Posts by ThomasMore

22

The Rapture

by Sea Breeze in

when i was pioneering, i don't remember ever addressing the rapture question.

does anyone know how a jw would respond to this verse?

for the lord himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of god.

The JW answer was that it prophesied the resurrection of deceased anointed ones in 1918, all at once. However, they never addressed verse 17 with any finality which says "Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord."

They did offer that it 'could' be that the annointed still alive prior to Armageddon could be taken to heaven all at once, but they waffled back and forth as to when this might occur. While saying that all anointed would share in the battle of Armageddon as brothers of Christ, they later said that some could live through Armageddon and be taken afterward. Clearly, they have no insight on the matter, per their usual 'make it up as they go' method of muddling through scriptural explanations.

I recall some 'heavies' saying that that 1 Thess sounded like Christendom's version of the rapture, but they did not want to use the word. Typical WTC spin.

WTC also uses these verses as proof that Jesus is Michael the archangel.

I always found it puzzling that they claimed that the Kingdom was established in 1914, but had no officials other than Christ until 1918. Details, details - don't bother Watchtower with details.

51

Interesting that the other cult-cousins are going thru nearly identical hemmoraging of members.....

by WingCommander in

jw
friends

i still read on reddit.

(though no longer post) occasionally, i'll venture over to the ex-seventh day adventist (sda) sub and catch up a bit.

it's been a long time.

ThomasMore

dropoffyourkeylee - I think your points are all valid.

However, if WTC is banking on growth in Africa to save them, they are truly desperate. African publishers do not donate enough to offset the costs and risks of doing business there. Currently, WTC is not sending investment funds there as one might expect, given the interest being shown by the people.

Political tides turn quickly in most African nations. US based religions are seen by the governments as a drain on the nation, and are viewed with growing suspicion. Historically, moving money out of those countries back to the US has been problematic, placing the JW Branch personnel in those lands at risk of imprisonment and/or persecution.

African interest in the promise of paradise is to be expected. However, the cultures in those lands are not aligned with JWism at all. CSA, domestic violence, fraud and other practices are deeply rooted. Immigrants from African lands bring all those problems to the US where they manifest themselves in judicial hearings. I don't see any help for WTC coming as a result of interest on that continent - and I think WTC has serious doubts that growth there will ever be profitable.

36

Big News: August English Watchtower released on servers

by ukpimo in

big news.

just in from a friend who is fading.. disfellowshipping will no longer be a term used by jws.

study article 35, paragraph 4 footnote says this:.

ThomasMore

Well that settles it. I am going back!

12

The "Baby Boomers" are starting to die off, and the effects

by Captain Schmideo2 in

jw
friends

i was born in 1964, so, i was 10 when the buildup to 1975 was happening (and watched the subsequent failure of that).then, when i was a teenager, i got to see the fallour of the big apostacy events in the 1980s.during all of this, i was told by my parents and by people of my parents' peer group that "this old system won't last much longer, and won't the new system be great!

"it is now 2024. i am going to be 60 years old in a few months.

over half a century.my mom died two months after her 80th birthday last year, after suffering for years of chronic poor health (some of it brought on by a very sedentary lifestyle, but also plagued by emotional and mental issues and family drama which did not help overall.

ThomasMore

Vidiot describes WTC perfectly as trying to stop leaks in the dam with no hope of succeeding. Members watch and some still hang on.

I recall how some supporters of Bernie Madoff were unwilling to accept that he had duped them. Regulators finally arrested him but some investors were still supportive of his ponzi scheme.

WTC has run a multi-generational religious ponzi scheme for 145 years.

20

Jehovah's Witnesses and Watchtower provide Shelter and relief to poor of NYC...by leaving...

by Balaamsass2 in

after over 100 years...watchtower helps the poor of nyc...by leaving!!

jehovah's witnesses hotel becomes affordable housing.

developed by breaking ground, 90 sands brings new housing opportunities to brooklyn.. .

ThomasMore

It may be time for the AG to examine WTC's tax exempt status.

33

Stupid dumb ass changes yet blood and 1914 no change???wtfge???

by Witness 007 in

yeah wow women can finally wear pants and men beards...but 1914 is still a date not accepted since charles russell times and blood fractions are evil!!.

are they crazy!!!

!.

ThomasMore

Witness 007 - you could be right about the importance of 607 BCE and 1914 - it's hard to predict how indelibly indoctrinated people will react to fundamental changes. I suspect that nothing will shake most diehards since they feel that there is nowhere to go. WTC has demonized ALL other religions, and these diehards need something to believe in. The question is how many are there???

As for blood transfusions, Hospital Information Services (HIS) has softened over the years and HLCs are on a tighter leash than previously, but Sea Breeze makes a good case about their occasional need for martyrs. I am aware that HIS has waffled on hemoglobin containing products. Most HLC members don't even understand why hb is problematic for them, but HIS knows why.

