Posts by Scully

27

Do Elders Have A Reasonable Expectation Of Privacy During Judicial Committees?

by DT in

jw
friends

i should point out that i'm not a lawyer and i'm not qualified to give legal advice.. there has been much discussion about judicial committees lately and how to handle and possibly record them.. naturally, the question of the legality of recording judicial committees is a concern.

my understanding of the law in the u.s. is that it is legal to record private conversations in most states provided at least one party consents to the recording.

in the other states, it is required to get the consent of all parties to record a private conversation.. however, it would be reasonable to ask whether or not a judicial committee is a private conversation and whether the elders have a reasonable expectation of privacy.

Scully

The Constitution in Canada allows an individual the right to counsel in any judicial tribunal. Cults try to force you to waive that right by invoking rules that require you to submit to such meetings without representation or witnesses who can corroborate your version of events.

These judicial tribunals - especially ones like Judicial Committees™ - don't want someone there who can tell you that you are not required to answer such-and-such question or to protect your rights and freedoms. Their starting point is "You are accused of insert DFing offense hereand you are guilty until you prove your innocence."

In fact, you could very well be innocent, but you are becoming a problem, so we will intimidate you, humiliate you, compel you to answer questions about your underwear, and ultimately make you the subject of malicious gossip among the JWs, including your immediate family, your best friends and everyone you've ever known who is a JW.

47

DO THREE ELDER'S MEAN IT IS JUDICIAL?!?

by DATA-DOG in

i have a friend who met with a couple of elders recently and i was told things went well, no issues.

well a couple weeks later they stopped by my friends place, ( just to say hi ) right before they left they said, " hey can we meet again?

my friend said, " sure ".

Scully

Two Elders™ = two eyewitnesses

Three Elders™ = Judicial Committee™

Tell him to go with two or more other people, to even up the odds. If they say they want your friend, alone, your friend can counter with, "Hey, you led me to believe we were just having a friendly conversation. Why do you want to gang up on me? Why can't my friends participate?"

As long as your friend always brings other people to these "meetings", and insists on their participation, the Elders™ won't be able to gang up on him.

24

Why would you make an 83 yr old woman go out in service????

by loosie in

i am trying to contact my mothers elders in riverside ca, because my mother doesn't talk to her family.

since that means at least 12 phone calls to various kh's i thought i'd start with my aunt to see what the name of the congegation is.

unfortunatly she didn't know.

Scully

They need people like her so they can continue to browbeat the younger ablebodied JWs who aren't doing as much.

"Sister™ So-and-so is 83 years old. Sometimes she faints while she goes Door-To-Door™. She can't write anymore and has difficulty with conversation, but she Loves Jehovah™ so much that she is willing to overcome these obstacles to show her Faithfulness™. WTF is your problem?? Why can't you be like Sister™ So-and-so?? What prevents you??"

65

need your advice again, please

by outsmartthesystem in

jw
friends

so here's the latest in my pathetic saga.

i've tried to fly under the radar for the past year, but it isn't working so well.

i've learned not to engage my wife in debates but rather to ask questions.

Scully

Your fears for your children potentially becoming fully indoctrinated are justified. They're still young enough that if you provide true balance in their lives (extracurricular activities outside the JWs) that they could be reasoned with.

One of my favorite comparisons that my eldest understood right off the bat when we decided to leave the JWs, was talking about Santa Claus as if he were "pretend". A lot of people tell their kids that Santa Claus gives children whatever they wish for at Christmas, if they are good, but if they are bad he gives them a lump of coal. Children write letters to Santa asking for their special gifts. The parents peek at the letters and pretend to mail them to Santa, and then become "Santa's Helpers" and buy the gifts the children want. Santa is pretend, but parents want their children to be happy and believe in a benevolent stranger who loves them, when really it's the parents who love them so much.

Then we talked about Jehovah. He tells us to pray to him (make wishes) for the things we want. If we are obedient (good) apparently Jehovah will answer our prayers. If we disobey, he won't let us live in Paradise™/will destroy us at Armageddon™. He knows if you've been bad or good, and he's making a list and checking it twice. He even sends a man with an inkhorn to mark you in the forehead if you're good. He doesn't have a team of flying reindeer, but he does have a massive chariot in the sky with wheels that have eyes in them.

Do reindeers fly?

Do chariots fly in the sky? Do they have wheels with eyes in them?

Are they real or pretend?

That being said, it's still important for children to learn values of morality, justice, compassion, respect for others etc. You can foster those by volunteering with them - at a soup kitchen or food bank or helping a local family experiencing hard times. When they grow tired of toys or outgrow their clothes, teach them about sharing by giving those toys and clothes to a shelter or disaster relief center. While the WTS wants their focus to be on the WTS, help them expand their world view and your own by helping the less fortunate.

