Posts by FreeWilly

All I can say is thank God it was the US involved in the Cold War and not some of these wishy washy victim nations. Saddam is playing the UN like a rope-a-dope. The number one risk of continued inspections is that Saddam submits to the minimun cooperation required and is allowed to stay in power! The US has been down this road before.

Why do so many want to keep a murderous tyrant in power over innocent millions? Have a little compassion!! The Iraqi people deserve liberation and criminals deserve to go to jail. He gassed the Iranians, He's gassed his own Kurds, He attacked all his neighbors and has a documented history of torture, rape and murder or Iraqi civilians. He produced enough Chemical and Biological weapons to destroy EVERY PERSON ON EARTH 3x over. The UN estimates they destroyed only 60% of it before getting KICKED OUT in 1998.

There are only certain conditions that should delay justice.

1) all mobile launches must be assembled and destroyed.

2) all mobile weapons labs must be assembled and destroyed.

3) all WMD must be revealed instantly (not "found" by inspectors).

4) Saddam and company must submit to a court of inquiry for his previous crimes against humanity.

5) democratic elections must be held by the end of the year.

Anything else is just plain cruel to the innocent people his is allowed to terrorize daily.

Who's gonna call the US 'arrogant' when video footage reveals the fullest extent of Saddams secret military programs? I hope France and Germany stand firm against the US and DO NOT participate. How foolish they will look when TONS of Anthrax, VX and Biologicals are revealed before the world audience. Just think of all those images that are certain to come soon. How embarrassing it will be.

So were you folks the same ones calling for 'Diplomacy' with the Taliban regime? If so aren't you a little embarrased about that??

Back2dafront: " how are they going to actively develop these weapons under the noses of inspectors, troops and spy planes? ANSWER THE QUESTION PLEASE!!! "

I tend to agree with you, but occupation (i.e. troops in Iraq) is not being advocated by the UN. Essentially this plan is exactly what the US wants. Troops, inspectors supervising and monitoring the disarmorment, and taking Saddam into custody to face the allegations of torture geonocide etc. You really are advocating the same thing as the US. However one needs to ask, if its clear you can't get unanimous concurrance by world community, do you capitulate? - or do you do the right thing regardless of unanimous sentiment?

Edited by - Freewilly on 10 February 2003 4:55:5

97

What if the US loses?

by Robdar in

jw
friends

what if we lose the war with iraq?

i watch the news and all commentators act as if our winning is a given.

yes, we are the biggest, baddest nation; we have the nukes, but what if?

FreeWilly

I agree with Czar

Saddam's a criminal - apprehend him and kill/try him. Its really that simple folks. Nobody is going to risk their necks for Saddam. He has waged war on all his neighbors. They don't like him either. The Iraqi people want liberation too.

War is not pleasant, however it has a proven history of dealing effectively with tyrants.

Edited by - Freewilly on 10 February 2003 0:24:36

97

What if the US loses?

by Robdar in

jw
friends

what if we lose the war with iraq?

i watch the news and all commentators act as if our winning is a given.

yes, we are the biggest, baddest nation; we have the nukes, but what if?

FreeWilly

espresso,

"It is the UN security council's job to enforce compliance"

That's true..... So now I guess you realize how gutless the UN has been without the US insisting on compliance - right? The UN was content to let the whole matter slide into the background. What did it take to get Saddam to allow inspectors back - the UN??? Hardly. Saddam took a calculated risk when he kicked the UN inspectors out in 1998. He speculated that the UN was weak and indecisive. He was right! He kicked the UN inspectors out while the UN looked the other way. That is, until the UN,UK,etc stepped back into the game. It was the iminent threat of invasion by US, UK (and the Aussies to!) - NOT the pitiful UN.

I don't know about you, but I'm not gonna hold my breath for the UN to do anything meaningful. Without the insistance of the US and her allies, Saddam would be threatening the world right now with his nukes. Thats a fact!.

Edited by - Freewilly on 9 February 2003 4:40:2

97

What if the US loses?

by Robdar in

jw
friends

what if we lose the war with iraq?

i watch the news and all commentators act as if our winning is a given.

yes, we are the biggest, baddest nation; we have the nukes, but what if?

FreeWilly

Expresso,

"the rest of the world has been busy doing what they can "

That's true, when the inspection program was in place many countries contributed. However, when in 1998, Saddam kicked them out, no one stepped up to the plate to insist on compliance. Now that the US and allies have threated Iraq - poof - they are back in there. People can say what they want about the US, but the US and its close allies have shelled out $$BILLIONS$$ to keep the world safer. Those who advocate concession to Saddam would create a world where dictators could wipe out their families in the future.