As for 1914, it is laughable that they cling to a 120 year old pivot date. Some relatively recent changes are the understanding of when war broke out in heaven. Now they say "about 1914" because WW1 started in July but the Kingdom was not established until October (according to WTC). If Satan was ousted from the heavens when the Kingdom was established, he was late to the scene of WW1 which had been underway for 3 months. So, WTC amended the explanation to say that war in heaven happened BEFORE the Kingdom was established, giving Satan time to get tempers flaring on mother earth. Hmmmmmm......

607 BCE - WTC ignores the mounting evidence that it was 586-587 instead. I don't personally care, as the generation would be 100 years old still. Splane's nonsensical "overlapping generation" gymnastic exercise seems to be unraveling. It is seldom mentioned anymore. I know of not one single JW who can prove why it can be relied on.

Blondie is spot on with her side by side of what they have said and what they now "CLAIM" to have said. My question is: How did she create the side by side columns in this app????? Hats off to her !!!!!!!!

1925 - many IBSA left the organization when 1925 came and went without incident. Many left in 1975 as well. Again many left in 2014 when the 100 yr anniversary of the kingdom passed. Covid ended without the appearance of Armageddon and folks are still leaving/fading/DAing/ghosting meetings. The average age of JWs continues to climb. Young ones still leave when they are old enough to leave home. It's hard to deny that they are evaporating before our eyes, even if slowly.

48

Retirement Planning for ex-JW's

by Simon in

this is something i think about a lot, possibly because i'm just getting older.

it seems that not only should i finally one day decide what i want to do with my life, but i should also be planning for retirement.. hands up everyone who feels their future has been royally screwed by the wts experience?.

if you were a good jw and followed the wts advice you could well be finding yourself facing middle or even old age without much or anything put aside in retirement savings.

ThomasMore

My investment strategy changed with Covid. I did quite well in my 401k and still work. I am a stock picker but not a long time holder. I set limits and stops to take the emotion out of the decision.

When interest rates went up, I bought US Treasury Bills. I have averaged 5.3 percent and because of the way I spend, inflation has had little effect on my bottom line. i carry no debt.

One of my stocks jumped 14% today - I sold and patted myself on the back. Tomorrow I will search for another winner and keep all money invested. I also have some 6.1% ETF monthly dividend payers that maintain my principal investment. I watch them like a hawk in case they suddenly turn south. So far I am happy with the returns. They also grow a little each year.

I have not invested in high dividend funds since they usually distribute principal back - not a good thing. Text me if you want the tickers.

BTW - 3-6 month Treasury bills are the sweet spot. Do a ladder and reinvest the dividend as soon as they mature. If it’s good enough for Warren Buffett…

18

Another Sad Shunning due to homophobia by J.W's !!

by Phizzy in

.

ThomasMore

During my decades of being a JW, I didn’t dislike gay people. I still feel that way.

i think that people are more than their sexuality and it is their decision to make. Recently a gentleman I know told me (really out of the blue) that being gay has been the greatest challenge of his life - something he would never choose if it had been a choice.

Our conversation convinced me that it is better not to judge. The Bible does have a few things to say about various lifestyles, but it is speaking to each individual- not a religious police enforcer. Matt 7:1 seems to underscore that each person will answer to God - they will not answer to other men who are not qualified to read hearts. Personally I think God has more understanding than we give him credit for having.

19

Not only the ORG who perverts Scriptures!

by BoogerMan in

john 14:6 - "jesus said to him, “i am the way, the truth, and the life.

no one comes to the father except through me.".

certain christian denominations lie & contradict jesus' crystal clear statement, by promoting the following dogma:.

ThomasMore

Boogerman - sorry for deviating off topic. I was foaming at the mouth after reading 1 Tim and could not resist.

Are you saying that I should throw away my Mother Mary Lucky Astrology Mood Ring that I wear at Druid ceremonies?

153

When JW.org drops 607BCE...

by Nathan Natas in

probably everyone else thought of this long ago, but i, being an "independent thunker" thunk of it just a coupla weeks ago.. we all know that since the year zero (on the fredfranzian calendar) the wtb&ts has defied archaeology and insisted that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, even though the physical evidence shows that 587 bce is a more likely date.

in fact, the book "the gentile times reconsidered: have jehovah's witnesses been wrong all along about 607 bce?

" by carl olof jonsson and rud persson made this conversation public.. it is a difference of 20 years.

ThomasMore

Mike JW, I used to think as you do, but after sliming myself down from head to toe, I was able to think like WTC - here's what they may do to squirm out of this one:

The GB of modern day was not formed until 1976. They will say that IBSA and JWs were selected by God in 1919 but the GB was selected much later.

Enter Brother Thinker: "But that doesn't make sense to me."

WTC: "You are an apostate! You are DF'd!"

Brother Thinker: I was already DF'd for refusing to grow a beard so...."

WTC: "Then you are double-DF'd now and you will never be reinstated."

Brother Thinker: "I wasn't planning on ever coming back. I made millions on Nvidia and have a home in Costa Rica."

WTC: We might consider taking you back if you say you are repentant. How many millions did you make by the way?"