65

need your advice again, please

by outsmartthesystem in

jw
friends

so here's the latest in my pathetic saga.

i've tried to fly under the radar for the past year, but it isn't working so well.

i've learned not to engage my wife in debates but rather to ask questions.

Scully

Doesn't it bother your wife that women within the JWs are basically regarded as second class citizens?

Surely she realizes that she's got more brains in her pinky toe than most of the Elders™ she knows?

That is an angle that will appeal to her intellect, and it could rekindle her affections for you, if you support her growth as a spiritual person by asking her to help you research things.

Does she like to read? If she likes historical type novels, give her The Red Tent by Anita Diamant. It's the story of Jacob's daughter Dinah, written from her female perspective. It was one of the first novels I read when I was freshly out of the JWs, and it presented an alternate viewpoint considering the stories in the Bible were all male-centric.

Try to do some things with her - first on non-Meeting™ nights and then gradually introduce events on Meeting™ nights - that she's always wanted to do as a couple. Maybe take a cooking class or a wine making class together or ball room dancing. If she likes going to movies have her choose a movie that she likes one week and you choose one that she will like the next week. Find a nice park in your area and go for a picnic with her and the children. Go to a child-oriented museum. Really focus on your relationship as a couple and family togetherness. I can't stress enough how important it is to slip positive non-JW activities into your life NOW. The JWs will react with shock and horror that you aren't spending every waking moment studying your Watchtowers and going Door-to-Door™, and will start gossiping about your Worldly™ activities. Your wife will feel conflicted, because she knows that there's nothing wrong with those activities, and they will have a positive effect on your relationship and your family, while the Meetings™ and Field Service™ will only create tension and the feeling of being burdened. That's one thing that helped Mr Scully wake up and smell the coffee when I was ready to quit and he wasn't.

Slow down. Armageddon™ isn't coming. There's no rush to get her out immediately.

30

Why do so many major characters in the NT change their jewish name to a greek one ?

by mP in

cephas/simon -> peter.

saul -> paul.

jesus -> christ.

Scully

Did *they* change their names? Or did the people who wrote the Bible do it for them?

8

How did the jews know if a man was damaged ?

by mP in

.

deuteronomy 23:1he that is wounded in the stones, or hath his privy member cut off, shall not enter into the congregation of the lord.. .

how exactly did they know if one "stone" was damaged ?

Scully

Season 1 of The Borgias.

Borgia is elected to the papacy (Pope Alexander). Part of the ceremony features the introduction of a commode-type seat, where the candidate sits his bare bottom and an official reaches underneath from behind to check the dangly bits. Upon confirmation that the dangly bits are present (not a woman pretending to be a dude) and that they are intact, the ceremony continues.

Check it out on Showtime.

43

Anyone have a Kindle or a Nook?

by Simon in

i really don't like the ipad (or apple) but i think an ebook reader would be nice.

nothing made by sony though .... the amazon kindle and barnes & noble nook look to be the best (esp.

with the recent price reductions) but i'd like any insight from anyone who has one.

Scully

I have a Kobo that you can get at Chapters or Indigo here in Canada. There is quite a large selection of free e-books (mostly classics) available on the Chapters/Indigo website. To purchase e-books, you can either use your credit card on the website, or if a nice person gives you a Chapters/Indigo gift card, you can apply your purchase against the value of the gift card.

It has a slot for a microchip so you can store your PDFs on it for your e-reading pleasure. I use that feature for my reams of downloaded PDF knitting patterns - it's quite handy in that regard.

The battery charge lasts quite a while, and only takes a couple of hours to restore to 100% power. I also like that I can use the Kobo app on my iPhone if I don't want to cart the e-reader around. The app syncs the devices for you so that you can always pick up where you left off.

84

I wonder... Who are the top apostates the Watchtower HATES the most?

by Greybeard in

jw
friends

no doubt ray franz is at the top.... paul grundy's web site jwfacts.com helped me the most!

thanks paul!!!.

randall watters from freeminds.org has got to be way up there.... who else?

Scully

Does anyone know why these older links wont work HERE

The URLs are based on a previous version of the site. JWN doesn't use .ashx anymore.

8

What to tell your kids

by TheListener in

what did you tell your children about why you don't go to meetings anymore or aren't a witness?

especially if you have a witness spouse..

Scully

Mr Scully and I left together, although I pretty much got the ball rolling with research and questions. Our eldest was 8 years old, and the younger two were still in diapers. We sat down with the eldest and explained that it was important to own up to mistakes, no matter how old you are, and that we had made a mistake believing the JWs.

At first he was upset and asked if he could still go to the Meetings™ with Brother™ So-and-so. We explained that when he was older he could decide to be a JW if he still really wanted, but that now we were going to be a normal family like all the kids in school, and have birthday parties and Christmas and Easter and play sports and do fun things instead of going to Meetings™ all the time. He's never looked back.