Hey Jurs,
You mean he's.. ummmm.. Human after all :-)
wannahelp
JoinedPosts by wannahelp
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Dear Apostates, just suppose....
by TheApostleAK in...that the watchtower bible & tract society really is jehovah god's earthly organisation.... wouldn't that make you all "vessels made fit for destruction" (romans 9:22 - 24) by being opposers of jehovah god and his true organisation?.
just making this warning so you can't complain to jehovah god when his "fear-inspiring day" (joel 2:11) comes that you weren't told.. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------.
this message has been brought to you by the watchtower bible & tract society.
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Dear Apostates, just suppose....
by TheApostleAK in...that the watchtower bible & tract society really is jehovah god's earthly organisation.... wouldn't that make you all "vessels made fit for destruction" (romans 9:22 - 24) by being opposers of jehovah god and his true organisation?.
just making this warning so you can't complain to jehovah god when his "fear-inspiring day" (joel 2:11) comes that you weren't told.. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------.
this message has been brought to you by the watchtower bible & tract society.
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wannahelp
Just a few more comments to add to this thread:
Why would God need an organization full of fallable humans to spread his infallable word? I've always wondered about that? Can any JW answer that for me?
God always has called upon his people individually to use for his purposes (Moses, Noah, etc).. So, now why does he not speak directly to humans any longer, but only through a fallable group that is located in Ny, USA? More to the point, since he has always called upon his people, unless you show me proof that he no longer does that, my only conclusion is that he is still doing that. And if he still is calling upon individuals to use for his purposes, you and your organization have no knowledge of it because you are not his chosen people, and thus he doesn't call on any of you...
Finally, why does your organization act with such hypocrisy with reguards to their fallability? Anyone on the "outside" who asks a JW about errors the GB have made gets the standard response, "We are all humans, and thus fallable".. But, if anyone on the inside were to question any of those same errors, the GB threatens disfellowship.. Double standards? Doesn't Jehovah detest double standards, and hyposcrisy?
Oh, and just to add to KES152's comments: Here is James 3:13 - 3:18 from the Revised Standard Version of the bible (so we can read it in context)..
(13) Who is wise and understanding among you? By his good life let him show his works in the meekness of wisdom. (14) But if you have bitter jealousy and selfish ambition in your hearts, do not boast and be false to the truth. (15) This wisdom is not such as comes down from above, but is earthly, unspiritual, devilish. (16) For where jealousy and selfish ambition exist, there will be disorder and every vile practice. (17) But the wisdom from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, open to reason, full of mercy and good fruits, without uncertainty or insincerity. (18) And the harvest of righteousness is sown in peace by those who make peace.
The answer I always get from JW's about the GB's false prophocies is "they are human, and thus fallable, and in their eagerness for Jehovah to bring in the new system of things, they predicted dates that turned out to be incorrect." -- their Eagerness = self Ambition = "earthly wisdom" = disorder and every vile practice...
I'd also like to see just one JW that was open to reason, let alone a "meek" elder...!!!!
Of course, even though you say you go by the bible and bible alone, when presented evidence contrary to the GB, you will ignore the bible and side with the GB.. Just remember, when your judgement day comes, and you are asked for a perosnal account of your actions, remember that the lord gave you many opportunties to see the error's, but you chose to ignore them..
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PEDOPHILE UPDATE
by Amazing ina while back i posted about my son-in-law's jw dad getting arrested and charged with molesting a minor girl, and the subsequent death by suicide of his dad's father.
his dad was reproved by the elders who found him 'repentant' by jw standards.
but, behind the man actually blames the 'girl' for what happened.
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wannahelp
Does anyone know when the dateline story is going to air?
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Dear Apostates, just suppose....
by TheApostleAK in...that the watchtower bible & tract society really is jehovah god's earthly organisation.... wouldn't that make you all "vessels made fit for destruction" (romans 9:22 - 24) by being opposers of jehovah god and his true organisation?.
just making this warning so you can't complain to jehovah god when his "fear-inspiring day" (joel 2:11) comes that you weren't told.. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------.
this message has been brought to you by the watchtower bible & tract society.
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wannahelp
Hi ApostleAK,
Just had to respond here on this thread..
Doesn't it state in the bible that you are personally accountable to God/Jesus on Judgement day?
Are you being personally responsible, or are you allowing the men in Brooklyn to be responsible for you? And what if they are wrong?
