . . Obey God, his messenger, and don't fight among yourself where you become weak, and stand fast, God will stand with those who stood fast."

  From the Watchtower and the Bible:

  *** w93 7/15 17 Respond to God's Promises by Exercising Faith ***
  Our faith will also move us to obey God, even as Abraham did.

  *** w99 8/1 21 Show Honor to Others ***
  On the other hand, the upright ones who do honor and obey God and Christ “are the ones that will reside in the earth.”—Proverbs 2:21, 22.

  *** w98 4/15 8 What Will Your Future Be? ***
  To obey God means life, to disobey him means death.—Romans 6:23.

  *** w98 7/15 29 Do You Have "an Obedient Heart"? ***
  Surely, we should obey God. After all, Jehovah is our Grand Creator.

  *** w97 5/15 21 Honesty-By Chance or by Choice? ***
  He placed before them two clear choices. They could obey God’s commandments and receive his blessing or reject them and reap the bitter fruitage of sin.

  *** w96 11/1 7 Look to Jehovah for Comfort ***
  4 What Adam and Eve did need, however, was to cultivate a deep love and appreciation for their kind heavenly Father. Such love would have motivated them to obey God under all circumstances.

  *** w95 1/15 16 Serve Jehovah With Joy of Heart ***
  Let us therefore obey God and enjoy his favor. Joy is one of the many divine blessings experienced by the godly.

  After such a display of true faith and religious devotion, all religions and in particular representatives of the Christian and Muslim faith hasten to assure everyone that such a actions has got nothing to do with Islam etc. All I can say is yeah, right! Isn’t strange that some of the worst bloodbaths and terrible atrocities have been carried out by both Christians and Muslims but miraculously these actions NEVER have anything to do with their respective religions? How long are they going to play that worn out record? In century after century, generation after generation these religions have kept on hammering superstition and the most confused and insane ideas into innocent children and in some cases these children has grown into people who committed the horrible deed in NY and Washington. The foundation was laid from childhood when they were lead into the world of superstition with fantasies about God and some paradise. Just take a look at another product of this fantasy, prayer:

  From the “suicide” document:
  

  "You should pray, you should fast. You should ask God for guidance, you should ask God for help. . . . Continue to pray throughout this night. Continue to recite the Koran."

  It continues: "Purify your heart and clean it from all earthly matters. The time of fun and waste has gone. The time of judgment has arrived. Hence we need to utilize those few hours to ask God for forgiveness. You have to be convinced that those few hours that are left you in your life are very few. From there you will begin to live the happy life, the infinite paradise. Be optimistic. The prophet was always optimistic."

  Here we have one of the most insane phenomenons of religious “reasoning” in full flight.
  These men spent the night praying to their imaginary God and as it turned out their prayers was really answered, their “act of faith” was a thundering success. In the mean time the God the Christian America spend so much time praying to, seemed to have been either sleeping or totally uninterested, or simply cooperating with the Muslim God.

  After this horrible event was a fact Christians keep on praying to this completely indifferent God for “help” with all kinds of things, a God who has yet again demonstrated his complete inability to help anyone with anything. How completely stupid can you get?
  How completely without any ability to reason do you have to be to be a true believer?

  Norm.
• 
  69

  Will YOU be the next dead American?

  by Nathan Natas in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i respectfully request that you take a few moments to read the following article, and i would appreciate hearing your responses.. - - - -.

  future widows of america: write your congressman.

  by ann coulter.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Norm

  Another right wing nutball?

  Norm
• 
  69

  Will YOU be the next dead American?

  by Nathan Natas in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i respectfully request that you take a few moments to read the following article, and i would appreciate hearing your responses.. - - - -.

  future widows of america: write your congressman.

  by ann coulter.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Norm

  Hi Abaddon,

  Among other things you said:

  How can you claim to have religious freedom if you deport Muslims regardless of evidence? How can you claim all are created equal when you suggest acting in a way which would deny that fact?

  Keep in mind that the American nation was founded by a bunch of slave owners who wanted so much to be "free",(curtecy of George Carlin). That freedom of course didn't apply to blacks and women, so why should it apply to Muslims?

  Norm
• 
  69

  Will YOU be the next dead American?

  by Nathan Natas in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i respectfully request that you take a few moments to read the following article, and i would appreciate hearing your responses.. - - - -.

  future widows of america: write your congressman.

  by ann coulter.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Norm

  I think ALL americans should go back were to where they came from.