Saddam's a criminal - just like Slobedon Melosovich. He needs to be apprehended and tried for war crimes even if it requires force. The Iraqi people deserve peace, not Saddam.

97

What if the US loses?

by Robdar in

jw
friends

what if we lose the war with iraq?

i watch the news and all commentators act as if our winning is a given.

yes, we are the biggest, baddest nation; we have the nukes, but what if?

FreeWilly

It is true that many others do not like the US... at least the fact that the US is the last remaining superpower and leads the world in technology and economy. I would venture to say that ANY country in this position would face some sort of resentment and criticism from the rest of the world. Yes the US does carry tremendous influence (due to the above factors) around the world and that is another source of complaint.

But I think everyone should keep in mind that WHAT the US advocates is freedom and free markets economies and democratic societies. The fact that 'Western' stores in Iran can't keep up with the demand is NOT due to US bullying their way in. Its Supply and Demand - the people like/want it. The fact that Arab countries aligned with the US hold elections is NOT sticking our necks into affairs that don't concern us - they are basic human rights. The world could be speaking Russian were it not for the US and its allies cooperating to dislodge the USSR. Today though we have the luxury to say in retrospect that this was "sticking our heads in other people's business". Let me just say that if you were around when Communism threatened to encapsulate the world, you would have no compunction against those who were trying to prevent it.

Now the 'world' opinion is for the most part with the US. There are some notable, vocal opposes, but there is a significant contingent that agree that Saddam and other Despots should not be allowed to threaten humanity.

This being said though......"The World" community DID NOTHING for the past 12 years to dissuade Iraq from furthering his adgenda. What makes anyone think that further apathy toward Iraq will achieve any results in Iraq or elsewhere? There is tremendous outcry from a vocal few who clammor for continued inspections. EVERYONE in the world community has been content to let Saddam go his merry way before now. The fact that there are inspectors even in the country are due ENTIRELY to the threat of the US and UK.

Some think the US is sticking its head where it doesn't belong when it comes to the Mid east. Perhaps this is true. Why? Because Muslim countries want to "drive Israel" into the sea. They want to exterminate a whole race of people due to religious intolerance. The US has been pivotal in preventing this from happeneing. Lets not forget people that the reason Israel had to establish a state in the Mideast to begin with is because "the world community" would not accept jewish refugees into their countries after WW2. Muslim countries biggest beef with the US is their support for Israel. Yes without this support Irael could fall more easily to them. Iraq would love to lead that charge too. It seems that many in peace advocates would be content to let that happen.

I think many of those who are willing to let things slide in Iraq would be future victims and conquests were it not for the US/UK and other allies making the tough decisions for them.

Everone wants peace. Sometimes it means forcibly apprehending criminals like Saddam. Oh, and BTW the Drudge report had an good article about an interview with a recent Iraqi defector. He contends that the Iraqi populace is welcoming this war! In his words "we (Iraqi people) are victims of all of this too"

45

Getting over the "Imperfect Org" defe...

by confuzcious in

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hey guys,.

i was wondering if you have a response when you present stuff about pedo, un, rutherford, etc, and a jw says, "well they are imperfect people.. the last respons i got was, only jesus was ever the perfect channel of god - which of course i agree.. but it's like if you ever bring up anything about anything, the stock response is, "we'll it's an imperfect organization.... your response???.

FreeWilly

Jac,

I agree with Mulan, Dont get the Elders involved. Discuss things with your husband privately. If the Elders get suspicious they could pressure your husband and come between you two. Be careful! Heck tell them your fighting depression and its not a good time right now.

23

Need help - what is the truth...

by confuzcious in

hey guys,.

i am a witness that is no longer going to meetings.. but i tell you what, i'm scared to death.. i'm really "limping on two decisions.".

what would you guys say is the one "scriptural" reason why you left the truth.. thanks.. gene.

FreeWilly

Confuzcious,

I too have served in many capacitites, Bethel, Pioneering, International, MS etc. Take a deep breath! You are not a stupid person. Use your head and think logically...rationally. Right about now you are feeling all of the mind triggers the "truth" has taught you to fear. You fear that you are falling prey to apostasy. You feel you might be decieving yourself. You feel like you might be betraying Jehovah. All I can say is take your time and examine what you believe. The Bible COMMANDS you to "test yourself to see that you are in the faith".

Nobody here is trying to trick you.

Email me if you want. [email protected]

36

I have been challenged

by SpiceItUp in

jw
friends

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my father has told me that if i can disprove the bible on any point he will discontinue beliveing in it.. i will be the first to admit that bible theology is not my strong point so i need any help that i can get.. thanks in advance

FreeWilly

I read a web site that had some statistics on the Ark vs the # of insects, birds, animals etc. Basically, just the species of insects could not fit into the dimensions described in Gen 6