If you are an active witness, you must go door knocking.. And if you do, I'm sure you've heard of some of the error's the GB have made in the past..
Just suppose for a second that you are worng, and that your organization is NOT the truth.. I wonder what you will say when asked on Judgement day, "You were given ample reason to at least question your religion, yet you choose to keep a blind eye, and give up your personal responsibilty to some group of men who call themselves the GB. People I don't even know, and I don't know you either.. I sent you many warnings.. Every person that brought up questions in your field service were sent by me so you would open your mind, and begin thinking for yourself.. But you dutifully ignored all my attempts to reach you.. Get away from me"
Hmm, ever given that some thought AK?
And remember, I'm not an apostate.. I believe in god, and I've never been a JW (Baptized or not)!!! I'm sure the GB will come up with a term for me, if there isn't already one, however!!!
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JEHOVAH HAS NO ORGANIZATION
by Amazing inthe resident jws who post here and of course the jws around the world all feel that god has an organization and that they are it.
further, they ask 'where else would you go' if you talk about leaving their organizaton.
the jws talk about the organization in such terms as "it's the truth," or "wait on the organization," or "don't run ahead of the organization" as though god's divine name were really organization.. here is something that jws, and maybe some ex-jws need to understand: god (whether you call him jehovah, yahweh, jesus, buddah, allah, or any other fine name does not have any organization in heaven or on earth.
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wannahelp
Just wanted to add my 2 cents to this thread.. First, I've never formally introduced myself.. I've never been a JW, however, I became interested in learning about the religion because I have a friend who is, and I want to help him in any way I can..
That being said, Amazing, I agree 1000% with your comments... Personally, I've always believed in god, but I have never joined any religion because I feel as soon as you join any organized religion, you start to lose sight of god... It's a personal relationship with God, and putting any man inbetween you and god is only seperating that relationship, not fostering it to grow..
ApostleAK, I have to make a few comments to you also:
I've seen first hand from my friend the JW version of love and friendship.. As he himself has said, everything is "To a point"... It's not unconditional love and friendship, but love and friendship based solely on your acceptance to an organization and it's man-made doctrines.
You claim rightouesness as the "truth", yet, you miss the very point of the bible itself.. LOVE and undeserved-kindness...
I often wonder if Jesus believed as you did, what he would have said to the executioners when up on the cross (or torture stake, doesn't really matter).. Instead of, "Father, forgive them for they know not what they do" it might have sounded something like, "Father, cut these ones off from the truth, for they have rebelled against your son, and your earthly organization that I have established".. I cannot think of a reason that could be more compelling to label the people that were involved in Jesus' execution as Apostates, yet Jesus himself didn't show any hatred or malice towards them.. Instead, he showed them true undeserved kindness and love!!! Your organization, on the other hand, has labeled people apostates because (gasp) they have dared to question things like the 1975 armageddon date, and were not in harmony with the rest of the congregation. And, of course, after 1975 came and went, did they get an apology and re-instated as JW's. No, because they didn't submit to the authority, the fallable men in Brooklyn, as it were... I wonder what Jesus would say about that?
Anyway, your organization claims love, but it certainly isn't the love that the bible and Jesus preach...
Instead, your organization uses conditional love and friendship as a fear tactic to keep it's members in line.. If you dare to question the GB decisions, you risk much, including having all the love and friendship you think you have in this world taken from you..
I'm sorry AK, but that's not love.. That's bondage!!!!
The word organization is NOT in the bible, precisely because to even think about needing an organization to be close to god is missing the whole point!!!!
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HOW DO PEOPLE GET OUT OF RELIGIOUS CULTS?
by Jang inrecovery from mind control .
how do people get out of religious cults?.
different people leave in different ways.
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wannahelp
Wow!
Thanks JanG for the information.. I'm not nor have I ever been a JW, but I have a good friend that is one, and it breaks my heart to see him being controlled without his own conscious knowledge!!!
Read my "Want to help my JW friend" thread for more info...
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Want to help my JW friend
by wannahelp ini'm new here, and i want to make it clear upfront that i am not, nor have i ever been a jw.
in fact, until recently i didn't know much about jw's.
but i do have a question that i hope both jw's and ex-jw's will try and answer for me... about 10 months ago, i hired a 20 year old to work for me.. i hired him because he seemed very loyal, ethical, sincere, hardworking and honest.
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wannahelp
I thought of that one actually.. He and I agreed that I did not fire him, nor did he quit.. It was a mutual agreement beneficial for both of us...