  Then the Indians would get rid of all the terrorists that came and slaughtered them and took their land from them.

  Norm
• 
  20

  Special Meeting - New Work Announced

  by ozziepost in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  it is reported that a special meeting has been held of all the district overseers in the usa and the new york city circuit overseers at which it was announced that the field ministry would now be changed until further notice, effective immediately.

  for the time being no literature is to be offered or the suggested offer.

  the publishers are to advise each householder that due to recent events we are not engaging in our regular work, we are offering comfort where needed from the bible to help cope with the tragedy.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Norm

  If there is a new article on terrorism they will probably recycle some of the material from their last Awake!, article on Terrorism, which they published in 1987.

  Particularly tragic in all such Awake!, articles is that they end with the usual glossy assurances that “Jehovah” is going to “solve” all kinds of problems, like poverty, crime, unemployment and of course terrorism. What they always omit to tell their readers is HOW, Jehovah is going to do just that.

  But before we go there, take a look at this tragicomic statement in that article:

  *** g87 1/8 11-14 Terrorism-What Is the Answer? ***
  Terrorism—What Is the Answer?
  In his analysis of the problem, Professor Zoppo concludes: “Hardly a modern nation was born without terror.” That would seem to indicate that terror is an unavoidable ingredient of the political process. Yet we can affirm that there is one “nation” that has been formed without terror or violence—or political intervention. It is a nation numbering over three million, of peoples from all over the world, drawn from different cultures, languages, and religions. Who are they? The people who call on you with this magazine—Jehovah’s Witnesses.

  
  
  True to “tradition” the January 8. 1987 issue of the Awake!, ended with these words:

  *** g87 1/8 11-14 Terrorism-What Is the Answer? ***
  Terrorism—What Is the Answer?
  Yes, Jehovah’s Witnesses have risen above divisive politics and nationalism, which result in wars and terrorism. They now form a people living in genuine peace, and they are preparing for the time, very soon, when the earth will be ruled only by God’s Kingdom. That will not be brought about by world conversion but by a world cleansing at God’s war of Armageddon.—Matthew 24:37-39; Revelation 16:14, 16.

  Then, true peace and everlasting life will be the portion of the meek of the earth. (Titus 1:2; Revelation 21:3, 4) If you would like to know more about this Kingdom, where terrorism will be no more, please feel free to contact Jehovah’s Witnesses in your community or write to the publishers of this magazine in your country.

  As all of us who are familiar with what Jehovah's Witnesses real attitude know that the “kingdom” they keep hoping and praying for will be ushered in with the most horrific terrorist act in human history. The WTC horror, the holocaust, every horrible slaughter ever done by man, will pale into insignificance compared to the mass slaughter of 6 billion people! So yes, the make believe “kingdom” of the Watchtower Society, the “New World Society” will be formed on the ultimate terror act, the mother of all terrorist acts.

  But of course it is a very radical idea; it is in fact true that it will solve a lot of problems. There will of course be no poverty, unemployment, crime etc if you kill the entire population of poor, unemployed people etc. A few insane world leaders had the same idea but they weren’t efficient enough and didn’t live long enough to kill everybody. Of course killing all the smokers will end smoking immediately but very few sane people for obvious reasons consider it good solution.

  Jehovah's Witnesses however call this cataclysm which they look forward to with such joy, “Good News”!

  With a God like that it is of course no wonder that the only interest the Watchtower Society and Jehovah's Witnesses have in earthquakes and terrorist acts, is the number of casualties, the more the merrier, as such the WTC was an excellent “sign”, and many of those who were on the “fringes” of the Watchtower organization clamored “back” in case Jehovah had finally gotten his “finger out” and might finally consider proceeding with the much prayed for and hoped for big A.

  It is indeed sad, yes even tragic to behold such a spectacle of human beings being steeped in all kinds of superstition, hammered into them form early age. What is even more tragic is their total inability to break free from this insane pattern of such superstition, which will hold their minds imprisoned as long as they live.