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Want to help my JW friend
by wannahelp ini'm new here, and i want to make it clear upfront that i am not, nor have i ever been a jw.
in fact, until recently i didn't know much about jw's.
but i do have a question that i hope both jw's and ex-jw's will try and answer for me... about 10 months ago, i hired a 20 year old to work for me.. i hired him because he seemed very loyal, ethical, sincere, hardworking and honest.
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wannahelp
Thank you Thinker for your comments...!!!
I stopped by to see him today... He is very interested in getting a new job, since he currently only works part time.. He needs more money.. I asked him if that was because he needs to be able to provide for his future wife (Who BTW wants to be a full time pioneer!). His response is that he could get married without a good job.. I quipped 'Would her father approve', and his answer was a resounding no!
Does anyone know what he is talking about with levels of dating?
He said to me there are 6 levels to dating, and he is on level #1.. When I asked him to explain it to me, he said when I figure it out I'll let you know!!!
He is also spending lots of time over her house (Keeps telling me how he's over there until 2-3 in the morning)...
If he can truly be happy as a JW and get married and have a 'normal' marriage and a life long partner, I certainly don't want to interfere with that, but then again, something in me says that is going to be a stretch to say the least.. In all the time I've known him, he's never seemed happy to me yet, and even now that he's started to day, I still don't see him overly happy.. It appears that everything he does is out of "duty" and not from his heart!!!
I'm listening to every post made here, as I'm trying to get a handle on this one as best as I can (being an outsider)..
He has made it very clear to me that he is 'opening up' his feelings to me, but I wonder if that is a genuine thought, or if he is just trying to manipulate me into me offering him a job again.. I haven't yet because I told him even though I love him unconditionally and think of him as a good friend, the fact that he may be unable to reciprocate those feelings towards me will only cause friction on a daily basis, and I don't think it's fair for that to occur!!!
Of course, he then goes into the "We can be friends, to a point".. And I quip that I don't understand conditional friendship or love, please try to explain to me how conditional love and friendship will make me feel accepted no matter what decisions I make in my life..
I usually get a, "You just don't understand"....
I know that JW's are taught "Theocratic War Strategy"... Does that also include manipulation to get what they want??
Thanks for all the responses everyone!!! keep 'em coming, and I'll be keeping you all posted on the events..
Oh, one last comment Thinker.. I keep harping on the fact with him, "I encourage you to date and get married, if that is indeed what you want!!!!" I remind him at every turn that if this is NOT what he feels in his heart, then he should examine his heart and find out what's the issue!!!
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History of Wedding Ring
by wannahelp inhmm,.
while searching the internet today i found this websit.
<a> http://www.prime.org/chalfant/rings.html.
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wannahelp
You'll be the first to know after me :-)
And I'll show him the actual printed pages from the website...
Tune in Wednesday evening to find out how the JW responds to a pagan tradition exposed in their religion..
Gee, I wonder if I can somehow contact the GB and let them know of it's pagan origin.. Maybe they'll appreciatie the info, change the doctrine, and appoint me an honory annointed class person :-) (Ok, sorry, forgot who I was dealing with for a sec <G>)
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Want to help my JW friend
by wannahelp ini'm new here, and i want to make it clear upfront that i am not, nor have i ever been a jw.
in fact, until recently i didn't know much about jw's.
but i do have a question that i hope both jw's and ex-jw's will try and answer for me... about 10 months ago, i hired a 20 year old to work for me.. i hired him because he seemed very loyal, ethical, sincere, hardworking and honest.
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wannahelp
Thanks for the reply Preston!!!
It is an interesting perspective on the issue, but I'm very glad you said it..
Interesting to note, my friend on a few occasions has said to me, "I've often wondered who would show up for my funeral"...
With everything that I'm reading from all the posts by you people, I think my friend may have or maybe still is wondering what it's like on the outside..
He's re-itterated to me on many occasions that he doesn't understand my unconditional love and friendship.
I also believe that he has tested that love and friendship on many occasions, and obviously he is still here...
On one specific instance, he said to me, "What do I have to do, kill your dog so you'll get mad at me? -- My response was, If you do it un-purpose I wonder if god would view that as a sin, but I will forgive you because I love you, you are my friend, and I have no right to judge your sins anyway. I will still help you in any way I can"...
Talk about a look on his face when I said that!!! It startled him to say the least!!!
Again, thanks for the comments!!!