  Norm.
• 
  21

  Farkel, here's that picture of "Will Smith...

  by Tallyman in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  farkel when you said that a picture of a watchtower portrayal.

  of d&d existed in one of their publications... just the other day.... of actor will smith (or someone looking exactly like him) existed,.

  and to let you know if i found it.... well, a compatriot in denmark scanned it and put it on his website.. look at lower right corner.. striking resemblance!.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Norm

  Well, the guy falling into the hole is a dead ringer for Kent, only a bit more handsome. The Guy with the gun looks a lot like yours truely

  Norm
• 
  9

  A False Sense of Security

  by Ranchette in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  if youre anything like me youve probably been trying to analyze your feelings over the last couple of weeks.it seems like im experiencing an ever-changing array of emotions!.

  its starting to come in on me that i had such a false sense of security and naivety .

  now when i look at our government i feel like ive been viewing them through the eyes of a child.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Norm

  Hi Pat,

  What really is needed is for the government to re-examine it's foreign policies to lessen the provocation of terrorism and for people to carry on with normal living.

  I fully agree with you here. It would be very wise to address the root of the problem. A good start would be telleing the Israelis to start respecting the UN resolutions and stop their illegal occupation of Palestinian land. So far it seems as though the US authroties are bent on creating even more enemies. Time will show.

  Norm.
• 
  17

  What about US terrorist groups?

  by tdogg in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  all of these speeches and tv specials with their analysts and experts but not once have i heard any mention of us terrorist groups.

  we are trying to attack the outside world and those who harbor terrorism but i ask: what is the difference between armed men in training camps training to kill with hateful prejudice in say, sudan and the same camps we harbor in say, idaho?

  yes, these places are for real and these people are only waiting for an opportunity to use their skills and weapons for their hateful fancies.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Norm

  Hi Crossroads,

  I think you got a point there. It makes all the differenece in the world who kills you. Christian fundy terrorists who talk to God on satelite phones is of course much to prefer over Muslim fundy terrorists.

  In the not so "good old days" people dressed in sheets with nice crosses on them roamed around in the south US hanging dark people all over the place. I don't know what they called it, but "terrorism" seem to be a very good word for it.

  Norm.
• 
  9

  A False Sense of Security

  by Ranchette in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  if youre anything like me youve probably been trying to analyze your feelings over the last couple of weeks.it seems like im experiencing an ever-changing array of emotions!.

  its starting to come in on me that i had such a false sense of security and naivety .

  now when i look at our government i feel like ive been viewing them through the eyes of a child.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Norm

  Hi Ranchette,

  I think that incident has very much done the same to many of us, even many who don't live in the US. Feeling unsecure is however something millions of people who are born in less fortunate countries experience as a daily phenomenon.

  The Afghan population have lived with it through over 20 years of war, and it wasn't a very safe place even before that. The Israelies, the Palestinians all live daily in fear of being blown to bits.

  People in Iraq are still living in fear of bombing. Imagine how the people in Hanoi felt when Uncle Sam was carpet bombing them.

  In spite of the horrible incident in America our western world still enjoy a peace and security which is a luxury to many people around the world.

  The only thing we in this part of the world can do about it is to remove the reasons people have, imagined or otherwise, to want to kill people like that.

  Imagine if the enormeous military resource of huge transport planes, ships and hardware could have been used to bring food, medicine and other necessities to the millions of Afghans that are facing starvation this winter.

  If it was used to help Pakistan, a very poor country with the two million Afghan refugees they have in their country, with 3 million more on the way.

  Wouldn't such an act help the Afghans and the rest of the muslim world to understand that the USA might not be the "great Satan" after all?

  Refugee camps are an excellent breeding ground for the kind of people that will strap bombs to themselves or fly planes into buildings. If the west doesn't get off their asses and doing something about the extreme and glaring differences in the use of resources in the world, it will get worse.

  I very much share your concern and feeling of uncertanity and I hope that our authorities will be able to do a better job at protecting us but I am afraid that if an individual or a group of people are determined enough it will be almost impossible to stop such tragedies to happen. Not unless we create a police state with security and identity check's all over the place, such systems has a tendency to develope into real nightmares.

  Becuse they would follow their own logic and pretty soon we would be monitored by cameras and bugging equipment in every home and everywhere etc. In many ways we are already on that road. All over the place there are governments who are reading this very post. Every E-mail we send is already being intercepted, our phones are or can be listned to at any time some government agency want to. But as you see that wasn't enough to prevent what happened. Many governments will now triple their efforts to monitor us all.

  Although many of us live lifes that stands very well up to scrutiny some of us might not like to be listened to on the toilet or in the bedroom. Personally I would pity anyone who have to monitor me, as they would no doubt be bored to death in a short time.

  Sorry about this, it turned into an endless rant.

  Take care,

  Norm